In search of Peace

[horsedogfish]

I moved my bigger clown loach to the community tank. It was immediately adopted by the smaller ones and they are all living happily ever after with the gold gourami, 8 neons, and 4 glowfish tetra in a 28 gallon bowfront. Back in the 30 gallon which came with the angelfish, the shark has given over dominance to a yellow lab BUT the other yellow lab is now in hiding. And when the clown loach first left, the ctenopoma ansprgi came out of hiding and was happily swimming around, but since the lab has become boss, the ctenopoma is hiding and the angel fish is looking pretty chewed up. I have two unoccupied ten gallon tanks. Who should get moved? None of the miscreants seems to be candidates for a small tank. Can I move the Ctenopoma into the community tank? The LFS said it is a cichlid so I put it in with the angel and that worked ok. It was ok with the shark as well. And with the twp labs until I tool the clown loach out. Seems to me the community tank is maxed out, but if it is a better home for the Ctenopoma I'll change water more often. Getting a third large tank (I know, a 28 and a 30 are not large tanks in the minds of real aquarists, but I am a cellist who, like many idiots, bought ONE tank and a few fish because they were pretty. Du-uh.) is not an option. I'd have to give the grand piano away to make room for it. I have worked hard to create balance and peace, but the fish are not cooperating. I'm beginning to understand why there are so many aquaria for sale on Craig's list. If I had it to do over, I'd dedicate the 30 gallon to one kind of fish, though I like angels and cichlids and they grow to be too big for a 30. Maybe I'd look into apistos (are they h=small enough for a 30?). But for now I have a bunch of juvenile delinquents iiving with an old angel, and I need advice. Thanks in advance. If anyone living close enough to Storrs, CT wants a free shark and/or pair of labs, let's connect.

 

[ktomminello]

Clown loaches take a long time to get there, but they max out between 8 inches to about a foot and don't do well without at least a couple friends, so enjoy them while they are small and see if your lfs might trade you for something better suited to your tank sizes.

I would give the ctenopoma it's own tank and take a close look at the ideal parameters for them.

What type of shark is it?

As for the labs- maybe see if you could trade them for a pair of dwarf cichlids?

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[Mebbid]

There's problems with your stocking that will never be worked out with your current setup sadly.

Firstly - Yellow labs
While these are the most peaceful Mbuna, they are still Mbuna which are aggressive bruisers of the aquarium world. Combine that with the fact that they are being kept in improper numbers in waay too small of a tank spells disaster. Two males in an aquarium will fight, plain and simple. They need to be kept in groups of 1 male to 4+ females. They also need a 55g tank with plenty of caves.

Second - Ctenopoma ansorgii
These are a small, docile, easily out competed fish. They don't belong with the tank mates you have him with. Especially the yellow labs but the shark and angel are in this group of fish it shouldn't really be kept with.

Third - Angel
These can be fairly aggressive but are easily chewed up. Especially when kept with nippy fish such as sharks and mbuna.

Fourth - Clown loaches
These have no business being kept in a tank smaller than 125g. They get enormous and need to be kept in schools.

Fifth - Shark
Not sure what kind it is, but the smaller Red tailed shark are nippy jerks of fish. They don't get along well with more peaceful tank mates. The other sharks such as a bala shark or iridescent shark get way way too large for the tank sizes you have.

All of this is a problem that boils down to a lack of research and listening to LFS employees that obviously don't know what they are talking about.

I would rehome the clown loach and the yellow labs for sure as they have no business being in that size of a tank. I would also highly recommend rehoming the shark. Next, I would pick a focus for your tanks because at the moment they seem to be a jumble of different styles and it's obvious that it's really not working for you.

 

[MICEY]

replace the clown loaches with yo yo loachs
everything is going to eat the neons
the lab needs completely different water conditions that the neons and angel
the loaches and sharks like a lot of current the angels and gold gourami and tetras like little current

 

[ScaryFatKidGT]

Yeah I was going to say.... much larger tank like a 75 gallon is what you should be looking at

 

[treemanone2003]

There's problems with your stocking that will never be worked out with your current setup sadly.

All of this is a problem that boils down to a lack of research and listening to LFS employees that obviously don't know what they are talking about.

What do these always sound so familiar ?


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[Mebbid]

What do these always sound so familiar ?


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What do you mean?

 

[treemanone2003]

Your truths about problems with stock levels and no/poor research, taking advice from LFS.


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[absolutangel04]

I am not sure of your entire tank set-ups and availability. It would help a bit to list out what tanks you have and what is in them, just to make sure we know everything you have.
That said, Mebbid typed out a good description of the problems it looks like you are facing. It seems you have insufficient tanks for the species you have, and some bad behavioral mixes.
It looks like you will have some peace achieved when you re-home some fish so you can get a balance of fish who will get along. You can keep a pair of angels in a 30g, and even build a small community around them (only smallish fish though).

 

[horsedogfish]

looking for peace

Today was water change day so I took all the furniture out of the 30 gallon and out the shark in his own ten gallon and the bigger lab in a ten gallon, leaving the ctenopoma and the angel and the juvenile lab in the 30 gallon. The angel is Very peaceful, so after I rehome the black red-tailed shark and the two labs, I would like to add maybe corys?? to this tank. What are your thoughts? The 28 gallon bowfront community tank with neons, glofish, clown loaches, and gold gourami remains unchanged. Actually, I think the dwarf gold gourami isn't any more a dwarf than the yellow labs were dwarf paradise fish. And of the five local LFS, this is the best one. Sigh. At least all fish are treated before being put on sale and all tanks have their own filters. I have never lost a fish I bought from them unlike the box stores.

Ktomminello, Once the juvenile lab is out of the thirty, do you still recommend the Ctenopoma should have his own tank? What could I put in with him to keep him company? The Ctenopoma and angel get along fine. They are both friendly and come to the front of the tank when I enter the room. The angel usually swims at the middle to top of the tank and the Ctenopoma nearer the bottom.

 

[treemanone2003]

What kind of "shark" are we talking about ???


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[ScaryFatKidGT]

What kind of "shark" are we talking about ???


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Redtailed black shark i think

What do these always sound so familiar ?


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What do you mean?

Your truths about problems with stock levels and no/poor research, taking advice from LFS.


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I think he is just saying people are on here all the time posting this stuff, stocking issues that should never happen like angles and neons that people always seem to have

 

[ktomminello]

If your angel is still peaceful once the aggressors are moved then you could possibly house the ctenopoma with him/ her, but make sure to watch them closely as even though the angel may not fight or pester the ctenopoma it doesn't mean that he's sharing the food.

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[horsedogfish]

Shark and beginner ignorance

The shark is a black red-tailed shark.

When I first became interested in having fish, I bought half a dozen books and knew pretty quickly there are no easy answers since even folks from universities had different opinions on various thing. I went to the five local LFS, two box and three independently owned, and listened to what they had to say. I based my final choices on the information I gleaned. Much of it was wrong. Much of what passes as fact is opinion based on experience with specific fish which can have personalities just as different as those of humans. We do our best, and try to do the best with our fish, and frankly when I discovered this site and began to follow some of the good advice (as well as some of the bad), I must admit that I do not appreciate being reamed for my ignorance when I ask a question which, to some of you, has an obvious answer. NOW I know the yellow labs will grow to six inches and don't belong in a 30 gallon tank. NOW I know they are not yellow paradise fish. There are a lot of things I know NOW, but I am still learning and when I come here with a question, I hope to find some helpful answers.

 

[Mebbid]

NOW I know the yellow labs will grow to six inches and don't belong in a 30 gallon tank. NOW I know they are not yellow paradise fish. There are a lot of things I know NOW, but I am still learning and when I come here with a question, I hope to find some helpful answers.

If you read my response in a negative light in any way, it was not meant for it to be that way. It's very difficult to convey any type of tone to a post through an entirely text based method of communication. It has been and remains to be a drama causing thing because of the ease and tendency of assuming something is being said in a negative light.

Trust me when I say, most people start way worse than you are (myself included) and you seem to have put quite a bit of effort into research of which I did none originally. Part of the best thing about this forum is learning what sites and sources of information can be trusted.

 

[absolutangel04]

The forum exists to help. Also, be aware that NOT everybody is as understanding as you about the severity of the situation. This is a good time to remind people to take it a bit easy in their posts, and to use some tact.
That said, don't take it personally. Many people have started out in a similar situation. As Mebbid said, you are not alone. You have been given a lot of helpful answers on your various threads though, including this one.
After you re-home the shark and labs, you should be able to add cories. That is generally a good combo. The angel and the ctenopoma will be iffy, depends on the exact fish. Angels can get less peaceful as they grow up, but some stay chill, especially if you just have 1. That is something you can try, but keep a close eye on.
I suggest looking into a smaller loach, or else making sure to rehome yours when they get large. It is true that they grow slowly, so you have some time. From what I have seen though, they seem to be a bit sensitive and pushing that boundary doesn't usually end well for the loaches. It can probably be done if you are diligent about keeping an eye on them, I would just make sure not to let it go too long.
If you are not sure about the gourami species, feel free to put up a picture. It sounds like you have an lfs that labels species are weird things. I had one of those also back in a different state. I would have to look at things, and then try to research them on my own to figure out what on earth they were because I could swear they would just invent colorful names for them. I totally understand how that can be confusing.