Nerve of some people, please read up first

[beglely]

Idk the petsmart here in lafayette isnt terrible but they are by no means experts and dont know the complexity of an aquarium (of course im no expert either) but the lfs here is amazing. Well kept and maintained, great selection of fresh and saltwater fish as well as plants, and the people who work there know what they are talking about. Every one of the employees at least owns a few tanks of their own (as far as I know) and I havent found a question yet that stumps them (and everything they say is concurrent with whats found on here). They also ask people to notify them if their tank is less than 6 weeks old and will take the time to explain what a fishless cycle is to people. Idk I really like them and go there for about 95% of everything i need--so not all lfs's are bad, its just the bad experiences tend to stick out more.
FishNewbee==> Thanks! He is actually running around the tank right now hunting and usually keeps me company on late nights like this. Its sad to think there are people who mistreat a creature like this.

 

[FishNewbee]

I'll be the first to admit that I don't know everything, but I say "I don't know" when I don't, and it's hard to see every poster on this forum either having a bad experience with a LFS employee, or telling the previous type of person that all LFS employees are terrible. Why can't we just recommend that you think for yourself and double-check LFS advice with this forum?

My local Petsmart is the only place I have to buy any fish or supplies from. I have had good and bad experiences there. However, as my own confidence and knowledge has grown, I've learned to listen to them, and then go home and do my own research to either back up their advice or not. That seems to be working for me. Sometimes they're right, sometimes they're not. But I do think they do the best that they know how (at least at my store anyway).

 

[GhostKnife]

haha I like some LFS just the bigger stores that tend to want to get their hand in it all like a petsmart versus a private business. Kind of like walmart and the corner grocer. Its all going the way of the buffalo towards big business and in my opinion its not good. It makes it easy when going to walmart to get food, a xbox game, and a golf club for your son. The only thing is, is that no one knows whats going on in there and its every man for him/her-self. Frustrating when it comes to the hobbies like this when no one knows where you are purchasing something. Like I said its not like this everywhere but the Petsmart in my town is thriving by giving highschool kids jobs at low wages and they are probably there because their parents wanted them to get a job... They dont care.

 

[dadeon]

Yeah, that's seems to be the general sentiment. Maybe it's because fish can't really show their unhappiness like cats and dogs that people think they can do this. Absolute cruelty if you ask me. I think shops needs to give people as much guidance as possible, but in the end you probably can't do anything about it.

 

[Liquid_Pyro]

No you probably cant, I cant even go into the fish section at my Walmart, its so sad looking, I cant imagine those 16 year old kids (who probably have just been transfered from cash register and dont want to be there) give out to customers, and the Petsmart around me is only a little better, but really its all I have around me, Big Al's is awesome, however its quite a drive...

 

[cogburn]

i frequent my local petsmart so much that when im there they direct most of the questions to me... im no expert either but they realize i know more than them... i even stood there explaining to the MANAGER for over an hour about fishless cycling... he asked me to make a pamphlet... i made one on my computer and he made a ton of copies and gives them out to anybody buying a tank. some of them know alot... most know very little... i was there for 2 hours last saturday... dissuading people from most of their purchases... dude was leaving with 10.... 10 oscars... to put in his 29 gallon... after about 15 mins of me talking to him he left with 5 zebra danios hahaha... the employee that gave him the 10 oscars was asked to go stack dog food... manager told me she wouldnt be working in fish again and thanked me... they also usually give me any fish i get either for free or at a huge discount... theyre good people

 

[GhostKnife]

i frequent my local petsmart so much that when im there they direct most of the questions to me... im no expert either but they realize i know more than them... i even stood there explaining to the MANAGER for over an hour about fishless cycling... he asked me to make a pamphlet... i made one on my computer and he made a ton of copies and gives them out to anybody buying a tank. some of them know alot... most know very little... i was there for 2 hours last saturday... dissuading people from most of their purchases... dude was leaving with 10.... 10 oscars... to put in his 29 gallon... after about 15 mins of me talking to him he left with 5 zebra danios hahaha... the employee that gave him the 10 oscars was asked to go stack dog food... manager told me she wouldnt be working in fish again and thanked me... they also usually give me any fish i get either for free or at a huge discount... theyre good people

Most are not as willing to listen. That is awesome you can "volunteer" like that!! You are the type of people we need in the hobby!

 

[underdog5004]

i frequent my local petsmart so much that when im there they direct most of the questions to me... im no expert either but they realize i know more than them... i even stood there explaining to the MANAGER for over an hour about fishless cycling... he asked me to make a pamphlet... i made one on my computer and he made a ton of copies and gives them out to anybody buying a tank. some of them know alot... most know very little... i was there for 2 hours last saturday... dissuading people from most of their purchases... dude was leaving with 10.... 10 oscars... to put in his 29 gallon... after about 15 mins of me talking to him he left with 5 zebra danios hahaha... the employee that gave him the 10 oscars was asked to go stack dog food... manager told me she wouldnt be working in fish again and thanked me... they also usually give me any fish i get either for free or at a huge discount... theyre good people

That's awesome that not only do they take your advice, but they don't get mad at lost sales! Congratulations on finding a pet shop that cares about their animals.

 

[Mudfrog]

Oscars need a bare minimum of 55g and even then that is too small.

Refuse to sell the guy. Oddly enough we have an idiot at our local petsmart who refused to sell me a Syn. Eupterus because I had an Oscar at the time. Anymore I just tell the people it's an empty tank and they think a brand new empty tank is fine. At least I don't have to try and prove I know what I'm talking about anymore..

 

[crb530]

The thing to think about pet stores is that fish are there largest profit margen

for a fish that cost us $14 only cost the store about 5 cents

so that being said i know at my petco that i work at the people in the fish area know alot about what they are talking about. yeah we do have one person that doesnt know crap about the fish but lies her way through every thing. well needless to say she doesnt work there any more. most people learn from experance. at my store we tell everyone about a fishless cycle and if the people still by the fish we dont refund if it dies.

in the end if the person wants the fish they will get it if we turn them away they will go to a different fish store and lie so they can get it

 

[fort384]

Please don't misunderstanding my original post... I didn't say ALL LFS people are bad, just 75%

I have an amazing small privately owned store close that specializes in FW plants and SW reef tanks. It is great, and every employee there is an avid aquarium hobbyist that knows what they are doing. It is evidenced by their amazing FW planted and reef tank displays. The store is probably only 2,000 square feet and you can spend hours there just checking out their aquascapes. It is a little on the pricey side, but well worth the extra cost to not deal with the lunacy at my local petsmart. I am glad to hear it is not the entire chain that is bad, but rather probably manager dependent.

 

[Innovator]

Just to note, in any fish store whether it be a chain or 'mom n pop' shop, livestock is the lowest profit margin. The majority of the profit comes from food and product sales that accompanies aquarium setups. Majority of the time you will only find such low costs for fish under $1 is through transshipping, of which you must purchase in very large quantities and expect large % losses. Wholesale costs vs. profit margins aren't exactly stellar unless you are configuring your business to that of Walmart: Buy in bulk and sell low = volume sales. Few have the financial resources to do this. Also, from what I have experienced, most of your transshipping companies do not credit fish losses so there is a bit of "biting the bullet" at play. That doesn't mean you cannot make a profit through livestock, but you must plan your niche carefully.

I guess the single most important factor to remember is that all business are there to make money and if that wasn't the case they would either not be in business or giving their stocks away for free. It is up to the consumer to make the educated decision and gain the knowledge prior to purchasing; otherwise, it is a revolving door.

 

[SWerner13]

Just to note, in any fish store whether it be a chain or 'mom n pop' shop, livestock is the lowest profit margin. The majority of the profit comes from food and product sales that accompanies aquarium setups. Majority of the time you will only find such low costs for fish under $1 is through transshipping, of which you must purchase in very large quantities and expect large % losses. Wholesale costs vs. profit margins aren't exactly stellar unless you are configuring your business to that of Walmart: Buy in bulk and sell low = volume sales. Few have the financial resources to do this. Also, from what I have experienced, most of your transshipping companies do not credit fish losses so there is a bit of "biting the bullet" at play. That doesn't mean you cannot make a profit through livestock, but you must plan your niche carefully.

I guess the single most important factor to remember is that all business are there to make money and if that wasn't the case they would either not be in business or giving their stocks away for free. It is up to the consumer to make the educated decision and gain the knowledge prior to purchasing; otherwise, it is a revolving door.

I would have to disagree. At my store its actually tanks where there is only a small profit margin with a markup of around 15%. With fish its much higher. I only know because my manager has taken a liking to me and lets me help to order fish. They are dirt cheap compared to what we sell them for. The mark up is anywhere from 100% to 1000%. Also my employee discount is cost to the store plus 10% so I can get a good idea on what all the products cost.

But I still agree with your second point, all of these companies are businesses searching for profit and that is the bottom line. I'm never told to sell a product a customer doesn't need, but I am told to "introduce" products and allow them to make their own choices. For instance I would never promote the bacteria in a bottle products but I'm not supposed to discourage patrons from them either.

 

[HooKooDooKu]

Goldfish are the biggest problems, people think they can put them in bowls but not the case, Goldfish need 10 gallons of water each at min.

Not hardly... 20 gallons is what I would say is a minimum.

We got a carnival goldfish in November. He was fine in a 10 gallon tank when he was only 1/2" wide and 2" long. But here it is less than 6 months later and he's already about 1" wide and 5" long and would look silly in only a 1o gallon tank. Once you add one piece of decoration and a filter, there isn't any room left for the fish to swim around in. As it is he's already starting to look big for the 20 gallon tank we moved him to months ago.

Now I do understand how hard it is to explain to someone why to properly care for a 30 cent fish, you need a $100+ tank setup. But that's sort of the facts if you want to properly care for a fish.

 

[drillsar2]

I was warned in my petsmart to not to tell people about fishless cycle; against petsmart policy so I wrote petsmart a letter hopefully they will get it.

So dont blame the employees blame the business like petsmart, petco not training there staff and letting people know how to setup tanks properly.

Most customers anyway in petsmart I noticed want to do it there way and dont care, they want a tank and fish right away.

 

[mgamer20o0]

Just to note, in any fish store whether it be a chain or 'mom n pop' shop, livestock is the lowest profit margin. The majority of the profit comes from food and product sales that accompanies aquarium setups. Majority of the time you will only find such low costs for fish under $1 is through transshipping, of which you must purchase in very large quantities and expect large % losses. Wholesale costs vs. profit margins aren't exactly stellar unless you are configuring your business to that of Walmart: Buy in bulk and sell low = volume sales. Few have the financial resources to do this. Also, from what I have experienced, most of your transshipping companies do not credit fish losses so there is a bit of "biting the bullet" at play. That doesn't mean you cannot make a profit through livestock, but you must plan your niche carefully.

there is a big difference between lfs and the chain stores. there are several different ways lfs stay afloat. many times its the high mark up on live stock other stores its the service they offer or custom jobs. not sure what kind of dealings you have with transshippers though good ones dont have larger percet lost. anything over 10% is high.

on a side note walmart buys more fish then petco and petsmart combind.

I would have to disagree. At my store its actually tanks where there is only a small profit margin with a markup of around 15%. With fish its much higher. I only know because my manager has taken a liking to me and lets me help to order fish. They are dirt cheap compared to what we sell them for. The mark up is anywhere from 100% to 1000%. Also my employee discount is cost to the store plus 10% so I can get a good idea on what all the products cost.

the difference is lfs vs big chain stores. chain stores only carry fish to sell the other products. one of the reasons some of the big ones give what 7 day refund with little questions is to get you back in hopes to sell you other stuff. the big chain stores dont make money off their fish live stock.

 

[drillsar2]

I tell you this everyday at petsmart 10 - 15 fish die, Im not sure if its the way they transport them or the supplier

 

[the_elvish_misfit]

I probably know less than 15% of everything I should about fish keeping and by all rights if there was a permit test to own them I would definitely fail. But I would gladly fail if EVERYONE else had to take it too. I was in petco today and a bunch of probably 12-15 year old boys came into the fish section and bought a wide array of fish based only on what they looked like, salt and fresh! (oscars and guppies in the same bag) That will be a feeding frenzy later. The security guard in me wanted to grab the bags and kick them out for being so stupid.

 

[Innovator]

there is a big difference between lfs and the chain stores. there are several different ways lfs stay afloat. many times its the high mark up on live stock other stores its the service they offer or custom jobs. not sure what kind of dealings you have with transshippers though good ones dont have larger percet lost. anything over 10% is high.

Livestock profit margins still pale in comparison to that of marketed products, especially food. If you can find the niche then great, but it is not and has not been considered the norm for over the past 10yrs+. Most places of business that have excessively high markups are usually just staying afloat and hoping for large sales keep them in business, which they usually don't. I do agree that a major contributor to success is aquarium maintenance services offered. There is the potential for more money through this service than that of owning a store front (unless you have the funding). I won't argue percentages, but from my various dealings with transshippers (recommendable ones I might add), 10% is being extremely generous when you consider that you are probably purchasing close to, if not more than 250+ various animals. Then again that is the difference, either take the hits yourself or pay the higher markup from the wholesaler and allow them to take the loss.

the difference is lfs vs big chain stores. chain stores only carry fish to sell the other products. one of the reasons some of the big ones give what 7 day refund with little questions is to get you back in hopes to sell you other stuff. the big chain stores dont make money off their fish live stock.

I agree.

 

[dadeon]

I think shop owners need to take responsibility and shape up!

Talking about small tanks, did you guys see the "iPond" ? It's basically an ipod that was turned into a fish tank! Yes, it's really that small and they do have a fish in there!

check it out:
Gizmodo - iPond Combines Portable Speaker With a Fish Tank, Enrages Animal Rights Activists - Animals

sounds like some activists are unto them in a big way though