Advice on Setting up a 100g Tanganyikan community

[Wy Renegade]

Last year at the end of the school year, I had a heater malfunction and lost my 100 tank with OB Blueberry Zebras that I had been keeping and breeding for years. We tore the tank completely down and it has been sitting empty. I'm toying with the idea of a Tanganyikan set-up this time around, as I love the N. brichardi and like the concept of a community cichlid tank.

However I'm also not a fan of canister filters. Generally I use UGF in my large cichlids tanks. From what I've seen however, most recommendations on the Tanganyikan's recommend a sand substrate which won't work with the UGF.

If I were to go this route, what sand do you recommend, how much and what filter(s) would I need for a community system?

Also, what fish would do be compatable with the N. brichardi?

Also, can I include some of the upside down catfish and what species do you all recommend?

TIA

 

[Wyomingite]

IME, most Tangs don't have nearly the aggression level Malawis have. In a community tank that size with plenty of rockwork, any of the smaller Neolamprologus, Julidochromis or Telmatochromis species will work. All these species form pairs rather tahn bein' harem breeders and breeding pairs claim a much smaller territory than a male mbuna does. Stay away from N. tretocephalus, N. sexfacsiatus and N. tetracanthus unless yer willin' to do at least 6 of any one. They are larger (6"+) and tend to be more aggressive. They are much more mbuna-like than other lamps in behavior and keepin' 'em in groups helps reduce aggression. Either Altolamprologus compressiceps or A. calvus will fit in as well.

After that, ya could add some goby cichlids and a school of Cyprichromis or Paracyprichromis species. If ya stick with smaller species, ya could potentially add a colony of shell-dwellers. All in all, compatibility with tangs is a lot easier than with Malawis.

The Tropheus sp. do best in groups. Ya could alternately do a colony of one Tropheus sp. (16-20) and fill in with a few of the smaller lamps and julies as "accent" species.

Filtration-wise, I treat Tanganyikan tanks the same as Malawi tanks even though I usually don't stock 'em nearly as heavily. I target 8-10 x the volume of the tank in gph of filtration. I'm not a big fan of canister filters either and use Emperor and Penguin bio-wheel filters. My preference. I neither wanna start nor get into another discussion of the pros and cons of canisters vs. HOBs or the merits of one brand vs. another. Just statin' what I use, I like, and have success with.

I'm in a position where if I wanna expand beyond lemon cichlids, brichardis and Altolamprologus compressiceps, I'm gonna hafta order on-line. I'd rather buy locally, but the nearest LFSs are in Colorado 50-100 miles away and they don't wanna play ball with orderin' tangs for me. Hope ya have better luck in that department than me.

WYite

 

[Mogurako]

I had a. 90 gallon with tons of rock work and my Julie's where unholy terrors and would chase down and tear up almost any fish.

 

[Wy Renegade]

IME, most Tangs don't have nearly the aggression level Malawis have. In a community tank that size with plenty of rockwork, any of the smaller Neolamprologus, Julidochromis or Telmatochromis species will work. All these species form pairs rather tahn bein' harem breeders and breeding pairs claim a much smaller territory than a male mbuna does. Stay away from N. tretocephalus, N. sexfacsiatus and N. tetracanthus unless yer willin' to do at least 6 of any one. They are larger (6"+) and tend to be more aggressive. They are much more mbuna-like than other lamps in behavior and keepin' 'em in groups helps reduce aggression. Either Altolamprologus compressiceps or A. calvus will fit in as well.

After that, ya could add some goby cichlids and a school of Cyprichromis or Paracyprichromis species. If ya stick with smaller species, ya could potentially add a colony of shell-dwellers. All in all, compatibility with tangs is a lot easier than with Malawis.

The Tropheus sp. do best in groups. Ya could alternately do a colony of one Tropheus sp. (16-20) and fill in with a few of the smaller lamps and julies as "accent" species.

Filtration-wise, I treat Tanganyikan tanks the same as Malawi tanks even though I usually don't stock 'em nearly as heavily. I target 8-10 x the volume of the tank in gph of filtration. I'm not a big fan of canister filters either and use Emperor and Penguin bio-wheel filters. My preference. I neither wanna start nor get into another discussion of the pros and cons of canisters vs. HOBs or the merits of one brand vs. another. Just statin' what I use, I like, and have success with.

I'm in a position where if I wanna expand beyond lemon cichlids, brichardis and Altolamprologus compressiceps, I'm gonna hafta order on-line. I'd rather buy locally, but the nearest LFSs are in Colorado 50-100 miles away and they don't wanna play ball with orderin' tangs for me. Hope ya have better luck in that department than me.

WYite

Thanks for the detailed response! Without getting into the merrits of one or the other, my concern was in regards to a HOB being able to adequetly handle the filtration, and it appears that you've had success with that, which was what I was looking for. I'm sure that I'll find I'm in the same boat in terms of finding specific species. My issue becomes even a little bigger in that the airport here is pretty limited, so I'll have to have them shipped UPS or Fed-Ex.

I had a. 90 gallon with tons of rock work and my Julie's where unholy terrors and would chase down and tear up almost any fish.

Thanks for the info, what species of Juliochromis were you keeping?

 

[Mogurako]

I was keeping Julidochromis ornatus, I don't remember what collection point it was. I want to say I was maybe " Congo Yellow".

Tangs didn't seem to have have to large of a bioload. You may be fine using some of the larger aquaclear HOB. All airports should accept in air cargo so you should be able to have fish shipped that route, some online retailers wont ship ups/FedEx unless its really overpriced overnight shipping.

 

[Wyomingite]

I had a. 90 gallon with tons of rock work and my Julie's where unholy terrors and would chase down and tear up almost any fish.

Really? I've had ornatus and marlieri. Never had any issues with the ornatus with shell-dwellers or lamps as long as the other fish stayed outta their cave. Now that I think 'bout it, though, the marlieri were quite a bit more aggressive in defending their territory, though they never killed anything.

The other thing I forgot to mention is I try to keep breeding pairs outta community tanks with multiple species. Once they pair up they are as tenacious as any other cichlid in defending their brood and territory. Just like convicts, it is amazing how big their territory becomes once they have a brood.

Brichardis also are unique in that the parents will allow juvies from prior spawns to stick around and help raise new broods, in case ya didn't know that. Once ya get 3 or 4 subadults helpin' take care of broods, they can take over a tank pretty quick. The last time I bred them, I was keepin' 'em with three breeding pairs of Telmatochromis brichardi. After the third or fourth brood with two subadults helpin' the breeders, the T. brichardi stopped breeding completely and never came outta hiding. Finally ended up lettin' the N. brichardi have the entire 55 gallon tank completely and moving the Telmatochromis to a different tank

WYite

 

[Wy Renegade]

I was keeping Julidochromis ornatus, I don't remember what collection point it was. I want to say I was maybe " Congo Yellow".

Tangs didn't seem to have have to large of a bioload. You may be fine using some of the larger aquaclear HOB. All airports should accept in air cargo so you should be able to have fish shipped that route, some online retailers wont ship ups/FedEx unless its really overpriced overnight shipping.

Interesting, that is the species recommended for a community tank over on the cichlid site, guess I'll have to keep an eye on them if I get them.

Really? I've had ornatus and marlieri. Never had any issues with the ornatus with shell-dwellers or lamps as long as the other fish stayed outta their cave. Now that I think 'bout it, though, the marlieri were quite a bit more aggressive in defending their territory, though they never killed anything.

The other thing I forgot to mention is I try to keep breeding pairs outta community tanks with multiple species. Once they pair up they are as tenacious as any other cichlid in defending their brood and territory. Just like convicts, it is amazing how big their territory becomes once they have a brood.

Brichardis also are unique in that the parents will allow juvies from prior spawns to stick around and help raise new broods, in case ya didn't know that. Once ya get 3 or 4 subadults helpin' take care of broods, they can take over a tank pretty quick. The last time I bred them, I was keepin' 'em with three breeding pairs of Telmatochromis brichardi. After the third or fourth brood with two subadults helpin' the breeders, the T. brichardi stopped breeding completely and never came outta hiding. Finally ended up lettin' the N. brichardi have the entire 55 gallon tank completely and moving the Telmatochromis to a different tank

WYite

Yeah, I was aware of that, but forgot to factor that in in my planning. Over on the cichlid site they recommend Chalinochromis brichardi rather than N. brichardi for a community tank, any experience with them?

 

[Wyomingite]

Ugh! Too many brichardis! No experience with C. brichardi. I also have read they do well in communities, but they do push 5"-6", IIRC.

WYite

 

[Wy Renegade]

Ok in looking through the cichlid site, they had the following recommendations for a community type tank of 75 gallons vs. 135 gallons;

75-gallon aquarium

Open Water:
12 Cyprichromis leptosoma

Rocks & Caves:
2 Eretmodus cyanostictus
2 Julidochromis ornatus
2 Chalinochromis brichardi

Shells:
3 Lamprologus occelatus
2 Neolamprologus brevis

Open Sand:
6 Xenotilapia ochrygenys

135-gallon aquarium

Open Water:
20 Cyp. sp. "leptosoma Jumbo"

Rocks & Caves:
8 Tanganicodus irsacae
4 Julidochromis regani
2 Neolamprologus leleupi

Shells:
3 Neolamprologus calliurus
5 Lamprologus meleagris

Open Sand:
8 Enantiopus melanogenys
-OR-
4 Cyathopharynx furcifer

Anybody have experience with a community type Tanganyikan tank and know if something like this is possible? Or do spawning realities render it inopperable? While it sounds cool the different adult sizes of the fish make me question the plausability.

 

[Mogurako]

I was advised against mixing Xenotilaipa and Shellies when I was setting up my tang community tank. The Xenos are pretty skittish and need a good amount of open floor space.

 

[Wyomingite]

The recommended 3-4 shells/fish for the shellies eats up a lotta real estate, as well. The behaviors of Enantiopus sp. are very similar to Xenotilapia sp.

Other than that, yes it's possible. It's a far cry from mbuna. That's one reason I want to start keepin' more tangs, not to mention that after years of mainly Malawis and mostly mbuna, I'm kinda burnt out on 'em.

WYite

 

[Wy Renegade]

The recommended 3-4 shells/fish for the shellies eats up a lotta real estate, as well. The behaviors of Enantiopus sp. are very similar to Xenotilapia sp.

Other than that, yes it's possible. It's a far cry from mbuna. That's one reason I want to start keepin' more tangs, not to mention that after years of mainly Malawis and mostly mbuna, I'm kinda burnt out on 'em.

WYite

Indeed! The complete loss of my entire stock of Blueberry OB zebras which I've been maintaining for 20 years now was a little hard to take. I'm sure I could probably restart by aquiring fish from those I provided them to over the years, but I just feel like it is time for something different. The idea of a biotype community display tank just appeals to me. Finding a source for the Tangs may well prove to be the greatest issue however, as even many of the online sources are listing the specific species I'm looking for. If we both find some different species, we may have to set up an exchange of fry down the road LOL.

Oh well, got to get the basics out of the way first anyway, so on to the substrate and rockwork.

From what I've seen sand is the way to go, I've fairly easy access to dry aragonite sand and fairly large bags are inexpensive, so I'm thinking I'll go that route. Any suggestions on depth?

For the rock work, I'm planning to use a combination of shell and slate, as well as some drilled rock I've used in the mbuna tanks over the years.

I like the idea of being able to do some plants, but saw that dim light is recommended for the fish, so I'm thinking about a surface plant like duckweed to help keep the lighting dimmed down.

Anything else I need to take into consideration?

 

[Wyomingite]

A fry exchange at some time sounds good.

1.5 inches or so is what I do for sand. IME, tangs don't dig anywhere near as much as mbuna. I've never kept plants in any Rift Valley tanks, mainly 'cuz mbuna eat anything and everything I put in, even val and duckweed. I usually only have 3 or 4 Tanganyikan tanks set-up, so never messed with it. May hafta try some anubias and val again.

Sounds like ya got a good handle on things, to me.

WYite