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Old 02-10-2013, 11:54 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Bobjoefredsky View Post
Here they are

Attachment 147770
Are those eggs in the bottom?

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Old 02-11-2013, 12:37 AM   #22
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Are those eggs in the bottom?
Hard to tell from the pic. The eggs are very small and clear. He fry are small as well. They will make their way out of the breeder unless you cover up the slots.
If you choose to raise them in the breeder then you can try this: Remove the eggs and temporarily place them in a cup or other container. Remove the horizontal grid that the eggs dropped through. Take an HOB filter cartridge and remove the fibrous pad. Cut two pieces to the size of the inside diameter of the breeder (be a little generous with the size). The pads will not stay put; I got creative and took 2 slender wooden shish kabob sticks, snapped them in half and placed them criss cross next to the side walls to hold the pads in place. Note the water flow is not optimal and you should remove the waste before it builds up.

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Old 02-11-2013, 08:05 AM   #23
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No sorry for the misunderstanding they did not end up breeding so I'm going to move about 4 of them to my 10 gallon and push a grate between the middle
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Old 02-13-2013, 11:00 PM   #24
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WOW, I'm honored Fresh2o. Thanks

If you intend to remove the parents after the spawn, I'd suggest going to your local Toys R Us and get bags of marbles and forget about the grating. Use just about 2" of water above the marbles so the eggs don't have a long time or distance to travel to get between the marbles. The parents won't be able to get to the eggs this way either. Once you remove the parents, you can SLOWLY start adding small amounts of water daily until the water is high enough for the sponge filter to work properly. By that time the eggs should have hatched and the fry will be free swimming soon.

Feel free to PM me if you need more instructions
I don't want to replace the substrate with marbles, as I love my gravel and I plan on continuing to use the tank for small guppies or some sort. Maybe I can add marbles on top of the gravel?
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Old 02-13-2013, 11:10 PM   #25
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I don't want to replace the substrate with marbles, as I love my gravel and I plan on continuing to use the tank for small guppies or some sort. Maybe I can add marbles on top of the gravel?
Sure you can. The object is to get the eggs away from the parents. HOWEVER, since you won't be able to see the eggs on the bottom of the tank, how do expect to monitor their growth? You won't know when they hatch. You won't know when to start feeding them. You won't know when to expect them to start free swimming. You won't be able to make sure the fry are getting fed as the food will most likely hide in the gravel. You won't know a whole heck of a lot.
If I may, I'd suggest you just use a bare tank with the marbles and once the fry are big enough to be put elsewhere, then you can restart this tank with the gravel for your Guppies or whatever.
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Old 02-13-2013, 11:21 PM   #26
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Sure you can. The object is to get the eggs away from the parents. HOWEVER, since you won't be able to see the eggs on the bottom of the tank, how do expect to monitor their growth? You won't know when they hatch. You won't know when to start feeding them. You won't know when to expect them to start free swimming. You won't be able to make sure the fry are getting fed as the food will most likely hide in the gravel. You won't know a whole heck of a lot.
If I may, I'd suggest you just use a bare tank with the marbles and once the fry are big enough to be put elsewhere, then you can restart this tank with the gravel for your Guppies or whatever.
On a side note how do I know when ZD are ready to breed/spawn? Once I see a female gettjng fat do I just put her with a male in a different tank? I get the concept of using marbles and procedure for after the egg laying but Im more curious as to when I can put a pair in a seperate tank.
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Old 02-13-2013, 11:34 PM   #27
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On a side note how do I know when ZD are ready to breed/spawn? Once I see a female gettjng fat do I just put her with a male in a different tank? I get the concept of using marbles and procedure for after the egg laying but Im more curious as to when I can put a pair in a seperate tank.
To help expedite a spawning, I used to separate the females from the males for about a week or so. During this time, they were fed higher protein based foods to help them develope more eggs and stronger sperm. After the week or so, the females would be full with eggs so they would be ready to spawn. (The way I could tell was not when the females were getting fat but when they stopped getting fatter. That's a sign they are ready!!!)

Since they were separated from the males, the instinct to breed is stronger now that the male is present. The fish don't want to waste an opportunity Just remember, by keeping the sexes separated for breeding, the breeding would happen faster. By keeping the fish together all the time, there is no urgency. That's why my breeders were my breeders and my show fish were my show fish and not my breeders.

I hope this helps
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Old 02-13-2013, 11:41 PM   #28
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To help expedite a spawning, I used to separate the females from the males for about a week or so. During this time, they were fed higher protein based foods to help them develope more eggs and stronger sperm. After the week or so, the females would be full with eggs so they would be ready to spawn. (The way I could tell was not when the females were getting fat but when they stopped getting fatter. That's a sign they are ready!!!)

Since they were separated from the males, the instinct to breed is stronger now that the male is present. The fish don't want to waste an opportunity Just remember, by keeping the sexes separated for breeding, the breeding would happen faster. By keeping the fish together all the time, there is no urgency. That's why my breeders were my breeders and my show fish were my show fish and not my breeders.

I hope this helps
Okay makes sense! Will try that soon thanks for the help.

Ill post a picture once she is fat
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:29 AM   #29
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Sure you can. The object is to get the eggs away from the parents. HOWEVER, since you won't be able to see the eggs on the bottom of the tank, how do expect to monitor their growth? You won't know when they hatch. You won't know when to start feeding them. You won't know when to expect them to start free swimming. You won't be able to make sure the fry are getting fed as the food will most likely hide in the gravel. You won't know a whole heck of a lot.
If I may, I'd suggest you just use a bare tank with the marbles and once the fry are big enough to be put elsewhere, then you can restart this tank with the gravel for your Guppies or whatever.
Ok well I have no space for another tank or the money I am a teenager and my parents don't spoil me like the other kids, I have to pay for almost everything recreational that I own
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Old 02-14-2013, 07:30 AM   #30
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Sure you can. The object is to get the eggs away from the parents. HOWEVER, since you won't be able to see the eggs on the bottom of the tank, how do expect to monitor their growth? You won't know when they hatch. You won't know when to start feeding them. You won't know when to expect them to start free swimming. You won't be able to make sure the fry are getting fed as the food will most likely hide in the gravel. You won't know a whole heck of a lot.
If I may, I'd suggest you just use a bare tank with the marbles and once the fry are big enough to be put elsewhere, then you can restart this tank with the gravel for your Guppies or whatever.
It's the main reason why I want to breed fish is to get money, since in NYC it's almost impossible to get a job at my age. I'm not asking to spend any more money, it took me a few years worth just to get my tanks
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:04 AM   #31
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Ok well I have no space for another tank or the money I am a teenager and my parents don't spoil me like the other kids, I have to pay for almost everything recreational that I own

Well then, you have found the right person in me I was only 7 years old when I started keeping fish and almost all of my aquarium things were hand me downs. It wasn't until I started breeding fish that I had the money to buy my own things. (We on the same page yet? ) What I had to do was create usable things to breed my fish from other things, on the cheap. Now, open your mind and think about the possibilities.
First thing you need to determin is if you really want to breed Zebras or raise Guppy fry as a starter. Both fry do not need gravel in their tanks BTW. The gravel is for your entertainment more than these fish's. Spend your money on sponge filters instead of gravel. They will do you much more good than gravel will.
In Walmarts or Dollar stores, they sell plastic shoe boxes. ( My Dollar store sells them for $1.00 with a lid) If you have 2 available tanks, separate the sexes and condition them. When they are conditioned, use a plastic shoe box with a layer of marbles and no more than 2" of new, conditioned water above the marbles. ( Do not use the existing tank water from the parents. Make new water.) You will only need an airstone for aeration and water movement. No filter. When the breeders are ready, just before lights out, acclimate them into the shoe box and put the cover on the box. (Cut away a small corner of the lid so the airline tubing can fit through it.) Make sure you put the shoe box near some external lighting as the lid will make it dark inside. Usually, by the next morning, the fish will have spawned. (If not, you can leave them in this setup for up to 3 days while you wait. Do not feed the fish if you have to leave them in the box.) Remove the parents and just leave the shoe box as is until you see the fry free swimming. At this point, you will need to remove the marbles and replace the airstone with the smallest (cheapest) sponge filter you can find. ( You will most likely need to cut down the spout on the filter so that it is below the lip of the shoe box unless you get one that can be layed down in the box. ) Once the fry are free swimming, you can start feeding them infusoria. About every other day, you will need to do a partial water change so make sure you have some water already standing by. After about a week of feeding, you should see your fry all swimming together in the box. Once they start doing this, you can transfer them into the tank you were going to use for the fry. (Take out any adult fish if they are still in there. ) Once the fry get to the size where you can see that they are Zebra Danios, you then need to move them into a larger space to grow out. LARGER TANKS? NO! Larger SPACE I've used everything from rubbermaid tubs to 5' diameter kiddy pools that I got at Toys R Us for $10 to grow out fish. They just need sponge filters to keep them going and a submersible heater if the temps is a problem. These are cheap enough to buy and perfect for a tiny budget. Once the fry are big enough to not get eaten by the adult fish, you can transfer them into your main tank until they are large enough to sell unless you have another larger empty tank. This is about the cheapest way you can raise these fish.

I was raised on needing to be inventive which is why I use so many different things to raise my fish. You just need clean water and good filtration to raise fish. Nobody said the aquarium had to be made of glass or plexiglass Keep in mind that raising fish for money is not always pretty. Pretty is for your show tanks and pretty costs money. My way makes money, not spend it

There's an old addage that goes, " Where there is a will, there's a way." I just gave you the way. You need to supply the will

Feel free to PM me if you have any other questions. I'm always glad to help.
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Old 02-15-2013, 07:15 AM   #32
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Awesome (and detailed) response. Hope this inspires others.
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Old 02-15-2013, 12:02 PM   #33
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Awesome (and detailed) response. Hope this inspires others.
Thanks. I hope so too. I know what it's like to want to breed fish but not have enough tanks or money. I just became inventive So can others.
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:36 PM   #34
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Well then, you have found the right person in me I was only 7 years old when I started keeping fish and almost all of my aquarium things were hand me downs. It wasn't until I started breeding fish that I had the money to buy my own things. (We on the same page yet? ) What I had to do was create usable things to breed my fish from other things, on the cheap. Now, open your mind and think about the possibilities.
First thing you need to determin is if you really want to breed Zebras or raise Guppy fry as a starter. Both fry do not need gravel in their tanks BTW. The gravel is for your entertainment more than these fish's. Spend your money on sponge filters instead of gravel. They will do you much more good than gravel will.
In Walmarts or Dollar stores, they sell plastic shoe boxes. ( My Dollar store sells them for $1.00 with a lid) If you have 2 available tanks, separate the sexes and condition them. When they are conditioned, use a plastic shoe box with a layer of marbles and no more than 2" of new, conditioned water above the marbles. ( Do not use the existing tank water from the parents. Make new water.) You will only need an airstone for aeration and water movement. No filter. When the breeders are ready, just before lights out, acclimate them into the shoe box and put the cover on the box. (Cut away a small corner of the lid so the airline tubing can fit through it.) Make sure you put the shoe box near some external lighting as the lid will make it dark inside. Usually, by the next morning, the fish will have spawned. (If not, you can leave them in this setup for up to 3 days while you wait. Do not feed the fish if you have to leave them in the box.) Remove the parents and just leave the shoe box as is until you see the fry free swimming. At this point, you will need to remove the marbles and replace the airstone with the smallest (cheapest) sponge filter you can find. ( You will most likely need to cut down the spout on the filter so that it is below the lip of the shoe box unless you get one that can be layed down in the box. ) Once the fry are free swimming, you can start feeding them infusoria. About every other day, you will need to do a partial water change so make sure you have some water already standing by. After about a week of feeding, you should see your fry all swimming together in the box. Once they start doing this, you can transfer them into the tank you were going to use for the fry. (Take out any adult fish if they are still in there. ) Once the fry get to the size where you can see that they are Zebra Danios, you then need to move them into a larger space to grow out. LARGER TANKS? NO! Larger SPACE I've used everything from rubbermaid tubs to 5' diameter kiddy pools that I got at Toys R Us for $10 to grow out fish. They just need sponge filters to keep them going and a submersible heater if the temps is a problem. These are cheap enough to buy and perfect for a tiny budget. Once the fry are big enough to not get eaten by the adult fish, you can transfer them into your main tank until they are large enough to sell unless you have another larger empty tank. This is about the cheapest way you can raise these fish.

I was raised on needing to be inventive which is why I use so many different things to raise my fish. You just need clean water and good filtration to raise fish. Nobody said the aquarium had to be made of glass or plexiglass Keep in mind that raising fish for money is not always pretty. Pretty is for your show tanks and pretty costs money. My way makes money, not spend it

There's an old addage that goes, " Where there is a will, there's a way." I just gave you the way. You need to supply the will

Feel free to PM me if you have any other questions. I'm always glad to help.
I literally have no space left in my room for a tank and my parents won't let me get tanks anywhere else besides my room. Once again I can't get a new tank nor a sponge filter or any of that since I don't have any money.
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:37 PM   #35
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Let alone if I had the room for one
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:39 PM   #36
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I don't understand why it's such a problem if I just push the gravel the the sides of the tank then out a grate in the middle so the eggs can fall through. Most if them will hit the glass bottom (since I pushed the gravel to the sides) then I can desperate the adults when I see the fry swimming on the lower half. Then I can replace the filter with a sponge to stop the fry from getting sucked in. Piece of cake. Don't need a rant about how I need to buy a whole other tank with a new filter and how I need to budget more wisely
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Old 02-16-2013, 12:39 PM   #37
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I don't understand why it's such a problem if I just push the gravel the the sides of the tank then out a grate in the middle so the eggs can fall through. Most if them will hit the glass bottom (since I pushed the gravel to the sides) then I can desperate the adults when I see the fry swimming on the lower half. Then I can replace the filter with a sponge to stop the fry from getting sucked in. Piece of cake. Don't need a rant about how I need to buy a whole other tank with a new filter and how I need to budget more wisely
*seperate
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Old 02-16-2013, 01:53 PM   #38
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I don't understand why it's such a problem if I just push the gravel the the sides of the tank then out a grate in the middle so the eggs can fall through. Most if them will hit the glass bottom (since I pushed the gravel to the sides) then I can desperate the adults when I see the fry swimming on the lower half. Then I can replace the filter with a sponge to stop the fry from getting sucked in. Piece of cake. Don't need a rant about how I need to buy a whole other tank with a new filter and how I need to budget more wisely
He never said you had to get a whole other tank....just that of you had one lying around, you could use it to grow out the fish, or put it in your current tank. The problem is that you can't put the fry or the eggs with the adults, because the adults will eat them.
He gave you some viable options for breeding, you just need basically is a place to keep the fry until they're big enough to not get eaten, and a filter with something (even just a 50 cent or less nylon footie) over the intake valve so they don't get sucked up.

To Andy, that advice is swell once I get more situated as far as my tank goes, I may start thinking about breeding, and I'll def pm for more advice when I get closer to that point. Thank you for sharing!
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Old 02-16-2013, 03:18 PM   #39
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I don't understand why it's such a problem if I just push the gravel the the sides of the tank then out a grate in the middle so the eggs can fall through. Most if them will hit the glass bottom (since I pushed the gravel to the sides) then I can desperate the adults when I see the fry swimming on the lower half. Then I can replace the filter with a sponge to stop the fry from getting sucked in. Piece of cake. Don't need a rant about how I need to buy a whole other tank with a new filter and how I need to budget more wisely
I fully understand your situation. Believe me!! I have been there. What I proposed was a way to have you "have your cake and eat it to." So let me ask you this, in the tank you are keeping for the possible guppy fry, If you are willing to push the gravel to the side of the tank, why are you so opposed to totally removing it? I'm not saying throw it away. I'm saying keep it aside for future use. If you have a grid that can keep the parents away from the eggs, great, use it. No need for marbles or anything on the bottom. The marbles are only for places for the eggs to fall and the parents can't get to. Your grid will serve the same purpose. The eggs and fry are only safe when the parents are no longer in the tank. Separating the sexes is one of the fastest ways of conditioning them to spawn. If you can't do that, so be it. You just run the risk of the fish spawning in the main tank and you not getting the eggs. Not really a biggy. They will spawn again.
The real question needs to be, where did you intend on growing out the fry? They won't be large enough to put in with the adults or any other fish for at least a month or so. If you don't have a grow out place, you might just want to wait until you do before taking this on. This way, you have the time also to get the right materials (ie Sponge filter) to do the job right. You might get away with growing out a spawn of Zebras in a 10 gal tank. All depends on the size of the spawn. I'm just saying that a larger area would be better. They definitely won't grow in the breeder trap. That's for livebearers not egg layers. Zebra fry will go right through the slits into the main tank or the food will pollute the small water volume in the trap if it's a closed trap.
The thing to keep in mind is that egg laying fish fry are VERY different from livebearing fry. They are much smaller and harder to deal with. But they produce many more fish than a pair of livebearers do.

If you have any other questions, feel free to PM me and I'll do the best I can to help you.
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Old 02-16-2013, 05:00 PM   #40
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I fully understand your situation. Believe me!! I have been there. What I proposed was a way to have you "have your cake and eat it to." So let me ask you this, in the tank you are keeping for the possible guppy fry, If you are willing to push the gravel to the side of the tank, why are you so opposed to totally removing it? I'm not saying throw it away. I'm saying keep it aside for future use. If you have a grid that can keep the parents away from the eggs, great, use it. No need for marbles or anything on the bottom. The marbles are only for places for the eggs to fall and the parents can't get to. Your grid will serve the same purpose. The eggs and fry are only safe when the parents are no longer in the tank. Separating the sexes is one of the fastest ways of conditioning them to spawn. If you can't do that, so be it. You just run the risk of the fish spawning in the main tank and you not getting the eggs. Not really a biggy. They will spawn again.
The real question needs to be, where did you intend on growing out the fry? They won't be large enough to put in with the adults or any other fish for at least a month or so. If you don't have a grow out place, you might just want to wait until you do before taking this on. This way, you have the time also to get the right materials (ie Sponge filter) to do the job right. You might get away with growing out a spawn of Zebras in a 10 gal tank. All depends on the size of the spawn. I'm just saying that a larger area would be better. They definitely won't grow in the breeder trap. That's for livebearers not egg layers. Zebra fry will go right through the slits into the main tank or the food will pollute the small water volume in the trap if it's a closed trap.
The thing to keep in mind is that egg laying fish fry are VERY different from livebearing fry. They are much smaller and harder to deal with. But they produce many more fish than a pair of livebearers do.

If you have any other questions, feel free to PM me and I'll do the best I can to help you.
Thank you very much for your insights. I may PM you at some point. I seeded what you mean about the danios slipping through the holes, so I was wondering around how long til the eggs get laid/hatch so I can take the adults out to avoid this problem?
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