accidental syphoning sucks!!!!!

[blancoh2o]

A couple days ago I shut down my pumps to apply some Joes Juice and was not concentrating on the water level of my sump. Then I heard the sound of water pouring out of somewhere. Low and behold, my sump was overflowing. I never thought that this would happen due to the placement of my returns. WRONG......

WARNING..... if your return are lower in your tank than your overflow, you have the potential for a syphon to develop when your pumps are shut down. As the water level drops in your tank, the syphon will start sucking water out of your returns until air can find its way into the system.

I think I have fixed this from happening again by drilling a small hole in my low return near the normal operating water line. Now when the water level drops, it should suck air rather than water.

BTW... Joe's Juice did kill the Aipstasia.....AWESOME!

 

[blancoh2o]

 

[Biggen]

Ouch!!

When I first setup my tank, I actually overflowed the water out of the tank! I had a CPR overflow and forgot to turn the PH on to run the thing.

 

[cj10488]

I think we all have done something like this at one time or another.. When I hard piped my plumbing into my tank I didnt realize why the hole was on the return line that was included so I didnt bother putting a hole into the PVC when I piped it.. the first time I shut off my main pump it dawned on me as I sat and watched my sump overflow frantically trying to stop it.. I thought to myself "Thats what that hole was for" So not really having the time right then I figured before I shut that thing off again I need to drill a hole.. Halloween night I took the kids out and the city blew a transformer and I realized I still hadnt drilled that hole.. I frantically jumped into the car and Drove like h3ll to get home and stop it from draining half my tank.. Well I got home and I was too late.. The very next morning when i woke up I drilled the hole.. Thank God I live in an Apt that way I dont have to put up with all the water damage I have caused... Seems when we have aquariums we somehow always end up flooding something (Or atleast I do)

James

 

[pecan2phat]

If you don't want to drill a hole in the return pipe, you can add a check valve right before the hard piping begins also.

 

[Brad]

back siphon into sump...

I lay awake at night for hours trying to come up with a way to prevent back siphon...and came up with that "hole in the return pipe" idea. (I could have saved some sleep if I had been active on this site at the time.... )

Anyway... I didn't drill a large enough hole. When I tested for back siphon, the siphon action was so strong that the sucking of air into the siphon still did not stop the siphon.

Bottom line: I put in a check valve...AND...I never run the water level in the sump higher than the amount that a full reverse siphon will pull back into the sump. (the ultimate failsafe)

 

[Biggen]

Bottom line: I put in a check valve...AND...I never run the water level in the sump higher than the amount that a full reverse siphon will pull back into the sump. (the ultimate failsafe)

Same here. Even if the water continued siphoning past the siphon break, my sump could still hand the volume of water. It would be close, but it would hold it...

 

[Brad]

Halloween flood

...a small piece of just about anything would have sucked over the return pipe would have stopped the siphon while you drove to the store.

...you should also consider adding a flow valve/union to the return pipe just above the return pump. Normally, you would use this to shut off the return and disconnect the pump for servicing. On Halloween, you could have valved the return shut, stopping the siphon.

If the return pump is external to the sump, you would also need a valve/union on the input side so that you could remove the pump. (My return pump is submerged in the sump so I don't have this need)

 

[pdwire]

stories like these are why I have been hesitant to add a sump!

 

[MadManMac]

I love my integrated sump! I know I lose some main tank volume and it does take up space, but no water ever leaves the tank ad nothing has to be drilled or plumbed.

 

[pdwire]

What is a integrated sump??

 

[Brad]

More on sumps...

...sounds like an integrated sump is one that is actually inside the main aquarium...more of a refugium than a sump. The entire reason that I put a sump in place was to add water volume and hide all the heaters, probes, skimmer etc. etc.

As a final security device I'm now adding a float switch in the sump that will shut off all the pumps if the water level in the sump does anything unusual.

I think the benefits of a sump outweigh the potential problems. You just have to think the scenarios through carefully.

 

[Brad]

flood protection...

... so the final protection is in place. I've wired up a float switch that will stop the sump return pump in the event that the sump water level drops. (if the sump water level is dropping, it would suggest that the siphon has failed and you had better stop the return pump fast..)

Now I can sleep at night and when I hear funny water noises I can relax knowing everything is OK.

 

[cj10488]

if the sump water level is dropping, it would suggest that the siphon has failed and you had better stop the return pump fast..

I think this would be a bad Idea unless you also have a Float switch to replace Evaporated water.. I would suggest just drilling your return line just below the waterline in your tank.. Or putting on a flap valve so that water can only flow 1 direction.. That would be the safest method for both your livestock and your floor.. FWIW most siphoning happens when the power is already off therefor your return would already be off.. The flooding usually happens at the sump level do it it being lower than the tank..

HTH<
James

 

[Brisc0]

I like the check valve myself. I put one directly above the return on the pump, its good for two things. 1. Water can't run back down and 2. having it that low on the plumbing leaves the return plumbing flooded so there is not an explosion of bubbles when I restart the pump.

 

[Brad]

Safer is better..

[/quote]
I think this would be a bad Idea unless you also have a Float switch to replace Evaporated water.. I would suggest just drilling your return line just below the waterline in your tank.. Or putting on a flap valve so that water can only flow 1 direction..

You misunderstand the function of the float switch. It is NOT there to prevent the reverse flow of water back INTO the sump. It is there to prevent the aquarium from overflowing in the event that the overflow siphon box stops.

Imagine that a large snail finds his way into the return pipe, or something caused the aquarium return siphon to stop. The return pump continues to pump water INTO the aquarium. In my case, the aquarium begins to overflow in under 30 seconds. The dropping sump water level triggers the float switch to stop the return pump before this happens.

Yes... if I didn't compensate for evaporation, this could also cause the sump level to drop and the pump to stop. At least I would be dry while I figured out why the sump level dropped.

If you are running a bottom drilled tank where the water falls down through the bottom of the tank, there is less to worry about. But if you are running a siphon overflow box you have to have a plan to prevent overflow if the siphon action fails.