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Old 05-02-2009, 09:23 AM   #1
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Nice Ram Spawn

Well, a pair of my rams spawned on Thursday. I noticed the female's ovipositor slightly extended and she was hovering over the clay pot where she laid the last two spawns, so I put a piece of slate right there and the pair decided to spawn on it for me (unsurprisingly).

That was at 5:00 pm. Friday monrning around 8:00 am I pulled the eggs and put them into their own ~3/4 gallon container with an airstone and a heater set to 84 degrees. I added a half a drop of Quick Cure along with 1/2 capful of hydrogen peroxide. I checked them around 11:50 pm Friday night and some had hatched and released from the slate.

This morning (Saturday) around 8:00 am I checked them again and nearly all of them are wigglers, many still on the slate but a good amount on the bottom of the container. Some actually made the visit up to the to to see me before falling back down. They aren't free-swimming yet but by Monday they should be.

I counted 23 unfertilized eggs, only 2 more than my initial count on Friday morning. I counted the eggs using Microsoft Paint and I deleted them as I counted them off one by one. I counted 451 in all! That's a rather large spawn for rams, the largest I've seen to date. Not too surprising since the parents are half wilds and are good quality breeders. Rams are "supposed to have" soft and acidic water according to many, but in my experience they do just fine in hard and alkaline water. My ph is around 7.8 and my GH is 300+ ppm.

So I should have over 400 free-swimmers in a couple of days. I'm ready for them this time since I have cultures of microworms and walter worms established. I'll be changing the water out every day that I can since I will have more time now that class is out for the semester.

Looks like I may have to set up another tank and/or get rid of some of my existing fish. My female will probably spawn for me Wednesday or Thursday and I'll have even more eggs to work with! Stay tuned for pictures and videos. I'll get some up in a couple of days.

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Old 05-02-2009, 09:29 AM   #2
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When those little guys are ready to leave the tank, id be interested in 2 -4 for my tank.


That is true about the water, My angel was acclimated and actually grew quicker in 8.2 ph, since ive neutralized down to 7.0 steady going into its 6th week now he hasnt grown near as much but seems shy now then before at the current 7.0 ph level. I am thinking about letting it slowly rise to around a 7.6 to see if that kick starts him back into being more active.
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Old 05-02-2009, 09:29 AM   #3
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That is a lot of fry. Congrats!!
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Old 05-02-2009, 06:19 PM   #4
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any pics of the parents or fry? Also do you know when rams get their colors?
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Old 05-02-2009, 06:24 PM   #5
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I will have pics up tomorrow hopefully of the parents and fry. I forgot to mention that the wiggles should be a mix of blue rams and gold rams. I'm not sure on the percentage of golds that can be expected.

Rams can be sexually mature at 4 months old or just under. They usually have good coloration (or at least starting) about 3 and a half months or so. This all depends on the diet, genetics, etc.
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Old 05-03-2009, 11:40 AM   #6
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This morning I changed 100% of the water in the container. I used a turkey baster to relocate the fry to a separate container and I removed all of the dead fry and all of that other junk from the remaining living fry. I counted 284 living fry in all. I will do another count later on tonight when I will change out 100% of the water again.

I was going to take pictures of the fry and of the parents but my camera is out of batteries and I cannot find ANY around the house. I even tried swapping 2 out of the remote for 2 of the 4 in the camera but to no avail. I will try to get some pics up tomorrow of the parents and fry.
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Old 05-03-2009, 01:35 PM   #7
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so what are rams, i breed jack dempseys and mollys myself.
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Old 05-04-2009, 05:33 PM   #8
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234 was the fry count today. They are set to go free-swimming sometime tomorrow. Sorry for no pics yet. Just got back home and allergies are kicking my butt!
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:14 PM   #9
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thats really cool, i have made up my mind that my next fish will be rams
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Old 05-04-2009, 08:51 PM   #10
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As of 7:30 pm many of the fry are going to the top and staying there. This is the beginning of them becoming free-swimmers. I fed some walter worms so they are in the tank when the fish start to look for food. The walter worms will last a couple of days in the water column. I did another 100% water change today and will do one again tomorrow as well.
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Old 05-04-2009, 09:17 PM   #11
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How much are blue rams and what do you plan to do with 400 of them?
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Old 05-04-2009, 09:37 PM   #12
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My stock is good and I should be able to sell them for $8 each when they are 4 months old, if they make it. Right now I'm working on establishing a breeding process for them that works. I was hoping to get 200 of them to the free-swimming stage and I'm shooting for 125-150 to grow out and sell after culling for deformities and weaknesses. If my setup works out, I'll hopefully have a weekly supply of 400+ eggs from a single pair and I hope to have 3 pairs going at the same time. That way I'll have a constant supply of rams and will be able to sell good quality rams to hobbyists who would otherwise spend their money on Asian bred rams, only to have them die within a few weeks to several months not knowing why. I'm making it my goal to ensure that better quality rams aren't hard to find. Maybe one day I will supply fish stores throughout the country with good rams so many more people can enjoy them.
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Old 05-04-2009, 09:48 PM   #13
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My stock is good and I should be able to sell them for $8 each when they are 4 months old, if they make it. Right now I'm working on establishing a breeding process for them that works. I was hoping to get 200 of them to the free-swimming stage and I'm shooting for 125-150 to grow out and sell after culling for deformities and weaknesses. If my setup works out, I'll hopefully have a weekly supply of 400+ eggs from a single pair and I hope to have 3 pairs going at the same time. That way I'll have a constant supply of rams and will be able to sell good quality rams to hobbyists who would otherwise spend their money on Asian bred rams, only to have them die within a few weeks to several months not knowing why. I'm making it my goal to ensure that better quality rams aren't hard to find. Maybe one day I will supply fish stores throughout the country with good rams so many more people can enjoy them.
What size tank are you going to keep them in to grow?
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Old 05-04-2009, 10:00 PM   #14
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i never really thought it would be possible to make money selling fish...obviously without having a huge setup made for that purpose

just a few tanks like any normal person might own
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Old 05-04-2009, 11:09 PM   #15
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Currently they are in a ~3/4g container and will remain there for 2 weeks or so. After that I may move them to a 10g most likely and after that a 29g.
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Old 05-05-2009, 09:52 AM   #16
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Checked on the fry this morning and hardly any at the surface. They are mostly all on the bottom 3 inches of the container and they are a "free-swimming cloud". They are just roaming around. Hopefully they are finding the microworms and walter worms that I put in there for them. I also added some more this morning.

Also, it looks like there were no losses through the night and a fry count doesn't appear to be necessary. I'll do a water change later today and will probably keep some of the water in the container for the walter worms and microworms as I don't want to be taking out their food source. I may do 2 75% water changes instead of a single PWC.
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Old 05-05-2009, 10:04 AM   #17
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Question

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My stock is good and I should be able to sell them for $8 each when they are 4 months old, if they make it.
Where do you usually sell them? I'm just starting out with angels and have been selling to a LFS chain. But if I really get going I may have more then they can handle. Just curious what works good for you.
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Old 05-05-2009, 10:41 AM   #18
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Try Craigslist and AquaBid along with forums.
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Old 05-05-2009, 11:04 AM   #19
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Yeah, Craigslist is a good option, I've purchased my grow out tanks from there. My problem with AquaBid is I don't like Paypal and it doesn't look like there is any other good payment options.
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Old 05-05-2009, 02:43 PM   #20
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You determine what method of payment you are willing to take on AquaBid. You don't have to accept PayPal money exchanges. Some people have switched to RME (Revolution Money Exchange), and you can also take personal checks and ship out after the checks clear. Also money orders and cash can be accepted, though most people would be hesitant to send cash. Money orders are a good way to go for you and the buyer. That way you know the money is legit (if the MO is from the USPS for example) and you can ship out once the MO is received rather than waiting a couple of days for the check to clear.

Also, PayPal fees do suck but getting money from a sale is better than getting nothing at all. You can also make the buyer pay for the fees too.
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