My fish are dying

[miller912]

I had a 15 gallon tank and had ammonia problems until I started using distilled water. My tap water ph is 7.2 and Ammonia is 2ppm using an API test kit. I upgraded to a 36 gallon about 6 months ago and have had nothing but problems with high ammonia. Normally the PH is very low (less than 6) and ammonia is always 4ppm or better. I've tried daily water changes and used marine land ph regulator (liquid) and AmQuel Plus.

I upgraded the filter to a Fluval 50 ans replaced the bio with ammonia chips, So I have mechanical filter, carbon, and ammonia chips.,
I also installed a UV filter. I currently have one small minnow looking fish that I just cant seem to kill. I have went through numerous guppies and swordfish.

I tired using filtered water from Wal Mart, that was no help.

Right now I have 2 4 gallon water tanks I filled last night and ran bubblers to them. (I read by doing this the chloromine would evaporate) I used the Amquel on the water tanks and checked the ammonia levels this morning (about 10 hours later) and i was still 2ppm and PH was 7.2.

I have a gravel bottom and all fake plants. I feed the fish once a day.

I am at a loss as what to do. I can't see replacing aquarium water with tap water that has high ammonia. Oh yea, Nitrate and Nitrites are perfect.

What do I do?

 

[Mebbid]

At 6.5 pH the growth of beneficial bacteria slows down a lot. When it hits 6.0 all nitrification stops. It's a pH problem.

Unless the ammonia in your tap water is above 2ppm then I would use tap water, just do smaller more frequent water changes and use prime to detoxify the ammonia. With a cycled tank a 25% water change with 2ppm of ammonia is no big deal.

If the ammonia in your tap water is above 2ppm then I would look into getting a ro system and mix that with tap water. Using straight ro water or distilled is not healthy for your fish or bacteria in your tank.

 

[Brad McLaughlin]

Changing your media can start the cycle process all over again since that's where it grows.

Lower your pH levels with drift wood, Peet moss, almond leaves, or use ro water. Any one of these should lower your pH and get your cycle back on.

Brad McLaughlin
Tampa Bay Area

 

[Mebbid]

Changing your media can start the cycle process all over again since that's where it grows.

Lower your pH levels with drift wood, Peet moss, almond leaves, or use ro water. Any one of these should lower your pH and get your cycle back on.

Brad McLaughlin
Tampa Bay Area

Decreasing the pH is just going to cause the problem to get worse.

 

[Fel]

The bacteria for the nitrogen cycle grow best at a pH of 7-8, over time in an established aquarium the bacteria can adapt (like all bacteria) however when establishing a tank it's important to be within this range.

Don't use distilled water!!! It contains no buffers to prevent large pH swings; and since the nitrogen cycle produces acid your pH naturally decreases over time unless you have buffers.

Best course of action is to treat your tap water with a tap water condtioner. It's also important to know if your tap water contains chlorine or chloramine. Chlorine is much less stable in water and will off gas in a short period of time, while chloramine is actually just ammonia with a chlorine molecule, thus it's much more stable in water.

With the water that acidic you have the option of using some shell grit/limestone like stone (calcium carbonate) to buffer your system. You can also buffer with baking soda (sodium bicarbonate).

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[miller912]

The bacteria for the nitrogen cycle grow best at a pH of 7-8, over time in an established aquarium the bacteria can adapt (like all bacteria) however when establishing a tank it's important to be within this range.

Don't use distilled water!!! It contains no buffers to prevent large pH swings; and since the nitrogen cycle produces acid your pH naturally decreases over time unless you have buffers.

Best course of action is to treat your tap water with a tap water condtioner. It's also important to know if your tap water contains chlorine or chloramine. Chlorine is much less stable in water and will off gas in a short period of time, while chloramine is actually just ammonia with a chlorine molecule, thus it's much more stable in water.

With the water that acidic you have the option of using some shell grit/limestone like stone (calcium carbonate) to buffer your system. You can also buffer with baking soda (sodium bicarbonate).

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So I should not use a PH "neutralizer" for tap water? Our city uses Chloramine. I guess I am still confused as to why the ammonia level never drops to zero. 1-2 PPM is the best I ever get, while PH drops to 6. I did a 30% water change today. I'll test tomorrow and see what happens.

 

[Fel]

It just takes time for the ammonia to drop, and then it will normally take longer for the nitrites to begin to drop as the NOBs (nitrite oxidizing bacteria) take longer to grow then the AOBs (ammonia oxidizing bacteria).

Your slow cycling may also be a result of using distilled water, because it has no nutrients in it for the bacteria to use it can further delay cycling. Believe it or not while the chloramine in tap water maybe a pain to deal with most of the time all the other minerals in it are useful to your system in some way.

Just start doing 50% water changes with treated tap water so you can accurately monitor nitrite, keep in mind that a cycle can take months to complete, but trust me when I say it's well worth the wait.

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[TbOnE]

Fel is 100% correct

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[miller912]

Next Day

I did a 25% water change and vacuumed and checked the water the next day. PH was 6.2 and Ammonia about .5ppm. I put a bag of crushed coral in the filter exit and checked the water 24 hours later. PH is 7.2 and Ammonia 2ppm. I have one small minnow that keeps hanging on. I'll check it again tomorrow and see what happens. I guess the next step is to try daily water changes???

 

[Mebbid]

If youre raising the ph you need to get the ammonia down to 0.25ppm. The ph being low was the only thing keeping your fish safe.

 

[trennamw]

My guess, as it's similar to how I lost a lot of fish ...

The distilled water has no buffering capacity (KH) so there isn't anything to stabilize ph. When you add the ph stuff it just changes ph but doesn't have anything to keep it there. The tank is probably experiencing ph swings.

With such a small tank I'd either contact The Wet Spot and order their buffered cichlid salts, and add a 1/3 dose (this is what they do in their own community tanks) or get API cichlid salts and Seachem Equilibrium and add 1/4 tsp each to 5 gallons. A KH and GH test kit are critical, you want about 3-4 degrees each.

The ph stabilizer you're using probably changes Ph without changing KH.


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