I want to switch to salt water aquarium and need some help

[Racoon]

Hi guys at the moment i have cichlid tank. Inside there are Caribsea life rocks (because i want to keep higher ph). And now im decided to go on a higher level. I want salt water reef tank. My question is can i transfer caribsea life rocks to salt water? What should i do first? I was reading on google about this but couldnt get the straight answer. Some say its possible some its not. Any one done this before?
Many thanks

 

[Aiken Drum]

The rock will be fine, the "live" bit won't survive the switch from freshwater to saltwater though.

 

[Racoon]

Even if i cure the rock the live wont be fine?

 

[Aiken Drum]

No. The organisms that make the rock live are suited to freshwater because that's where they have been living. Once the rock is put into saltwater those organisms will die off and ones suited to a saltwater environment will grow in their place. Same as cycling a filter.

When you first bought your live rock, the organisms will have been saltwater organisms. When you put the rock in freshwater those organisms will have died, and ones suited to freshwater will have grown in their place.

 

[Andy Sager]

The nitrifying microbes in freshwater are different strains of the ones for saltwater so you need to use marine live rock that has not been in freshwater for it to be of intended use. You can still add your rock to the marine tank but you can't assume you are not going to have to cycle the tank because your rock came from a cycled FW tank.

 

[Racoon]

Thank you very much, i do understand that fresh water bacteria dies in salt water tank and sickle process will be from the beginning. All i wanted to know or can i make those same rocks to be a live in a salt water tank. Sorry english is not my first language

 

[Aiken Drum]

The rock will become "live" the same way that an aquarium becomes cycled. If you got some live rock from a saltwater aquarium it should speed up the process same as using some filter media from an established filter speeds up the cycling process.

 

[Racoon]

Thank you very much guys

 

[Andy Sager]

Thank you very much guys

Just to make sure, regarding the CaribSea rock you mentioned, is that natural rock or artificial? When I looked up a Caribsea rock, it didn't sound like it was natural rock. It may be porous to allow the microbes to establish on it but unless it is natural calcium or mineral rock, it probably won't do anything for the pH. It will take calcium rock to do that. Natural live rock is usually calcium based or old coral skeleton rock and that is calcium based.

Just a note here, other than cycling the tank saltwater, keeping a saltwater tank for fish is different than freshwater and keeping a reef tank is different yet. You need to learn what it takes for the reef to thrive and not depend on your knowledge of freshwater fish keeping. There are different corals and anemones that need different light spectrums, water flows and additives. Same with plants. Hard corals have different needs from soft corals and large polyp corals are different from small polyp corals. You really need to study up on the subject to be successful.

 

[Aiken Drum]

Caribsea Life Rock is an artificial rock, but it made from aragonite so it's calcium carbonate based and will raise pH the same as natural live rock.

 

[Racoon]

Just to make sure, regarding the CaribSea rock you mentioned, is that natural rock or artificial? When I looked up a Caribsea rock, it didn't sound like it was natural rock. It may be porous to allow the microbes to establish on it but unless it is natural calcium or mineral rock, it probably won't do anything for the pH. It will take calcium rock to do that. Natural live rock is usually calcium based or old coral skeleton rock and that is calcium based.

Just a note here, other than cycling the tank saltwater, keeping a saltwater tank for fish is different than freshwater and keeping a reef tank is different yet. You need to learn what it takes for the reef to thrive and not depend on your knowledge of freshwater fish keeping. There are different corals and anemones that need different light spectrums, water flows and additives. Same with plants. Hard corals have different needs from soft corals and large polyp corals are different from small polyp corals. You really need to study up on the subject to be successful.

I am studying everything now and the rest i think i will learn after i will loose something from salty tank etc like coral or a fish. I want to do soft corals first i heard its easier to take care of. Hard corals is another level will be in a near future.

 

[Andy Sager]

Caribsea Life Rock is an artificial rock, but it made from aragonite so it's calcium carbonate based and will raise pH the same as natural live rock.

Thanks for the info. That's new item since I dealt with CaribSea. I used to have an " insider's connection" to the owner as one of my former boss's designed some of his substrate mixes.

 

[Andy Sager]

I am studying everything now and the rest i think i will learn after i will loose something from salty tank etc like coral or a fish. I want to do soft corals first i heard its easier to take care of. Hard corals is another level will be in a near future.

I kept saltwater tanks for over 30 years. You are always learning something. The object is to not lose the animals. Yes, the plus side to softies is that they tend to be easier. The minus side is that if they die, they can make a big mess in the tank. Just an FYI.

 

[Aiken Drum]

Biohome that make the filter media have just brought a product to market called biorock, which is artificial rock made from the stuff they make their filter media from. It looks like an economical alternative to dead ocean reef rock.

I've seen it used in freshwater aquariums to build those reef like rock structures as it doesn't effect pH the way reef rock would.

 

[Andy Sager]

Biohome that make the filter media have just brought a product to market called biorock, which is artificial rock made from the stuff they make their filter media from. It looks like an economical alternative to dead ocean reef rock.

I've seen it used in freshwater aquariums to build those reef like rock structures as it doesn't effect pH the way reef rock would.

Interesting.

 

[Racoon]

Biohome that make the filter media have just brought a product to market called biorock, which is artificial rock made from the stuff they make their filter media from. It looks like an economical alternative to dead ocean reef rock.

I've seen it used in freshwater aquariums to build those reef like rock structures as it doesn't effect pH the way reef rock would.

I will look into this too. Thank you

 

[Airborne 82nd]

Wait a minute people this whole LIVE rock thing is messing with my head (not hard to do). sounds like it is really just a rock with live things growing on it. I mean they don't call Matrix live Matrix it is just something you try to grow bugs on. What am I missing here? Can this rock move around in the tank? I'm serious here I don't know. I know coral can be live and looks like a rock but I don't think it is a rock.
Edit yes I could google this but I trust the answers here more.

 

[Aiken Drum]

Natural live rock is bits broken off from coral reefs, so its already populated with beneficial bacteria, other micro-organisms, algae, invertebrates, maybe someone coral. It's the foundation of a marine aquarium.

One of the functions of live rock is that it provides your biological filtration for marine aquariums. In addition to that ammonia to nitrite to nitrate functions, live rock is a suitable environment for anaerobic microbes that consume nitrate and expell nitrogen gas, like what matrix claims, but live rock actually does it.

Live rock is quite expensive to buy, I'm not sure on the legalities of harvesting coral reefs, so a lot will be harvested from established aquariums rather than actual coral reefs.

There is artificial live rock, like caribsea life rock where the live bits are artificially introduced too before its bagged up and sold. More ethical than harvesting reefs.

There is dry rock, where the live part has died off. Then there are products like the biorock i mentioned. This is not live at all and is exactly like the matrix, just formed to look like live rock.

There are products you can buy that add in the live bit. Kind of like the bottled bacteria products you buy to help cycle aquariums, but they will also introduce other organisms like algae spores.

 

[Andy Sager]

Wait a minute people this whole LIVE rock thing is messing with my head (not hard to do). sounds like it is really just a rock with live things growing on it. I mean they don't call Matrix live Matrix it is just something you try to grow bugs on. What am I missing here? Can this rock move around in the tank? I'm serious here I don't know. I know coral can be live and looks like a rock but I don't think it is a rock.
Edit yes I could google this but I trust the answers here more.

I'll get a little more technical than Aiken on this.
The definition of " live rock" for fish tanks is coral rock or other suitable rock ( usually from the ocean floor ) that contains living organisms on and in it. In today's market, there are companies that will take " dead" rock, ( rock that has come from the ocean or other suitable rocks and has had everything alive on and in it removed) and seed it in large vats with plants and sponges, etc and nitrifying microbes. Once these dead rocks have these other lifeforms growing on them, they are then sold as " cultured" live rock. There are also importers who get live rock from other countries ( the D.R. is a big exporter of live rock ) through a CITIEs permit and the importer houses this live rock in tanks or containers where it allows anything that died during the transit to dissolve ( for a lack of a better term) and be removed/ washed away from the rock. "Wild" live rock can have anything from plants, sponges, soft corals like Gorgonias, feather dusters, crabs, shrimps, urchins, etc and usually pest worms, pest anemones and the like on/ in them. It also houses nitrifying microbes OR is a porous surface for nitrifying microbes to attach to. So no, the rock is not capable of moving around a tank on it's own but if you don't give an upper level a good foundation underneath it, it can come tumbling down through the movement of the water. So that is how the live rock moves.

The coral we see is actually a living colony of multiple small polyps or a singular large polyp . Most are not mobile however, there are some types ( i.e. Fungia species) that are found on the ocean floor that can move around on their own. These are the mushroom corals, slipper corals, etc. But there are also what are called encrusting corals which are colonies that actually grow on top of existing corals. Blue corals and fire corals are a good example of these. So not all corals stay still, not all corals grow on rocks, not all corals can live next to each other and not all corals have a hard calcium based skeletons. ( And this is the short answer. )