my neons are driving me nuts

[Guest]

ive had neons for about a year and my firdt school was good , i had 5..
oh BTW my tank is a 15 gallon with a mollie and betta
then they died off slowly but i was new to cycling and i didnt do it

then about 2 months ago i had 2 left and got 4 more and each morning every 1 or 2 days i found one stuck to the filter
i was down to 2 agian last week and got 5 more( i asked for 4 but got 5 and only paid for 4) then last night i found another stuck to the filter..
is this because when they "sleep " at night and drift around they get stuck and cant get off or do yuo think they are being attacked...i OnLy find then in the morning and once at night and i never see them being pestered??
any ideas?

 

[lmw80]

Hm.....

Well, neons are one of the most sensitive fish...what are your water perameters? That could be a big determiner.

Also, you may want to put something around your filter intake if they keep getting stuck to it.

When you find them stuck to the filter, do they have any signs of bruising, or nipping? That would be a huge indicator of being attacked.

 

[Guest]

i forgot to say after i found the last one i put nylons over the filter, i thought it was wierd though how every one that died was on the filter, wouldnt some just float or sink

 

[Neuve]

I use a piece of the foam inserts and fit it around the syphon of the HOB works great and still lets HOB do its job.

Are your neons eating alright? Have they any places to rest by night? Im talking about caves, rocks, driftwood, plants?

 

[Seven]

I've had 2 small goldfish die on me, and both of them ended up sticking to the filter intake. It wasn't BECAUSE of the filter intake that they died though, I think it just kind of sucked them into the intake since, being dead, they obviously couldn't fight even the smallest current.

The same thing happened with some the ghost shrimp I had in there, that died.

 

[Megalofyia]

I'd like to know how a neon tetra is supposed to have a life span of 10 years if it's going to be so fragile?

 

[madasafish]

*Aquafishy*

I had a similar problem with my dwarf puffers when I first got them. I knew that one was pulled into the filter (the intake looked too small!) because he had puffed up when he got stuck. And, since he puffed up, he couldn't get out... It *broke* my heart to see.

So, this is certainly a possibility. Of course, as you prob know, neons are some of the most sensitive fish in the trade. You should always look to water parameters first, to rule out ammonia problems etc. After all, a dead neon can easily be pulled towards a filter intake, esp. if he sinks to the bottom rather than floating. If this is not your prob, the filter prob is.

However, though nylon works well you might want to think about the function of a filter... It is meant to 1) chemically detoxify dangerous chemicals 2) biologically detox dang. chems. and 3) mechanically filter out large pieces of waste. If you use a piece of nylon, you are essentially preventing the third form of filtration (mechanical) from working as it should.

Since the size of the intake hole was a problem for me, I decided to use a filter sponge over my intake in the puffer tank. It has worked very well. This way, the particles can sometimes get through to the filter, but if they don't, they get trapped inside the filter sponge *on* the intake tube, and can be more easily removed from the tank. Each time I change the filter media, I can just gently lift this extra sponge out. When I do, only a small amount of large waste reenters the tank. Most is trapped.

Just something for you and others to chew on.

 

[Guest]

i will be getting a new filter for this tank but it will have to be after christmas

what type of HOB filter is best(brand)

 

[lmw80]

Do you test your water? If so, what are the perameters...this plays a big part of why your neons are not thriving.

 

[Guest]

i think they are getting eaten and picked on...i went from 7 to five and the second one had no head!!!!it would probably be the betta...it couldnt be the mollie could it>i know he is sometimes aggresive but i never heard of a mollie killing fish..
it looks like i have two options
1)pull put the 3 gallon and move betta back to his old home(problem>the 15gal has heat and the 3 gallon doesnot)
2)move the neons to the 10 gal (prob>i think its already filled or just under and the 5 could put it over the top)it has 1 powder blue gourami( 2.5-3 inches)
3 sparkling gouranis ( an inch each)
and i wanted to add a couple cories to this tank

so...what route would you guys take.

 

[Tigerlily]

Hi Aquafishy:

Regarding your question about HOB filters, I really would recommend one of the penguin filters. The biowheel will help keep your water parameters stable, even when you change the filter media, since you never change the wheel and that is where the helpful bacteria reside.

If they're getting eaten, I would definitely move the neons out. The betta will really appreciate having a heater in his tank, especially now that it's cold outside. Or, is it possible to get a cheap little heater for the 3 gal? I would also take some time to watch the fish and look for signs of aggression. I have heard that mollies can be nasty sometimes, so I'd just want to be sure the betta was the culprit before sending him into exile!

Good luck!

 

[Guest]

so would it be better to move out the betta or to move out the neons
i wouldnt be able to get a heater for that tank.my parents arent crazy about fish and im luckey to have 2 tanks setup and i was able to talk them into letting me keep the 3g. but they wouldnt be happy with 3 tanks setup and they say i already put enough money into my tanks but i may be able to set it up as it(no heat) in my sisters room.

as for the filters, are aquaclears any good? thats what i have on my 10gal. are the biowheels better than aquaclears.

 

[madasafish]

Move out the betta.... He can take a smaller space. A 3 gallon is quite spacious by betta standards! And they don't need heaters as much as neons do (neons like slightly colder water--72-75 range--and can tolerate warmer water, but need temp to be consistent). Most bettas never get a heater... There are small heaters that can be bought in the LFS. They're not reliable and don't even have adjustable temp dials. However, I've seen some 25 watt heaters before. That would be perfect for the 3 gallon. Here's one by visi-therm: http://aquariumpros.com/aquaprostore/prods/AQS20520.shtml Shop around online, though. If Tronic or Ebo-Jager make a 25 watt, get theirs--they're more reliable. Also, check ebay for heaters going cheap.

*Consider* that even neons can sometimes be aggressive to their own species--but this is usually when you have only 2-4 neons in the tank... I've certainly seen such aggression, and others have complained of it, too, here. This can sometimes be fatal if two males (almost indistinguishable from females) are vying for a female. This kind of competition usually stops if you have over 6 individuals.

This could be completely unrelated to you situation, but you might want to look for intraspecies (neon to neon) agression just in case.

Biowheel filters are infinitely better than aquaclears. I wholeheartedly support the Penguin/Emperor line of Marineland filters because they're so effective at keeping biological filtration consistent. I have one aquaclear which I don't like nearly as much as my Penguin 330s, and I fret about ammonia spikes every time I clean or replace the filter media... I'm replacing it next week, actually, with a Penguin 125...

*If you need any explanation on biological filtration and the role of the biowheel, PM me, and I'll be happy to explain.*

 

[Guest]

for a 15 gallon tank what biowhell do i need( the number ) Ex. 125, 330??

ok well the betta will move out and the 3 gallon hasent been setup for two months so i have to clean out the 10 and 15 today so ill use water from themis htat ok...i will also put in some ornaments
i have rocks that arent used if i put them in my set up tanks to get bacteria for the 3 how long should i leave them in???

 

[Neuve]

Im happy with aquaClear. i have a 10 gal with aquaClear Mini and it works great, no noise or anything, just the water splashing.

Very easy to handle, clean and use...

I had a betta with my neons, they did great. Betta died lol, Unknown reason of death. Neons still kicking...

I wouldnt take betta out bcuz it helps keep neons schooling, but if youre afraid of him being the predator i would use a hatchery for a couple of days till i solved the enigma of your deaths...
Just a thought...

 

[shawmutt]

I have kept 9 cardinal tetras (which are supposedly more delicate) alive for 8 months, and then I introduced new fish without QT. They introduced ich which killed off all but one of my school. I have one left, that survived the ich, in an overstocked tank, and it is really healthy. I have had it almost a year now. My secret is, IMO, that I use r/o water that I buy from Walmart (one of those water refill machines) for 20% water changes once a week. I use electro-right to replace essential electrolytes in the water, which also sets the water to around 6.2 pH while keeping the water very soft.

Filter Question: I use the Whisper 20, the one rated for 10-20 gallons, in my 10 gallon tank.

As far as the eating of heads, and the suction of filters go, I can almost guarantee this is happening post-mortem.

 

[madasafish]

For a 15 gallon you have a choice between the Penguin 125 and the Penguin 170. (The model number indicates flow rate in gallons per hour, btw.)

Either is fine since they both fit into the 7-12x bracket for filtration rate (i.e. 7-15 times more gallons go through the filter per hour than are in the tank... so for a 15 gallon tank a filtering rate of 105-180 gallons per hour is the suitable window). I'd go with the Penguin 125 as the cartridges are cheaper, and the filter smaller. The 170 might be a little too much disturbence. I'm tired of being the conservative old badger who recommends really high flow rates . So, if you feel like the Penguin is for you, go with the 125!

Did I mention bigalsonline.com has very cheap prices? The 125 goes for $15.49, and the 6-pack of filter cartridges (sponge and carbon in one for easy changes!) for $8.49. It's a really good deal. Oh, and contrary to appearance, I am *not* employed by BigAls (I live in NY, they're in Ontario) I just happen to love their prices and their helpful staff!

 

[mattrox]

Do you have another option?

Could you put the betta in the 10 gal and move all the other fish into the 15 gal? Will that work. Hope it helps

 

[Guest]

ok i fixed it up
i went form 7 to 4 neons and put them all in the 10 gallon, in the 15 i have a betta and a mollie and when the betta goes (heaven forbeid) but the is 4 yrs old i will get a angel in there