low pH (6.4), high Nitrates (80)

[jenni_dawn]

I've had these readings in my tank for about 3 weeks now, and have lost a few fish (2 cherry barbs, 1 lyretail and 1 tetra). I've read that coral can help increase pH (and lower Nitrates), but I don't have enough knowledge to know if I should go this route. I don't want to use any chemicals (pH 7.0, etc), if I don't have to, and the rest of my fish seem stable so I don't want to shock them with anything too extreme.

I tend to do water changes about once a month. Should I just ramp this up and do a couple days in a row, or add the coral, or something else?

thanks in advance!

 

[Aiken Drum]

Coral wont do anything to help with nitrate. I think you might be getting confused between coral and live rock. Live rock will support anaerobic bacteria that consume nitrate and expel nitrogen gas and is used in the aquascaping of marine aquariums.

Coral is calcium carbonate, and the carbonate bit will disolve in the water, increase the carbonate hardness and in turn stabilise your pH at a higher level. You can use crushed coral in a media bag and put it in your filtration, or mix crushed coral in with your substrate. Cuttlefish bone is another source of calcium carbonate.

Not really sure why you think you need to adjust the pH though because the fish you say died would all suit pH on the acidic side of things.

Your nitrate is high though. You should really target 20ppm, with 40ppm as an upper limit. A monthly water change isnt really a lot, i would look at weekly water changes to get the nitrate down.

How big is your tank? What fish, how many are you keeping? How much water do you change with your monthly water change? How long has it been set up? Do you know your ammonia and nitrite?

While 80ppm nitrate is high, its not exactly a smoking gun. Are you seeing any symptoms with your dead fish?

 

[Andy Sager]

There is a correlation between higher nitrates and lower pH as the acids in the nitrates use up the alkaline buffers ( KH) in the water which then allows the pH to fall.
More frequent water changes will help keep the nitrates down if your tap water ( or whatever replacement water you use) is higher in pH and contains no nitrates in it. Have you checked your Tap water for pH and Nitrates?

 

[jenni_dawn]

Glad I asked on here!

Some answers:

Have you checked your Tap water for pH and Nitrates? I checked them a while ago with my first post here. At that time, the tap water registered at 7.0 pH, .5 ammonia, and zero nitrites and nitrates. Before that post I was using RO water, but it was suggested I just use this tap water.

How big is your tank? 29 gallon

What fish, how many are you keeping? I have been slowly building my community. I currently have 12 total: 9 tetras (3 neon, 2 glo-light, 3 black skirt, 1 white skirt, 1 black neon? - a black something anyway). I also have 1 remaining cherry barb, 1 lyretail and 1 cory catfish.

How much water do you change with your monthly water change? 1/3 - 1/2 a tank

How long has it been set up? A couple of years, although I had a friend "helping me" for the first year or so and things did not go well. One post here and I got things under control...until now.

Do you know your ammonia and nitrite? both are zero.

Are you seeing any symptoms with your dead fish? welll......I did have a molly that didn't seem well (puffy face/eyes/lips) about a month back. I dosed the water with Melafix for the recommended time and then did a couple water changes until the water cleared up (was a little cloudy, but not bad). He ended up not surviving but the of the rest of the fish seemed well.

This tank is actually at my workplace and I was off for the last 10 days or so...the 4-5 fish I mentioned above were lost during that time. I ask folks to check in on them, but what can you do? They didn't seem to realize any were missing, so I don't know what happened to them. I have REALLY been watching the remaining fish today and don't see anything that makes me think there is disease being spread.

A bit more about my process: I typically vacuum/change water once a month. About a week or so later I change the filter (I was told not to do both at the same time). Should I be vacuuming with every change?


Contemplating taking the tank home.......But I love it at work...get stressed, watch the fishes swim!

 

[Andy Sager]

Sorry, I don't usually look up old posts, unless they are part of new postings. Unless you tested the tap water in the past week or so, test it again to confirm that it is the same. Municipal water companies may change water parameters based on time of year and source of water.

 

[jenni_dawn]

Tap water checked this morning. pH is high (7.6), Ammonia is about .25 ppm, Nitrite and Nitrate at zero.

I don't have a test kit for gH, but by the strip tests, it's about 75ish.

 

[Andy Sager]

Tap water checked this morning. pH is high (7.6), Ammonia is about .25 ppm, Nitrite and Nitrate at zero.

I don't have a test kit for gH, but by the strip tests, it's about 75ish.

The ammonia is probably from the chloramine in the water. With that kind of pH and GH ( need to also check Carbonate hardness aka KH )
IME, Tetras do not like big changes in their environment so I would change 5 gallons of water, if possible twice a day at least 8-12 hours apart or at least once a day every day until you get the pH up to 7.6 and the nitrates down to closer to 20ppm. Once you get there, I would test the water after 3 days then 6 days to see how high the nitrates have gotten and adjust your water change schedule to keep the nitrates under 30-40 ppm ( or lower.) You may be able to change water once a week. Maybe you need twice a week. Only your test results will tell you how often. If you need more than twice a week, you are either over stocked ( not likely with what you described unless your filter is inadequate) or you are overfeeding ( something that can cause more ammonia while it decays which leads to higher nitrates ) or you have something else going on in the tank substrate most likely. Remember, that .25PPM of ammonia in your tap water is being converted into nitrates so large volume water changes will only help deplete the nitrate level slightly vs if there was no ammonia in your tap water which would yield the percentage drop that should be happening.

 

[jenni_dawn]

Good morning. I've done the small water changes as suggested and have seen a change in the Nitrates...I'm down to about 20 ppm. However, my pH remains really low at 6.4. Unfortunately, I've lost two more fish (neon tetras) during this process. You mentioned overfeeding...I use an auto-feeder since this tank is in my office and I'm not there on the weekends. I have it set to every 24 hours. Should I have it set to 8 or 12 and lower the amount?

 

[Andy Sager]

Good morning. I've done the small water changes as suggested and have seen a change in the Nitrates...I'm down to about 20 ppm. However, my pH remains really low at 6.4. Unfortunately, I've lost two more fish (neon tetras) during this process. You mentioned overfeeding...I use an auto-feeder since this tank is in my office and I'm not there on the weekends. I have it set to every 24 hours. Should I have it set to 8 or 12 and lower the amount?

There is a plus and minus to having that lower pH. At that level, any ammonia will become non toxic ammonium so not a concern. The lower pH will also slow the nitrification process which means it should take longer for nitrate levels to rise. These are the pluses. The minus is that certain fish will not do well in lower pH water so it will limit the fish you can keep in the tank.
It's a bit unusual to lower your nitrates but not raise your pH so something is still acidifying your water. Possibly it's the CO2 from the fish or the amount of food not getting eaten? When you clean the tank, are you finding pockets of uneaten food or pockets of poo? Have you had your GH and KH tested?

As for the feeding, I don't usually compare fish to humans but in this case, your feeding regimen is like you eating breakfast, lunch and dinner all at the same time. It's not a good plan. Animals need to eat multiple times throughout the day so I would take the total amount of food you feed in a day and split that amount into the number of times you feed the fish. For example: If you feed 2 times per day, cut the amount in half for each feeding. Feeding 4 times per day: cut the full amount into quarters., etc. Think of it like a pizza pie. Each slice represents how much of the pie you are eating at each sitting but in the end, you only ate 1 whole pizza. If possible, adjust the feeder to feed 3 or 4 times during the hours the lights are on. Using a number like " Every 8 hours" will mean the fish are getting fed at night for at least one feeding while they are sleeping. They won't eat it later if it's already starting to decay so it's based on the hours your light is on.

 

[jenni_dawn]

My feeder isn't that fancy, BUT, I could set for every twelve hours at 730...and then feed once during the day myself.

I've never really looked for pockets of anything when cleaning, but if I had to guess, I probably overfeed, especially since the number of fish is fluctuating so much.

...and I don't have anything to test the GH or KH. Should I get a test kit for those?

 

[Andy Sager]

My feeder isn't that fancy, BUT, I could set for every twelve hours at 730...and then feed once during the day myself.

I've never really looked for pockets of anything when cleaning, but if I had to guess, I probably overfeed, especially since the number of fish is fluctuating so much.

...and I don't have anything to test the GH or KH. Should I get a test kit for those?

Either that or take a sample of water to your local fish store and ask if they will test it for you. If they do, make sure you get real numbers for the values and not " It's fine" as an answer. "Fine " is subjective but the values determine what fish you should put into your water.