high nitrites and nitrates

[fishkeeper90]

ok so in our fry tank of bnps we have had high no2 and no3 for a long time and not really going down we set the tank up christmas day as our bnps started mating and needed them out main tank so it had no time to cycle but we used the tank water from main tank to fill it up with as all tests in that water were perfect and 24 hours later roughly there was eggs all have hatched 2 weeks ago now and had been doing daily water changes using main tank water however that wasnt getting the nitrites and nitrates down so we started using tap water with dechlorinator every other day for over a week now but they still not going down we have got an inbuilt filter going and another internal filter an air stone a bit of bog wood a plant and a rock in there ...luckily none of them have died yet from the high levels (one got caught in filter outtake earlier my fault ooops) ... there is no gravel etc in there just a bare bottom tank ...how can we get them down as we testing daily doing water changes every other day

[fishkeeper90]

just to add aswell all other tests in fry tank are fine and main tank are all normal

[Delapool]

Tested for ammonia?

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by Delapool

Tested for ammonia?

yep like i say all other tests are fine

[coralbandit]

The % of water changed is the % the nitrite and nitrate will be reduced..
So with nitrite showing IMO anything less then 75% is not really helpful..
You may need to do 2 @75% if the nitrite is high...

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

The % of water changed is the % the nitrite and nitrate will be reduced..
So with nitrite showing IMO anything less then 75% is not really helpful..
You may need to do 2 @75% if the nitrite is high...

ok my partner was told on a site on facebook that us doing 50% water changes daily was a bit much and to only do 25% every other day ...with the 75% how long to leave it between each?

[fishkeeper90]

it was in the danger zone its now in the caution zone so dont want it to go back in danger zone but want it out caution zone too

[coralbandit]

Done properly [match temp and ph as close as possible] both 75% changes can be done in one day.
With levels being high you might be best to do 75% today and then again the next day..
I do large water changes even when my fry are still wigglers. The most important part is to match the tank. This is easily done by not adjusting your source water and using a thermometer to check temp. Within 3-5 degrees should be fine. Not messing with source water is more important when you do large water changes as matching is pretty important IMO..

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

Done properly [match temp and ph as close as possible] both 75% changes can be done in one day.
With levels being high you might be best to do 75% today and then again the next day..
I do large water changes even when my fry are still wigglers. The most important part is to match the tank. This is easily done by not adjusting your source water and using a thermometer to check temp. Within 3-5 degrees should be fine. Not messing with source water is more important when you do large water changes as matching is pretty important IMO..

would we be able to use main tank water as that is perfect tests wise and temp is the same as fry tank or best with tap water ...my partner does all the water changes but he works so they would prob be today (which is water change day anyway) and tomorrow as he gets home late from work

[coralbandit]

Used tank water will already have nitrates in it..
Not the best plan and possibly why you are having issues with water..
Very little good bacteria live in the water column . They colonize surfaces not the water..
IMO old tank water is garbage and exactly what you want to get out of tank..
Possibly doing large change on big tank with plenty of new water will dilute the nutrients enough to make that water better then what the fry are in but I would try if you feel comfortable to give fry new water..They will need this throught your raising them..
I breed and raise a lot of fish ,but I change more water..Can't do the one without the other..Poor water quality is 90% of why fry fail often.


I'll add using a conditioner like Prime can detoxify the nitrite for 48 hours. Follow the directions and know the nitrite will still show on test and is only detoxified for 48 hours.
If in 48 hours the filter does not process the nitrite into nitrate you will need to dose again ,which should be done with a water change..

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

Used tank water will already have nitrates in it..
Not the best plan and possibly why you are having issues with water..
Very little good bacteria live in the water column . They colonize surfaces not the water..
IMO old tank water is garbage and exactly what you want to get out of tank..
Possibly doing large change on big tank with plenty of new water will dilute the nutrients enough to make that water better then what the fry are in but I would try if you feel comfortable to give fry new water..They will need this throught your raising them..
I breed and raise a lot of fish ,but I change more water..Can't do the one without the other..Poor water quality is 90% of why fry fail often.


I'll add using a conditioner like Prime can detoxify the nitrite for 48 hours. Follow the directions and know the nitrite will still show on test and is only detoxified for 48 hours.
If in 48 hours the filter does not process the nitrite into nitrate you will need to dose again ,which should be done with a water change..

we did start off with doing water changes with main tank water but started using fresh water from tap when the babies were born we also took dad out thinking it would lower the poop to reduce the nitrites and nitrates but still high we use tap safe (decholrinator) every water change ...we have also checked the water straight from tap to be on safe side and thats completly fine none in that

[fishkeeper90]

the aqua safe is added every water change ...does the filter start also need to be added every water change aswell or is using the aqua safe fine to use on its own ?

[coralbandit]

I would just use the Aqua safe..
If a tank is cycled there is no need for the other to be used during water changes no matter what the directions say.
As for using it to cycle the tank with fry I would skip it and just do water changes to keep the parameter correct .
Look into to switch to SeaChem Prime for conditioning..
I saw n mention on Aquasafes site of detoxifying nitrites or ammonia.,.
Most cnditioners do this .
Prime is best bang for the buck with Safe going to big time water changers..

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

I would just use the Aqua safe..
If a tank is cycled there is no need for the other to be used during water changes no matter what the directions say.
As for using it to cycle the tank with fry I would skip it and just do water changes to keep the parameter correct .
Look into to switch to SeaChem Prime for conditioning..
I saw n mention on Aquasafes site of detoxifying nitrites or ammonia.,.
Most cnditioners do this .
Prime is best bang for the buck with Safe going to big time water changers..

how do you keep parameters right ...and we are only using aqua safe we have put the filter start in once or twice as it wasnt a cycled tank ...we were cut short so had to buy it and set it up instantly

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

I would just use the Aqua safe..
If a tank is cycled there is no need for the other to be used during water changes no matter what the directions say.
As for using it to cycle the tank with fry I would skip it and just do water changes to keep the parameter correct .
Look into to switch to SeaChem Prime for conditioning..
I saw n mention on Aquasafes site of detoxifying nitrites or ammonia.,.
Most cnditioners do this .
Prime is best bang for the buck with Safe going to big time water changers..

thanks coral ...we have only done one roughly 75% water change so far and its bought the nitrates and nitrites down to one under perfect on nitrites and mid range on the nitrates so that has worked so gunna do another 75% today(should have been yesterday but was too busy) and hopefully that will sort it to zero if not prob do another 75% in 2 days

[coralbandit]

Good luck. I think water changes are going to be good for you and the fry.
I find all my fry do better in clean water..
I start changing water when the eggs have turned to wigglers..This is when I do a 50-75% water change to remove the methylene blue..So my fry get 50% + water changes from before they are even free swimmers !
After that I am COD [OCD for those NOT severely infected] about matching my waters parameters.
I always add water made up or untouched exactly like previous water used...

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

Good luck. I think water changes are going to be good for you and the fry.
I find all my fry do better in clean water..
I start changing water when the eggs have turned to wigglers..This is when I do a 50-75% water change to remove the methylene blue..So my fry get 50% + water changes from before they are even free swimmers !
After that I am COD [OCD for those NOT severely infected] about matching my waters parameters.
I always add water made up or untouched exactly like previous water used...

we started to change water while they were eggs ...but since that 75% roughly water change they have been more active so must have worked ...after the next 75% change /when nitrites and nitrates or zero what percentage water change would you recommend

[coralbandit]

Most say you only need to change enough to remove nutrients to a safe level.
Every tank will be different and feeding fry can cause levels to elevate quickly..
I like to do 50%+ on the regular[as often as possible] .
Fry not only grow from minerals in the water that may become exhausted that we have no specific test for and often many male fish fry will excrete a hormone that will inhibit other males development.
These are called " Growth Inhibiting Hormones " [GIH]..
By changing 'enough '[judgement call IMO ] water the effects of GIH can be diminished..
As you raise the fry it may also be helpful if you note only a couple of fry being larger to remove them..This will afford the next to take their place and grow properly...

[fishkeeper90]

Originally Posted by coralbandit

Most say you only need to change enough to remove nutrients to a safe level.
Every tank will be different and feeding fry can cause levels to elevate quickly..
I like to do 50%+ on the regular[as often as possible] .
Fry not only grow from minerals in the water that may become exhausted that we have no specific test for and often many male fish fry will excrete a hormone that will inhibit other males development.
These are called " Growth Inhibiting Hormones " [GIH]..
By changing 'enough '[judgement call IMO ] water the effects of GIH can be diminished..
As you raise the fry it may also be helpful if you note only a couple of fry being larger to remove them..This will afford the next to take their place and grow properly...

cool thanks... the fry all roughly same size atm but we wouldnt have anywhere we could put bigger ones as the fish in main tank will eat them but want to keep them out of main tank really as when we selling them dont want to stress others out