Jaguars

[c_starfish]

I was wondering if I can put any other cichlids in with my jaguar cichlids? There are currently two synspilums in there and they get on reasonably well, but I have to say I don't like them very much...

 

[mdawg75]

wow how big of a tank do you have ??? and understood that some people have different tastes otherwise it would be a boring world but with saying that, why do you not like the synspilums? They are a beautiful colored fish.

 

[c_starfish]

35 gallon I think (we don't use gallons in aus) but the biggest jags are only 4 inches long. My synspilums aren't very colorful, one is almost all silver and the other is very dark.

 

[5x5]

The Jaguars I am familiar with (Parachromis Managuense) grow up to 20 inches and would never work in a 35 Gallon. Are you referring to a different species?

Parachromis managuense - Jaguar Cichlid

 

[garfy]

Jaguar`s can grow up to 55 cm and a single jaguar would need at least 125g.
For 2 jaguar`s i would recommend at least 180g.
Depending on the individual it may be possible to keep them with other fish such as pleco`s and maybe silver dollars,but i think they are best kept on their own unless you have a very big tank since they are predators and their main diet in the wild would be other fish (any other fish).
At the moment they may seem fine but as they grow they will become aggressive and your tank is just not big enough for them.
Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but they will not be happy in a tank of this size.

 

[c_starfish]

I am aware that I'll need to upgrade and eliminate several fish from the mix if I plan to keep them as they grow larger. I am aware of their fully grown size and don't plan on having them crammed in like sardines. At the moment they are juvenile and fine.

 

[garfy]

If you are so aware then you don't need any advice.Enjoy your fish

 

[c_starfish]

I'm sorry but every time I post in a thread I get people making me feel cruel and stupid, and I'd responded to someone just prior to you who was not quite so polite in telling me that my fish would grow. Didn't mean to be snappy!

The cichlids were all given to me by a breeder friend in an attempt to tame another aggressive fish by 'overstocking the tank'. His words, not mine. I've gotten rid of most but I'm enjoying the jaguars at the moment.

 

[Herotilapia_Multispinosa]

IMO fish should be stocked to the adult size of the fish (not flaming or anything) But the sooner you could upgrade the better. how big are you thinking of upgrading to?

 

[steez]

I'm sorry but every time I post in a thread I get people making me feel cruel and stupid, and I'd responded to someone just prior to you who was not quite so polite in telling me that my fish would grow. Didn't mean to be snappy!

The cichlids were all given to me by a breeder friend in an attempt to tame another aggressive fish by 'overstocking the tank'. His words, not mine. I've gotten rid of most but I'm enjoying the jaguars at the moment.

I think you're kind of misunderstanding it a bit. Two jaguars require a very very big tank. They become huge... putting them in a small tank and adding two to try to eliminate aggression isn't the answer. They need room to swim, their bio-load is very large and you'll never be able to keep the parameters low enough.

Examples of overstocking to reduce aggression would be stocking a smaller tank such as a 40g breeder with Mbuna's. You'll need to overstock it because there's not enough footprint for them all to establish territories. In a small tank like that, one male can easily take it over. But if you overstock it, it makes it so the fish can't really establish a territory, therefor they will "get along". This kind of setup requires a close eye, you have to weed out troublemakers, sex them right and be aware of how the fish act.



Also, people on this forum are just giving you honest advice. Getting defensive over it isn't going to help the fish at all. We're not calling the animal cops on you, we're just telling you what you are doing isn't going to work... There's exceptions, sometimes advice can go either way, but in this case you are definitely headed for disaster with these guys in that tank.


You say that you don't like them much, and you have a smaller tank anyways. Why not just re-home them and get something else? It's a win-win situation. Many communities can go into a 30g tank. If you're set on Cichlids, you could do a dwarf species such as Apistogramma or shellies.

 

[c_starfish]

I apologize for getting defensive, it was early, I got several posts from people telling me 'my fish will get big'... I appreciate advice as long as the tone of the message doesn't imply that I'm a horrible or stupid person! (which admittedly the one in this thread didn't, but I was already cranky). Anyway, sorry!

The reason for the jags was because I have a scat who I haven't been able to find a single tankmate for. The breeder gave me the cichlids thinking it would stop the scat from bullying everything that moves (and possibly because he wanted to get rid of some). And scat seems to get on well with the jaguars, unlike ANY other fish I've tried him with.

I'm really getting to like the jags, 2 are babies and 2 are getting big, about 12cm now (there's a photo below of one of the larger ones). I'd like to keep the scat and the 2 bigger jags, and rehome the 2 remaining synspilums and the smaller jags. Will those 3 fish and the bottom feeders be alright until I get a larger aquarium? I haven't had any problems with ammonia or nitrates, I do partial water changes at least once a week, and the jags have their own territories.

They seem to have plenty of 'space', but I guess that's not the issue. I'd appreciate your opinion.

 

[c_starfish]

One jag lives in a rock in the back left, the other lives under the mandrake root, and everyone else roams around, except they're all hiding right now because I just fed them and scat chases them all into hiding... That's him on the left.

 

[steez]

I'm sure they'll be totally fine for now. Do you plan on getting a 200g tank, or close to it? They grow fast, remember! My oscar grew to about 7 inches in 4 months.


So from what I see here, you have 4 jags and 3 scats and you plan on keeping 2 jags and 1 scat? What bottom feeders?



No worries, you're being very respectful and no one is going to have problems with you . I think some people snap a bit because a lot of posts people just refuse to listen and are just not constructive at all. That kind of makes people give up early lol. You seem that you are trying to do what is best for your fish, and that's all AA wants.

 

[c_starfish]

I have
4 jags (2 big, 1 med, 1 small)
1 scat
2 synspilums (which I am trying to rehome, I gave away 3 females the other day)
4 clown loaches
2 gibbiceps
1 Pictus
And a couple of bristlenose.

I want to keep everything but the synspilums and smaller jags, at least for now, and will upgrade my aquarium accordingly as they grow.

It sounds like a lot when you write it down, though it doesn't look like many because you don't see many of the catfish.

You're going to tell me it's too many arent you, lol.

 

[c_starfish]

So I'll have 3 big fish and like 10 bottom feeders when I rehome the others.

 

[steez]

Yeah.... too many.

You have too many conflicting bottom feeders, for instance Pictus need at least a school of 6. I'd recommend keeping to 1 type of bottom feeder and one type of cichlid. You're going to need a huge tank for 2 jags.. I don't know the compatibility of Jags and Scats. I'm sure the Jag will kill the Scat...


Fish really change a lot when they grow, you shouldn't try to plan your tank around them when they are babies. They become much more aggressive as they grow. Research each fish individually and see what their adult size is needed and their fish compatibility.


EDIT: I know you like your fish, but think of rehoming as saving them. They will end up killing each other or dying from stress/water conditions, at least if they get a good home you know they are still alive

 

[c_starfish]

I had a nice little community tank with angelfish and gouramis and a blue ram, but then about 8 or 10 months ago I got the scat as a baby thanks to some bad advice from my lfs, and changed EVERYTHING to try to accommodate him because I liked him so much. The jags are the only fish he's ever gotten on with, but it looks like even that won't last! I had an archer in there with him but he chased the poor thing to misery. I've been tempted to rehome him to many times and go back to a nice, peaceful SIMPLE community tank, but I just can't give him up!

I don't know what to do

 

[steez]

It's really hard!! Seriously, anyone who has read about fish realizes how much work you have to put into it. You have to read a lot and just research about what fish work.

It might work now, but I promise it won't be for long..

And man, don't feel bad. Most people on here have gone through the same stuff. But making good decisions is what separates good fish-keepers from the bad ones. I had to re-home lots of fish so far from listening to my LFS. They really have no idea it seems like(most of the time).

Yesterday I overheard a young man and his girlfriend buying a 20g tank, I heard oscar tossed around.. when the employee left to get him something, I asked him what he was planning on (in a nice way). He says "oh I'm getting that black Tiger Oscar up there, he's really neat"

I explained that the tiger oscars grow really big, and require a MINIMUM of 55g tank(that's even pushing it), showed him on my hands how big they get.

He goes " ****... why is this guy telling me it's ok?"

I said because they need sales.

He made the decision to get the tank, but leave the oscar. He said he was gonna go read online.

I felt like I saved that oscar, and that guy a lot of frustration.



ANYWAYS... You're gonna either have to invest a lot of money for those two Jag's, or just take them back and get something peaceful. You can really do some neat stuff in 30g.

 

[steez]

Or... just keep 1 jag! You won't have to invest as much money / space. A 125g tank on craigslist might not be too bad. Just remember that when you keep two, you have to increase your tank size by a LOT.


With a single Jag, you could have a really big and cool Common Pleco in there with him too!

 

[c_starfish]

Do you think one jag and one scat is okay?
And I'll rehome the bristlenoses. But i cant decide which other catfish to remove... It'll be harder to give away my Pictus, I've had him a long time! But I REALLY want the gibbiceps, I'm looking forward to them getting nice and big.
You'd think I'd be used to giving up fish, I've rehomed more than I can count thanks to my cranky scat!

I'm glad you saved that Oscar, but I hate to think how many others end up going home in tiny aquariums... I'd LOVE to have a nice big tiger Oscar, maybe one day.

Do you have a photo of yours?