Help! New tetras gulping at the surface.

[BTucker2]

Just added some tetras to my 55 gallon tank. it currently has adult silver dollar (3) Jack Dempsey (1) Firemouth (1) and a pleco.

all the fish are at the top of the tank gulping air. I did 50% water change. they seemed better, but after a couple hours they are all back to the top.

my aerators ade working, i have a Fluval 407 canister filter, recently replaced the carbon.

Why are they not getting O2?

 

[Andy Sager]

For starters, what kind of Tetras did you add because not many are a good mix with Jack Dempseys or Firemouths.
You are going to need to get a full panel of tests done to help figure out the problem. pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, and General Hardness. If you have a low pH, ( under 7.0) you will need a KH ( carbonate hardness) test as well. If you have a store doing these tests for you, get actual numbers and not " It's okay" or any other word answers. You need numbers.
Lastly, How did you acclimate the new fish?

 

[BTucker2]

For starters, what kind of Tetras did you add because not many are a good mix with Jack Dempseys or Firemouths.
You are going to need to get a full panel of tests done to help figure out the problem. pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, and General Hardness. If you have a low pH, ( under 7.0) you will need a KH ( carbonate hardness) test as well. If you have a store doing these tests for you, get actual numbers and not " It's okay" or any other word answers. You need numbers.
Lastly, How did you acclimate the new fish?

nitrate 20

nitrite 2

ammonia 0

ph 6.5-7

hardness 120

 

[BTucker2]

nitrate 20

nitrite 2

ammonia 0

ph 6.5-7

hardness 120

Black Skirt tetras (4), and Buenos aires (5)
was having some fin nipping and was hoping putting smaller, quick fish would help.

 

[BTucker2]

For starters, what kind of Tetras did you add because not many are a good mix with Jack Dempseys or Firemouths.
You are going to need to get a full panel of tests done to help figure out the problem. pH, Ammonia, Nitrite, Nitrate, and General Hardness. If you have a low pH, ( under 7.0) you will need a KH ( carbonate hardness) test as well. If you have a store doing these tests for you, get actual numbers and not " It's okay" or any other word answers. You need numbers.
Lastly, How did you acclimate the new fish?

floated them in the bag for about 20 min, then scooped them with a net and released them. All the fish are st the top, not just the new ones. The ones that are even 4-5 years old are now at the top gasping

 

[Andy Sager]

nitrate 20

nitrite 2

ammonia 0

ph 6.5-7

hardness 120

The problem is your nitrites. They are way too high and toxic. You need to do a large volume water change to lower them and Check them daily to keep them under .25 ppm and do water changes to lower them if they rise above .25 ppm.
Just as a side note, your nitrate reading is probably not that high ( unless it's coming from your source water) because in some test kits, you can get a false/inaccurate nitrate reading coming from the nitrites in the water.

Lastly, you need to know what the water parameters are from where you get your fish in comparison to your tank water to do the " cut and dump" acclimation method. A rapid change in pH or Hardness can have a devastating effect on fish. In this case however, the high nitrites are more of a problem than a bad acclimation.

 

[BTucker2]

The problem is your nitrites. They are way too high and toxic. You need to do a large volume water change to lower them and Check them daily to keep them under .25 ppm and do water changes to lower them if they rise above .25 ppm.
Just as a side note, your nitrate reading is probably not that high ( unless it's coming from your source water) because in some test kits, you can get a false/inaccurate nitrate reading coming from the nitrites in the water.

Lastly, you need to know what the water parameters are from where you get your fish in comparison to your tank water to do the " cut and dump" acclimation method. A rapid change in pH or Hardness can have a devastating effect on fish. In this case however, the high nitrites are more of a problem than a bad acclimation.

I figured that after the test, but they were doing this, then i did a 50% water change, and they seemed better but then went right back to the top. thats when i tested. I will do another change tonight.

 

[Andy Sager]

I figured that after the test, but they were doing this, then i did a 50% water change, and they seemed better but then went right back to the top. thats when i tested. I will do another change tonight.

They acted better after the water change because the nitrite level was lower. After the water circulated a bit and then the nitrite reading went around the tank, it was back to the surface hoping for better water and more oxygen. How long has this tank been set up that you have such a high nitrite reading?

 

[Aiken Drum]

In addition to the water change giving them temporary respite from the nitrite levels, the new water will have been very well oxygenated.

Nitrite intake into the gills makes them less able to transfer oxygen to the blood causing a condition called brown blood syndrome. The fish gulp at the surface to try maximise their O2 intake. Water change increases the O2 content, meaning that they feel better in a higher O2 environment, but the O2 offgases after a while and you are back to square one.

Aquarium salt helps with nitrite poisoning as it inhibits nitrite uptake into the gills. Getting the nitrite to acceptable levels and keeping them there is more important though. Based on 2ppm nitrite levels you should be doing 3 x 50% water changes a few hours apart to get your nitrite to an acceptable level and then regularly check your parameters and keep them safe until your cycle establishes to the higher bioload.

Here is a link to a thread that goes through what to do when you spot an issue. First item is to get your water parameters which would have given a big clue as to what was causing your issue.

First Aid for Fish

BASIC FIRST AID FOR FISH Test the water for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate and pH. Wipe the inside of the glass down with a clean fish sponge. This removes the biofilm on the glass and the biofilm will contain lots of harmful bacteria, fungus, protozoans and various other microscopic life forms. Do...

www.aquariumadvice.com

 

[BTucker2]

They acted better after the water change because the nitrite level was lower. After the water circulated a bit and then the nitrite reading went around the tank, it was back to the surface hoping for better water and more oxygen. How long has this tank been set up that you have such a high nitrite reading?

this tank has been set up for 4 years at least.
I am noticing my silver dollars mouths are gapping open and they look funny. should i use a gram-negative broad spectrum anti-biotic? which one?

 

[Andy Sager]

this tank has been set up for 4 years at least.
I am noticing my silver dollars mouths are gapping open and they look funny. should i use a gram-negative broad spectrum anti-biotic? which one?

No. Your issue is nitrite poisoning. No sense treating the fish in bad water. You need to get the water straightened out before making any kind of secondary treatment decisions. Follow the directions as Aiken laid out in post #9.

It's quite unusual for there to be a nitrite issue in a tank that old. Did you do any recent heavy cleaning of filters or substrate?

 

[BTucker2]

They acted better after the water change because the nitrite level was lower. After the water circulated a bit and then the nitrite reading went around the tank, it was back to the surface hoping for better water and more oxygen. How long has this tank been set up that you have such a high nitrite reading?

No. Your issue is nitrite poisoning. No sense treating the fish in bad water. You need to get the water straightened out before making any kind of secondary treatment decisions. Follow the directions as Aiken laid out in post #9.

It's quite unusual for there to be a nitrite issue in a tank that old. Did you do any recent heavy cleaning of filters or substrate?

yes, my canister filter stopped working so i had to replace it, but i used the old sponge media when I replaced it, then after a month i changed the sponges for the new ones.

No. Your issue is nitrite poisoning. No sense treating the fish in bad water. You need to get the water straightened out before making any kind of secondary treatment decisions. Follow the directions as Aiken laid out in post #9.

It's quite unusual for there to be a nitrite issue in a tank that old. Did you do any recent heavy cleaning of filters or substrate?

Followed Aiken‘s advice. have done 6 water changes since last night. Nitrites are at 0 now, i will test again later tonight.
And in the morning.
i did add Micro-Lift Nite-out II.
So hoping that helps

 

[Andy Sager]

yes, my canister filter stopped working so i had to replace it, but i used the old sponge media when I replaced it, then after a month i changed the sponges for the new ones.

Ding, Ding, Ding!!!! I think we have a winner. You don't replace the old filter material with new. You add new to the old material and after a month or two, you can remove the old only if it has deteriorated to the point that it has fallen apart. Your nitrifying microbes are mostly in that material because the filter usually has the highest level of oxygenated water which is what those microbes need.

Followed Aiken‘s advice. have done 6 water changes since last night. Nitrites are at 0 now, i will test again later tonight.
And in the morning.
i did add Micro-Lift Nite-out II.
So hoping that helps

That's a new product to me but your test results will tell you if it's working. If the nitrite level is 0 tomorrow, that would be a good indicator that the product worked. You do want to see a rise in nitrates tho to ensure that the microbes that convert nitrite to nitrate are still present.
As for the fish, they are going to act a little funky for a few days after the water settles. They need to expel any poison still in their cellular makeup.

 

[BTucker2]

Ding, Ding, Ding!!!! I think we have a winner. You don't replace the old filter material with new. You add new to the old material and after a month or two, you can remove the old only if it has deteriorated to the point that it has fallen apart. Your nitrifying microbes are mostly in that material because the filter usually has the highest level of oxygenated water which is what those microbes need.

That's a new product to me but your test results will tell you if it's working. If the nitrite level is 0 tomorrow, that would be a good indicator that the product worked. You do want to see a rise in nitrates tho to ensure that the microbes that convert nitrite to nitrate are still present.
As for the fish, they are going to act a little funky for a few days after the water settles. They need to expel any poison still in their cellular makeup.

Thanks!
And i had said, i got a new canister filter, but did not use the new filter material. I used the old filters media in the new canister. But I probably should have left it in there way longer!

 

[Andy Sager]

Thanks!
And i had said, i got a new canister filter, but did not use the new filter material. I used the old filters media in the new canister. But I probably should have left it in there way longer!

Or just left it in there with the new. It's not usual for old tanks to have nitrite issues. It's more Nitrate issues due to lack of water changes or nitrate consuming products.

 

[BTucker2]

Or just left it in there with the new. It's not usual for old tanks to have nitrite issues. It's more Nitrate issues due to lack of water changes or nitrate consuming products.

Or just left it in there with the new. It's not usual for old tanks to have nitrite issues. It's more Nitrate issues due to lack of water changes or nitrate consuming products.

Happy tank again. Thanks for helping me figure out how to remedy this!

 

[Andy Sager]

Happy tank again. Thanks for helping me figure out how to remedy this!

 

[BTucker2]

 

[BTucker2]

Sorry to bother you again. now my firemouth has hole in the head. started treated with MetroPlex. Anything else i should know or do?

 

[Andy Sager]

You are not a bother. We are all here to help and share our experience.
There is currently a debate over the cause of HITH. Examination has shown that fish with HITH did not always have hexamita present, the previous thought was the cause, making the cause not a disease or pathogen but a case of poor water quality and poor diet being the cause. It has been remedied by increasing water quality ( which you are doing) and make sure you are feeding a varied diet consisting of lots of good protein foods with ample vegetable matter in there as well or foods with chiton ( roughage found in the exoskeleton of Shrimps, Daphnia, Insects, etc.) to aid in digestion and expulsion. I know many people have switched to pelleted foods but my preference is always frozen over dried whenever possible. You can also add a liquid vitamin to the tank or food which has shown to be helpful getting the holes filled in and colored up. When it comes to fish as well as any animal, the better the quality of food that goes in, the better the fish will show health and color and behavior.
I'd also try to keep the nitrate level as low as possible until this remedies. Nitrates are an acid which can hinder the production of the fish's flesh.