Amazing Ammonia

[KimAnnKitz]

Did you read my post?

Thank you! Yes I did, but I had some additional questions about the plants and the sand. I understand that I am still cycling. The ammonia does go up if I skip water changes. I was not home today and unable to do a water change so I'm sure I will have to do one tomorrow (today actually) as early as possible. The ammonia is high enough (or something else is wrong) that it DOES kill Red Cherry Shrimp. My LFS (30 miles) only had a HUGE bad of crushed coral, so I will have to order some from somewhere so that I can get to work on the PH.

I wanted to make sure that I addressed all the questions and concerns of everyone who has been kind enough to post. I am also just beginning to cycle another 5 gallon tank and am a little unsure of what plants I can add, if any, and if snails are ok to cycle with. I'm pretty sure I just can't add water and wait.

 

[Caliban07]

Thank you! Yes I did, but I had some additional questions about the plants and the sand. I understand that I am still cycling. The ammonia does go up if I skip water changes. I was not home today and unable to do a water change so I'm sure I will have to do one tomorrow (today actually) as early as possible. The ammonia is high enough (or something else is wrong) that it DOES kill Red Cherry Shrimp. My LFS (30 miles) only had a HUGE bad of crushed coral, so I will have to order some from somewhere so that I can get to work on the PH.

I wanted to make sure that I addressed all the questions and concerns of everyone who has been kind enough to post. I am also just beginning to cycle another 5 gallon tank and am a little unsure of what plants I can add, if any, and if snails are ok to cycle with. I'm pretty sure I just can't add water and wait.

I'm not really a plant person. I stick to the easy ones to keep. Ammonia will not affect plants in a negative way as this is a nitrogenous source to help them grow.

Sand is much easier to clean as you can just vacuum the top layer. It's too fine to allow detritus to fall to the bottom of the tank and almost all fish would prefer this substrate.

My guess you could use snails to cycle the tank but the bacteria will only grow to match the waste output of your snails so when you add fish, ammonia will rise again until the bacteria go grow to support the bioload of the new additions. That's why people do fishless cycles, so they can build a biological bacterial filter to support a full stocking of fish.

You can also use baking soda to raise ph BUT you must add it slowly so you don't get a massive ph swing.

Use this calculator to see how much you need to add but still undercut this recommendation at first just to be on the safe side. Add the recommended amount for the full tank then half it and add it to your new water every time you do a 50% water change.

http://reef.diesyst.com/cf/alkalinitycf.html

 

[Caliban07]

Actually to use that calculator properly you will need the API test for kh.

Might not be that simple.

 

[KimAnnKitz]

Actually to use that calculator properly you will need the API test for kh.

Might not be that simple.

Thanks. I am kind of afraid of raising the ph with baking soda after the bang up job I'm doing with cycling the tank . Think I will just let it ride until the crushed coral I found on ebay makes it to me next week. Then I'll have the issue of what to put it in and where to put it in my tank as my filter media compartment is pretty darn full. Gosh. What did I get myself into?

 

[Caliban07]

Yes. It's a common misconception that all tropical fish need is water and a heater. I did it myself! But don't worry, it is an extremely rewarding hobby and everyone is here to help so don't be afraid to ask questions.

You could remove the carbon from the filter as this has other uses that you don't really need at the moment and place a mesh bag of crushed coral in there.

 

[KimAnnKitz]

Thanks again! I recently replaced the carbon with Seachem Purigen in the filter. I read some good stuff on it and it can be used for several months and then "recharged" and reused. It make the water spectacularly clear! Here's a paragraph from the website:

"Purigen® is a premium synthetic adsorbent that is unlike any other filtration product. It is not a mixture of ion exchangers or adsorbents, but a unique macro-porous synthetic polymer that removes soluble and insoluble impurities from water at a rate and capacity that exceeds all others by over 500%. Purigen® controls ammonia, nitrites and nitrates by removing nitrogenous organic waste that would otherwise release these harmful compounds. Purigen’s™ impact on trace elements is minimal. It significantly raises redox. It polishes water to unparalleled clarity. Purigen® darkens progressively as it exhausts, and is easily renewed by treating with bleach. Purigen® is designed for both marine and freshwater use. "

So far I really like it and don't want to remove it from the tank.

 

[Pandicorn]

Ok. I'm going to try to address all the concerns in one post. I don't have a spare tank for the betta and I would hate to put him in a bowl temporarily because he has been in this tank for 5 weeks. I have another tank that I JUST filled and it is doing a fishless cycle. So let's just say I have learned my lesson. The betta in the ammonia laden tank is an expensive fish so I don't want him to die. The oldest of my tanks is about 8 months, so I am new to the hobby. Not knowing any better, I never tested that first tank, just did weekly water changes. That betta is happy and healthy -- especially for a $5 Walmart betta. I really only got concerned and learned about water testing when I started killing RCS. I don't mean to sound heartless but I really didn't know any better until I started reading and reading and reading......I just wanted to save a betta...now I have 4. I feel bad that I may be harming my gorgeous fish. I suppose I could go pick up a temporary bowl. I have a tiny spare heater and small spare filter I could put in it. But then there's snails and the plants in the 5 gallon also.

Someone asked if I use PRIME. I do, but I'm not positive it like it. I was using Jungle Right Start before I started reading about Prime and liked it a lot. Actually was using Right Start and Nutrafin Cycle and like them both. Only changed because of opinions on here. Right now, however, I am using PRIME and STABILITY.

I have read that the ph is kind of low. How can I raise ph safely and slowly? Limestone? Crushed Coral? I'm not sure the Fluval media compartment has any more room for additional media. It is a big sponge with two cutouts for additional media. Right now I have bio balls and Purigen in the sponge. Purigen replaced the carbon in that filter and I am in the process of replacing all the carbon in my other tanks with it.

Next. Is cycling hard on the plants? I have several plants in the tank with ammonia. I have lost one anubius but the other plants are doing pretty well. Also, in the new tank that is cycling I know it's best to dose it with pure ammonia, but I'm not sure where I could find any. I live in a smallish town and have to drive a half hour + for supplies...and not sure where in that area I would buy the ammonia. Can I cycle with some ramshorn snails that have become pests or will they die (I'm not really concerned if they do - I've been picking they babies out and letting them die before disposing of them... I feel so cruel! BUT I would have about 50 now if I had't done this.) I am still somewhat confused about cycling, but know I need ammonia. I also have mystery snails and have temporarily placed one of them in the new tank but I am concerned about him. He is just sitting near the top of the tank and was normally very, very active. He's mot even bothering the food I placed in that tank for him. Obviously I am not very good at the cycling thing even after MUCH reading on the subject. HELP!

for all the help so far. Advice from real people who have had the same problems is so valuable!

No, they will not hurt your plants at all, they will benefit. There are so many nutrients, that it's like a feast for them!


Cycling 45 Gallon. ???

 

[Kushgodrex]

Use tetra safe start, I can vouch and say I have only had 2 deaths and that was clown loaches. It detoxifies ammonia, and put massive amounts of BB(beneficial bacteria) covering in non toxic ammonia, but you cannot do water changes until you are cycled, bettas are pretty hardy, so you should be fine leaving him In there. It takes about 2-3 weeks to cycle. And don't use water conditioner, it will kill your BB

 

[Kushgodrex]

I've used it on 8 tanks, I generally only use hardy fish to cycle it though. Plecos mollies, feeder fish, etc.

 

[Kushgodrex]

Also, if your ammonia reaches an unsafe level, tetra states that you can do a water change, but you need to redose

 

[Sgtdap]

Did you do a head count when your shrimp died? If one is hiding somewhere dead it could be another source for your high levels of ammonia. I've read you can fishless cycle a tank with just a dead shrimp decomposing in there!

 

[KimAnnKitz]

Did you do a head count when your shrimp died? If one is hiding somewhere dead it could be another source for your high levels of ammonia. I've read you can fishless cycle a tank with just a dead shrimp decomposing in there!

I did account for most all of the shrimp and have vacuumed many times since they died.My snails do eat the dead one but usually leave either the head or the tail but maybe not always. I do now have some ghost shrimp and they are living in the tank just fine. I got a Seachem Ammonia Alert and have stopped doing daily water changes, trying to go at least one day in between. They Ammonia Alert is the pale green color with is just at the Alert stage. I do still test and when tank goes to 2 ppm or higher I do change. Still reading 0 on the Nitrites and Nitrates. Kind crazy. I did finally find somewhat LFS (30 miles away) and he was even puzzled by the Ammonia situation.

Thanks so much for your help.