Fish cycle: Fact or Fiction

[hb3133]

I found this post on another message board and it made me start worrying. I would appreciate any input from members with experience.


"A fishy cycle is generally a lot more work than a fishless if you plan on keeping your fish alive.

And of course the tank will only cycle to the level of fish you add. So if you start with 3 danios then each new fish you add afterwards will cause a new cycle to start. So you must add fish slowly, weeks apart."

Any truth?

 

[greenmaji]

Yes.. The weeks apart is a bit of an exageration but the underlying statments are true

 

[Jchillin]

The fishless cycle is continuous and is at the highest level possible without killing off the newly established bacteria. When cycling with fish, the tanks parameters are constantly swinging due to constant water changes trying to keep the NH3 at a non-toxic level.

 

[talloulou]

A fishless cycle may be faster than cycling with fish (though I have seen some crazy 40+ day posts that make me wonder) but the point is that with a "fishless" cycle you are staring at an empty tank of water.....waiting.

If you cycle with fish you don't really notice the waiting cause you have at least 1-2 fish from the get go and you can keep slowly adding more. Definitely more immediately gratifying.

You do have to do lots of water changes during the cycle if you have fish in your tank but I think thats a good habit to get into anyway and all fish would benefit from lots of water changes.

Now I understand that fish can be put through hell if you stock too many too quickly or your don't keep up with water changes or you start off with fish that are too delicate for cycling....but it is my opinion that cycling with fish can be done safely and easily if you know what you are doing. I don't lose fish when I start a new tank and I always start the tank off with fish I know I am planning to keep.

Sorry......just had to play devils advocate!

 

[hb3133]

Here is another question:

When my tank is cycled, do I then add a few fish, and start a new cycle? Do I have to check the water parameters each day? Or will I experience a mini cycle?

 

[talloulou]

Once your tank is cycled.....ammonia 0/nitrites 0/ nitrates >10 ppm you can add more fish slowly. But its important to stock slowly because the bacteria have to be able to balance out with the new bigger bioload. I have added new fish and not noticed any mini cycle occuring. I also don't think it is necessary to wait "weeks" between new additions to the tank. I have sometimes been able to add fish, and then add more fish three days later. Just keep an eye on your water parameters. If you do go through a "mini cycle" it will usually resolve in a couple days or so. It won't take nearly as long to resolve as the original cycle took. I usually do pwc right before adding new fish as well.

 

[greenmaji]

With a properly performed fishless cycle there isnt a slow introduction of new fish (the bacteria for the full bio-load is already there) and thinking of it as a borring to not have any fish in the tank is really a lack of patients and this hobby requires patience as well as good habits. That and your not risking the lives of your pets with the fishless cycle..

 

[talloulou]

With a properly performed fishless cycle there isnt a slow introduction of new fish

well I consider staring at an empty tank for a couple weeks a very slow introduction.........

and yep......I have little patience. And what patience I do have must be saved for my kiddies and husband. May God have mercy on my soul! LOL

And I understand the pushing of the fishless cycle I just don't agree with it and thought I would put my two cents in since the poster asking the question is already in the midst of cycling with fish anyway. And others who have limited patience like myself and the poster will probably follow.

 

[TomK2]

You can add fish stock after doing a fish or fishless cycle. After I did mine (the fishy way), I would add a few fish each week, and after that went well for the first half of stocking, I added 10 inches of fish at a time each week or so for the second half. No problems. During the second half of stocking, the tank had been up for 3 months or more, and the bacteria in the tank could easily meet the extra demand of new stock. If you did this immediately after the cycle, a mini-cycle might occur, so bulk stocking would not be recommended until you are over 50 percent of your planned stocking and the tank has been cycled for a while. But not the entire last 50% all at once!

Like Talloulou, I have used fish to cycle safely, humanely, and effectively multiple times. I have devoted a web page to the subject:
http://home.comcast.net/~tomstank/tomstank_files/page0017.htm

 

[hb3133]

TomK2... Thanks for the link to the great article. I am currently cycling a 20 gallon tank with four harlequin Rasboras. I would estimate that I have about 2 to 3 inches of fish. After today's readings, which happenings to be day 26, pH 7.2, ammonia 0.5ppm and nitrite 0ppm. Should I add another inch or two? I am doing water changes every other day, 10-20%, and feeding very small amounts BID. I am just concerned because I have not had any traces of nitrite after 3+ weeks.

 

[FawnN]

I personally believe doing a fishless cycle versus a cycling with fish, takes the same amount of time. It may seem slower with a fishless, because your not doing anything to the water but testing it.

After a fishless cycle you are able to stock a full tank, without overstocking. When doing a fishless, you are feeding the bacteria a higher amount of ammonia and creating more benefical bacteria, then you would when cycling with fish.

By doing a fishless, your not doing the weekly, sometimes twice a week water changes to keep your fish alive.

I personally only do fishless. It is so much easier, especially as a beginner.

 

[TomK2]

no, don't add any more fish. you have ammonia, so it will be converted into nitrite, and that into nitrate. You don't necessarily have to see any spikes in ammonia or nitrite. The focus of my article/experiment was to see if I could get nitrate production without ever seeing any ammonia or nitrite, which I did. If the rate of rise in ammonia is gradual enough, the bacteria can keep the levels of ammonia and nitrite below the test kits lower limit. Thus. a fishy cycle with no stress or harm to the fish.

Just be patient, and keep doing what you are doing. Test the baseline nitrate level now, so you can tell when it rises later. My experiment took 40 days. Low bioload fish cycling is not meant to be faster or more efficient, it is meant to be easy, and give you a few fish to look at for the first 7 or 8 weeks. Ammonia fishless cycling might be faster, though I would not call it easier, and you don't have any fish to look at. The trouble with fish cycling is it requires restraint, patience, and some knowledge, and if you troll the forum here long enough you will find that all too few newbies have that when they first set up a tank. They end up learning the lesson the hard way.

 

[hb3133]

TomK2... Once again, thanks. I have to say that you have been the most helpful person on this board. You haven't jump on my back for doing a cycle with fish but instead, helped me with the situation I have. I will test for nitrates tonight. I have been keeping a log since day 1 and it has helped me track the levels. I have been very patient and I know I can wait a few more weeks. The fish seem to be happy/healthy and that's all that matters. When the cycle is final complete, I would like to add 5 black neaon tetras and either 4 panda/peppered cory cats. Thanks!

 

[TomK2]

Why thank you!

I am glad you started out with few fish, you saved yourself a lot of aggravation that way. In all likelyhood you will get nitrates in 2 or 3 weeks, and if ammonia and nitrite go to zero you can start adding an inch or two of fish per week. Then later, weeks after fish additions have been not causing any problems, you should be able to start adding fish faster, if you need to.

 

[hb3133]

Can you add Bio-Spira after starting cycle using fish? Or is it only useful in the beginning? Its been 4 weeks now and I still have no signs of nitrites.

 

[TomK2]

Well, just accept that it might take 7 or 8 weeks to get nitrates, and then you won't feel like you are falling behind! I would skip the Biospira. You have made it this far, hold a steady course and it will work out. Look at it this way. If you do an 8 week fishy cycle, then another 4 weeks for slow stocking, then another month of faster stocking, you have stretched out that "new tank feeling" for 4 months! Once you have your tank up, running, and at full stock, part of the excitement wears off and you start looking for another tank So enjoy the New Tank Feeling while it lasts!