Harlequin rasbora lump cluster

[jordzcov]

one of my rasbora seems to have a stronge lump cluster. I didnt notice it yesterday, so its coem about today. I thought it may just be mid-poop to begin with, but came back a few hours later and it was still there. Unsure what this may be.

 

[Andy Sager]

one of my rasbora seems to have a stronge lump cluster. I didnt notice it yesterday, so its coem about today. I thought it may just be mid-poop to begin with, but came back a few hours later and it was still there. Unsure what this may be.

Can't tell for sure but it could be the remains of some eggs that were tried to be spawned or a prolapsed vent. The first thing you need to do is check your water parameters as poor water quality can cause this in some fish. Get your numbers and we can go from there.

 

[jordzcov]

Can't tell for sure but it could be the remains of some eggs that were tried to be spawned or a prolapsed vent. The first thing you need to do is check your water parameters as poor water quality can cause this in some fish. Get your numbers and we can go from there.

Will do a fresh test tomorrow morning.
As a rough reference for the time being, my levels are usually at:
nh3 - 0
No2 - 0
No3 - 0/5
Ph 8
KH 6

I have 5 of the Rasbora in total, (based on their size, 3 are much larger, so am assuming 3 male and 2 female), with 7 neon tetra

 

[jordzcov]

did a quick test:
nh3 - 0
No2 - 0/ 0.25 (i do my water changes on a saturday, so is due tomorrow)
No3 - 0/5
Ph 8
KH 7

 

[Andy Sager]

did a quick test:
nh3 - 0
No2 - 0/ 0.25 (i do my water changes on a saturday, so is due tomorrow)
No3 - 0/5
Ph 8
KH 7

While it's not alarmingly high, having any nitrites in an established/cycled tank is cause for some concern. It means there may be some issue with the microbes that convert nitrite to nitrate. Before doing your next water change, run the nitrate test again to confirm it's back to 0. You may have just hit a small window where the microbes haven't caught up to the presence of nitrites.

As for the genders, you have it backwards. Females are larger than males. This particular fish is a bit of an enigma because it has the shape of a spawned out female, the fin coloration of a female but the black patch of a male. These kinds of things are not uncommon in fish that are farmed for such a long time so because it has 2 of the 3 female characteristics, I would lean towards it being a female. That would mean the following: it most likely spawned in the tank ( because she does not look full of eggs like the other females in pic 2) so if those are eggs that she didn't attach anywhere, they should be gone by the morning. If not, I would give her an Epsom Salt bath at a rate of 1 tablespoon per 1 gallon of water. I'd do this in a separate container using tank water with the epsom salt dissolved in it before adding the fish. Leave the fish in the bath water for 15-30 minutes. ( If the fish shows too much signs of stress, try to get at least 5 minutes in the bath before removing her back to the tank.) What the bath will do is relax the muscle around the vent ( the anal sphincter muscle in humans) so that if this is a prolapse, it may retract on it's own.

The good news /bad news of this, if it's a prolapse, it's not a death sentence for the fish however, it does open the fish to secondary issues which can be fatal. The other bad news is that the cause can be from a number of things, including genetics, but past the baths, there is not much else you can do for a small fish with a prolapse other than giving it clean water, proper diet and no stress.

Hope this helps.

 

[jordzcov]

As Always, thanks for the help.
I do usualy take a reading before feedign the fish, but this was done afterwards (although it was a good 6/7 hours) so not sure if that may be the result of the slight spike in nitrites)

In person, the buldge does seem to be made up of very small blobs/circles, so it could well be eggs.
You reference the other females in pic 2 looking full of eggs, what is exactly im looking for there? i originaly would have thought those were the males (or atleast different to the main fish in question) due to the size diference, but i cant see what you may be seeing in terms of eggs visuals.

I will see how things play out over night and check back int he morning

 

[Andy Sager]

As Always, thanks for the help.
I do usualy take a reading before feedign the fish, but this was done afterwards (although it was a good 6/7 hours) so not sure if that may be the result of the slight spike in nitrites)

In person, the buldge does seem to be made up of very small blobs/circles, so it could well be eggs.
You reference the other females in pic 2 looking full of eggs, what is exactly im looking for there? i originaly would have thought those were the males (or atleast different to the main fish in question) due to the size diference, but i cant see what you may be seeing in terms of eggs visuals.

I will see how things play out over night and check back int he morning

Yeah, she probably spawned then. Check underneath any larger leaves or flat surfaces you have in the tank. They spawn upside down on the underside of leaves usually.

As for what I'm seeing, I'm just used to seeing the difference between a gravid female fish and a male fish because in the books I had to use to learn from, the difference between males and females on many species were almost always described as " Only the fullness of a ripe female will indicate her sex." A lot has been learned since the 1960s. I did find this video which may help you see what I'm seeing.

 

[jordzcov]

So as an update, the lumps are still there. I did a water change and couldnt see anything anywhere that looked like eggs (although i tried not to distrub the tank to much incase i then siphoned them, but also wasnt entirely sure what im looking for), the lumps still seem to remain, so i did a small dose of general tonic meds to the tank to help, but the lumps remain. the fish does still seem fine in terms of swimming and eating

 

[Andy Sager]

So as an update, the lumps are still there. I did a water change and couldnt see anything anywhere that looked like eggs (although i tried not to distrub the tank to much incase i then siphoned them, but also wasnt entirely sure what im looking for), the lumps still seem to remain, so i did a small dose of general tonic meds to the tank to help, but the lumps remain. the fish does still seem fine in terms of swimming and eating

Try not arbitrarily adding chemicals when you are unsure of what the issue is. This is how medicine resistant strains of pathogens are created. There is no medication for this if it's eggs and there is no medication to actually treat a prolapse. Epsom salt only relaxes the muscle so that the fish can pull the prolapsed part back into the body. As long as the fish is eating, there's not much more you should do.
As for what to look for, there would be little round balls, similar to what you are seeing on the fish, in a cluster pattern usually underneath plant leaves or flat surfaces. Unfortunately, when you have other fish in the tank when fish spawn, the other fish usually try to eat the eggs as they are highly nutritious for fish to eat. So in your case, they may already be gone.

 

[jordzcov]

Try not arbitrarily adding chemicals when you are unsure of what the issue is. This is how medicine resistant strains of pathogens are created. There is no medication for this if it's eggs and there is no medication to actually treat a prolapse. Epsom salt only relaxes the muscle so that the fish can pull the prolapsed part back into the body. As long as the fish is eating, there's not much more you should do.
As for what to look for, there would be little round balls, similar to what you are seeing on the fish, in a cluster pattern usually underneath plant leaves or flat surfaces. Unfortunately, when you have other fish in the tank when fish spawn, the other fish usually try to eat the eggs as they are highly nutritious for fish to eat. So in your case, they may already be gone.

The lump still seems to be there, it now looks more like just 2 blobs rather than the initial 'collection'. 1 seems to have become transparent, while 1 still remians cloudy, but no overall reduction in size.

I did a small feed of garden peas, as that is meant to help with any digestion blockages (just incase it was of any help), but didnt seem to make much difference. Fish is still swimming and eating fine, but has been hiding each morning and giving me the scare that it had died overnight, but then pops out later on and seems fine.

I did the general tonic dose just as i could see its gills looked slightly red, so just wanted to potentially nip anything in the bud that may be lurking, as i often regret the 'wait and see' approach because its always gone wrong.

Im not to precious about losing any potential eggs, as its a relatively small tank anyway, but still havent seen any glimpse of any, am mainly hopign the fish doesnt die.