Please Advise On My New Tank.

[dskidmore]

1.

I'll let someone more experienced answer the coral question.

2. I bought an in sump skimmer and when I adjusted the air intake dial to get the "storm" in the chamber, the fine bubbles appeared in the tank through the return pumps. That makes the tank ugly and how do I prevent this?

This is normal. Do you have a bit of space in the sump to make modifications? What you need are "bubble baffles" between your skimmer chamber and your pump chamber. They will force the water to go up, down, and up again. They will also keep the water level constant in the skimmer chamber, which is important for many skimmers.

The only downside to these baffles is that all your evaporation change will show up in the pump chamber, and you must be vigilant about your freshwater replacement of evaporation loss, or your pump may run dry.

I wrote up more than you ever want to know about sump design here.

3. I was advised to dose the CA 3 times a week

You should be testing your CA if you are adding CA. Either pick up a CA test kit or stop dosing CA. A high quality salt mix, or real ocean water, should contain enough calcium for a low coral load. Keep up with regular water changes, and the CA will be replenished at a low level.

4. I bought a feather duster and the worm is trying to extend its body out of the tube (1 inch) but then it went back. It is still doing it. Is it trying to catch the food or does it want out of the tube?

Do you have much in the way of plankton yet? Your tank is very young, you may need to add some suppimental plankton to the tank to feed the duster. The duster also likes current. Other than supplying plankton and current, all you can do is maintain water quality for him.

5. Most of my snails huddle together in a corner of the tank. Is that normal?

That seems a bit odd to me. Is the current diffrent there? Is all the food being swept to that location?

My LFS tested the water and was advised that my tank is ready for any kind of corals and fish. I checked my water last night (Nitrite/ate=0, Ammonia=0, Ph is 8.0 and Salinity is 1.025). DP

I'd be cautious about that advice.

First of all you never went through a cycle? I know you used a product that was supposed to give you an instant cycle, but I'd give it a few weeks to be sure that it really worked. Keep testing the nitrate/nitrite/ammonia every few days. I'd be very surpised if a new tank was at 0 nitrate right after a cycle.

Second, be sure to research each potential addition before putting it in. Not all fish/corals are comfortable in a new tank, even if the chemistry is perfect. You need to develop long-term stability, and a large population of "pods" before trying to keep some of the more sensitive inverts and fish. You also need to consider compatibility issues. Feel free to ask us about potential additions to your aquarium.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

Disaster Strikes !!! Calling All Expert Aquarists!

Hi all,

A day after I was given a green light from my LFS, a series of unfortunate events started.

1. The blenny is no where to be found.
2. The big feather duster crawled out of the tube and dead.
3. The big coral tilted to one side and whitish stuff all over.
4. The Yellow Tang is on the side gasping for air.
5. ALL the snails huddle in one corner. They even raised the aquarium cover as I think they are trying to get out?
6. Some false corals some don't open all the way.

The good:

1. The water is crystal clear.
2. Brown diatoms appeared but is decreasing with more green appearing.
3. The two percula clowns appear well.
4. Nitrate/ite = 0, Ammonia=0, SG=1.025, Ph = 8.3
5. The mushrooms appear growing and there is a small one getting larger by the day.
6. Some very tinny feather dusters appear on rocks.

I brought a water sample and I will have another LFS test it too during my lunch time. At this time, I have NO IDEA what the problem is. Perhaps bad tap water, food poisoining, the water refuses to cycle, bad LS, LR? Please help! DP

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

More information needed for diagnosis

Hi all,

The tank has been running for 1 month. It has deep sand bed (coral sand and live sand), 60 lbs of cured rocks (with green and purple algae). It had a Sump filled with Cauperla (lights running 24 hours/day). Brown diatoms have occured but lesser in amount now. I also have an insump protein skimmer too. Last water check was normal. I wonder if my tank cycled at all? Dai

 

[roka64]

Hmmm, what kind of test kit are you using?
Test kits do expire and will give bad readings.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

Hmmm, what kind of test kit are you using?
Test kits do expire and will give bad readings.

I use the Red Sea marine water test that was bought a month ago. I also had the sample tested few days ago at two LFSs that specialize in salt water fish. I am heading to LFS to have the water tested again. Dai

 

[roka64]

The tang gasping for air tends to get me thinking of ammonia poisoning (are the gills lilac in color?), nitrItes poisoning, lack of 02 (you say you have a cover on the tank..?) or the temp may be too high.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

The tang gasping for air tends to get me thinking of ammonia poisoning (are the gills lilac in color?), nitrItes poisoning, lack of 02 (you say you have a cover on the tank..?) or the temp may be too high.

The ammonia test is 0. The hang on indicator also put it at "Safe". Nitrite is zero. The sump produces lots of bubbles when the water goes through each chamber. The house is air conditioned 24 hours a day. This hobby really drives me to drink though. What can it be? Dai

 

[CaptainAhab]

Couple observations:

How could 2 fish in a 125 tank (not including the sump) w/ LR generate that type of ammonia/nitrite to levels high enough to kill the fish? Assuming the tests are accurate, if there was die off on the rock then the kits should show it as well.

There is no way the nitrates are 0. Tap water and some sort of cycle should produce some nitrate. You never mention water changes. Have you done them? How much? I assume you dechlor'd your tap water when/if you did it, right?

100-150 gallon cleanup crew : Snails are all at the top of the tank. Where are the rest of the crew? They still around? 150 gallon cleanup crew is a large number of deckhands with little to no food (limited algae for the weed eaters and limited fish stuff for the 'other' eaters.

i think either the bacteria colony was so small from only 2 fish in a 125+ that the cleanup crew may be dying from starvation (or dieoff from the 'cured' rock) and getting a cycle started. i think the test results are suspicous esp the nitrate.

I think your setup is nice, your intentions noble but your patience was lacking and you moved too fast and now you're paying the price.

 

[roka64]

I definitely agree with the above. I was lucky to find this site right after I set up my tank. I was also fortunate enough to not have any fish in my tank from the start (simply because I didn't know what I wanted in there). Once I found this site, I learned about the fishless cycle and did it that way.
Dai, don't be discouraged, patience, honesty and and the ability to take/heed advice will get your tank up and running much faster than jumping in and trying to back peddle to correct errors (we have all made them).
On that note, you may want to think about taking your fish back and doing a proper cycle, or find a friend that has an established tank that can house them until you are ready.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

Couple observations:

How could 2 fish in a 125 tank (not including the sump) w/ LR generate that type of ammonia/nitrite to levels high enough to kill the fish? Assuming the tests are accurate, if there was die off on the rock then the kits should show it as well.

There is no way the nitrates are 0. Tap water and some sort of cycle should produce some nitrate. You never mention water changes. Have you done them? How much? I assume you dechlor'd your tap water when/if you did it, right?

100-150 gallon cleanup crew : Snails are all at the top of the tank. Where are the rest of the crew? They still around? 150 gallon cleanup crew is a large number of deckhands with little to no food (limited algae for the weed eaters and limited fish stuff for the 'other' eaters.

i think either the bacteria colony was so small from only 2 fish in a 125+ that the cleanup crew may be dying from starvation (or dieoff from the 'cured' rock) and getting a cycle started. i think the test results are suspicous esp the nitrate.

I think your setup is nice, your intentions noble but your patience was lacking and you moved too fast and now you're paying the price.

Hello,

This is the time line of my set up.

Week 1:

Day 1: Put water in tank with the coral sand (not live).
Day 2: Put in salt and let it desolved for three days under rigorous irrigation.
Day5: Put in live sand and some live rocks.
Day7: Putting some faux corals (plastic) and the rest of live rocks (60 lbs total).

Week 2:

Day 3: Put in 100-150 gallon rated clean up crew.

Week 3:

Day 3: Put in one Yellow Tang and one canary blenny and some false corals (brown and green colony). Also some mushrooms.

Week 4:

Day 1: Put in two clowns and a finger leather coral.
Day 2: One Tang is dead (today)

I tested the water from Day 1 and no nitrate/ite and ammonia was detected. On Sunday (6/29), my LFS advised me that the tank is cycled and ready for corals and fish. Dai

 

[CaptainAhab]

What I'm trying to say is that it's possible that everything you say is accurate but that with only the 2 fish in such a large tank (using them to cycle) your water sample appears 'cycled' when it hasn't gone through anything yet.

Fresh water poured into a tank will appear cycled unless you know that it hasn't been through the cycle. 'Cycled' water appears fresh because of the bacteria action.

Unless you always talked to the same person at the LFS and they understoof your timeline (and assuming they care) your water may test as cycled when it's really not even started.

If you never detected any change in your amm/trite/trate (esp nitrate) from the beginning then that further confirms my suspicion.

 

[dskidmore]

What is your feeding schedule/ammount?

It does sound like you're going through a delayed cycle.

If you can find temporary housing for the critters, you can start a fishless cycle and get it over with. If not, then you need to start doing extra water changes to attempt to preserve the fish. A product like Prime that detoxifies ammonia/nitrite will also help. (Check the labels, not all ammonia detoxifiers affect nitrite. Prime also detoxifies chlorine, if you're using tap water instead of RO.)

Cycling with fish without killing the fish will take much longer and be more work than cycling without fish. It is not the prefered option.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

What I'm trying to say is that it's possible that everything you say is accurate but that with only the 2 fish in such a large tank (using them to cycle) your water sample appears 'cycled' when it hasn't gone through anything yet.

Fresh water poured into a tank will appear cycled unless you know that it hasn't been through the cycle. 'Cycled' water appears fresh because of the bacteria action.

Unless you always talked to the same person at the LFS and they understoof your timeline (and assuming they care) your water may test as cycled when it's really not even started.

If you never detected any change in your amm/trite/trate (esp nitrate) from the beginning then that further confirms my suspicion.

Hi,

I just got back from LFS after they tested the water. Eveything is zero except the ammonia that is between 0 and .25. The color is a shade darker than the 0 tab but too light to be at .25. He told me that there is no way the tank is not cycled at this point. The person I spoke to is the person who advises me from Day 1. I read in Tullock book that with LR and LS, one may not see the normal ammonia, nitrite spike of the cycle. Dai

 

[roka64]

Yep, it sounds like you are about to start your cycle. I would not take that guy's advice. He is there to make money, we are here to help for FREE. I believe I read something about you getting water from the store. You have to be aware the water column has very little amount of beneficial bacteria. The beneficial bacteria is what converts ammonia to nitrItes to nitrAtes and it will reside in your substrate, nooks and crannies in your LR, filter media and anything else it can stick to.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

Yep, it sounds like you are about to start your cycle. I would not take that guy's advice. He is there to make money, we are here to help for FREE. I believe I read something about you getting water from the store. You have to be aware the water column has very little amount of beneficial bacteria. The beneficial bacteria is what converts ammonia to nitrItes to nitrAtes and it will reside in your substrate, nooks and crannies in your LR, filter media and anything else it can stick to.

What I am supposed to do now with the two clowns and some corals (false corals), mushrooms and finger feather corals? dai

 

[roka64]

I think it would be best for you and your animals to give them to some one that has an established tank or take them back to the LFS. Check your regional forums for folks close to you.

 

[CaptainAhab]

Here's an out of the box suggestion. I'd ask others to weigh in.. You have a skimmer in you sump, right? Sooo.. move everything to the sump that you can. turn off the pump and maintain everyone in the sump. Cycle the tank, get the water parms back and move everyone back.

Luckily the clowns are known to be hardy. Their sad lot in life as people then choose them as the guinea pig of the cycle. The others might not make it anyway. Your cleanup crew (or what you can't catch) will be on their own.

Don't know if you ever said how big the sump was. Move the rocks with the shrooms and corals to the sump. Run that skimmer..

Unless you have a QT setup

 

[cmor1701d]

No where in this thread have I seen mention of the tank's temperature or heater(s).

What is the current tank temp? How stable is the temp during a 24 hour period?
Do you have a glass top or other solid cover on your tank?

You have a 125 gallon tank with 60 pounds of LR. The recommended amount of LR is 1½ - 2 pounds per gallon. I have 180+ pounds of LR in my 125 tank.

You added a clean up crew for a 125 all in one shot. A clean up crew needs to be built up slowly as you increase the bioload in the tank.

You have attempted to instant cycle the tank, which has never worked to my knowledge. It's not your fault, you were just taking the advice of your lfs.

Now that you are here you are getting some very good advice from people who have no monetary incentive. The best adivice I ever got here was that 'Nothig Good ever happens fast in a SW tank".

You really should step back now and look to start your tank properly.
Take the remaining livestock back to the lfs and tell them they need to hold it for you or refund your money for now.

Get more rock. Base rock will do. Cycle your tank. Then start to add livestock slowly. I was advised to add just 1 fish a month, though there were times I added 2 at a time.

Step back, start over, go slow, and you will end up a succesful show piece aquarium.

 

[Dr. Dai Phan]

No where in this thread have I seen mention of the tank's temperature or heater(s).

What is the current tank temp? How stable is the temp during a 24 hour period?
Do you have a glass top or other solid cover on your tank?

You have a 125 gallon tank with 60 pounds of LR. The recommended amount of LR is 1½ - 2 pounds per gallon. I have 180+ pounds of LR in my 125 tank.

You added a clean up crew for a 125 all in one shot. A clean up crew needs to be built up slowly as you increase the bioload in the tank.

You have attempted to instant cycle the tank, which has never worked to my knowledge. It's not your fault, you were just taking the advice of your lfs.

Now that you are here you are getting some very good advice from people who have no monetary incentive. The best adivice I ever got here was that 'Nothig Good ever happens fast in a SW tank".

You really should step back now and look to start your tank properly.
Take the remaining livestock back to the lfs and tell them they need to hold it for you or refund your money for now.

Get more rock. Base rock will do. Cycle your tank. Then start to add livestock slowly. I was advised to add just 1 fish a month, though there were times I added 2 at a time.

Step back, start over, go slow, and you will end up a succesful show piece aquarium.

Hi,

The tank does not have the heater since it is during hot blazing summer. I will get the heaters once fall kicks in. I have the glass tops on my tank. Regarding putting corals in the sump, I am confused since the water in the sump is the same as in the main tank right? Regarding the fish death, why did he die when ammonia is not even close at .25? Dai

 

[Ziggy953]

Any amount of ammonia is toxic to fish.

Glass tops on a SW tank is not the best idea. They prevent O2 exchange which helps keep your PH stable. Heaters are always a good idea to have running in your system . Do you check your water temp daily? What is it? What does it go down to at night?

You have been provided some very good suggestions. It sounds to me like your LFS is not as up-to-date with their information as they should be. Take the advice you have been given here and slow down some and start over. It will be much easier to do now rather then later.