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Old 03-28-2006, 08:32 PM   #11
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Good to know. Essentially it's difficult to buy a damaged coral and try to nurse it back to health unless you're a seasoned pro.

Regarding the laceration and the stalk standing straight up, do you have lots of flow pointed on it now? Or was that the case when you bought it? I'm sure you know they like lots of flow. Do I think lots of flow could have caused the cut, I doubt it.

Something did strike me when looking at your pics. You have a mushroom on the stalk. Maybe I'm just a noob that doesn't know any better, but perhaps that is the reason your leathers poylps haven't extended and it's base is wilting. I had a mushroom get too close to my leather and it stung it pretty good. To the best of my knowledge they are not compatible.

I would take the mushroom off immediately and then see if it heals in the next few weeks. I would hate to buy a coral and have to start slicing it right away :/ Peace_
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Old 03-29-2006, 02:01 AM   #12
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So I got back home late tonight and the toadstool was gone. It became completely dislodged and I found it in the back of the aquarium on the substrate. ARHG!!! The bottom part of the coral that was still attached to the rock was completely soft and felt mushy. There wasn't really anything black so I'm not sure it was necrotic. I don't have a lot of experience with coral disease. In any case, the top part of this poor coral had to endure more manipulation as I found it a new home.

I'm very frustrated and don't know what more I can do. My plan is to just monitor it and see what happens. Hopefully, this thing doesn't have some sort of disease that will hurt the rest of the tank. If anyone has any suggestions or comments I would appreciate it.
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Old 03-29-2006, 11:33 AM   #13
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With this type of coral you may not necessarily see black areas if necrotic tissue is present. They can actually degrade from the inside out. The description of the remaining base area does suggest the coral was necrotic though. It does not mean there may be a disease/bacteria at play, there is also the chance for a parasite.

Check the area around the remaining base for signs of odd worms, snail, nudibrancs and so on. Especially after lights out when these kind of creatures are most active.

Inspect the seperated piece for lumps or odd formations near the base. Also see if there is any necrotic tissue left there. If so, you will need to cut it away until you are left with clean healthy tissue. Make sure it is placed in a high flow water area so it will preventany kind of new occurance. I suspect the necrosis started by how the coral was placed. Too many surfaces blocking proper water flow and rot set in. When trying to get it to reattach, avoid this.

Please also post a complete rundown of your water quality and chemistry numbers.

Cheers
Steve
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Old 03-29-2006, 08:32 PM   #14
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Thanks for the replies thus far.

When I moved the coral to its new spot last night I didn't really inspect the area in question and remove tissue. If necrosis does not truly manifest as black spots in these coral then I suspect your assessment of necrosis is most likely true. The bottom part of it pretty much fell apart in my hands. I didn't really clean the damaged areas but just tried to find a secure home for the coral. Is the removal of bad tissue something I should do right away even if it means more manipulation or should I give the coral some time to recover?

I've posted some pics of it's new home. It is not shedding any more and I think the new place has much better water flow.

Tanks parameters:
Ammonia: 0
Nitirite: 0
Nitrate: 0
pH: 8.0
Phosphate: 1ppm
Alk: 2.40
Calcium: 500+

I add PurpleUp 2-3 times/week but I'm guessing that is too much given my calcium levels. I add KM Tech 1 for Iodine. I soak my frozen mysis shrimp in in Selcon, Garlic, Cyclopeeze, zooplankton. I feed frozen brine as a treat every once in a while. I also have KM Platinum carnivore pellets which I feed every day. I use RO/DI water so I'm going to check that for phosphates now but I'm guessing they're coming from elsewhere. Is it possible that old tubing could cause I phosphates?

So what should my plan be with this toadstool?
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Old 03-29-2006, 10:33 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ctmedman
Is the removal of bad tissue something I should do right away even if it means more manipulation or should I give the coral some time to recover?
Yes, you need to remove the necrotic tissue to help prevent it from spreading further. Continually moving touching leathers/coral in general is very stressful but in a situation like this it's choosing the lesser of two evils.

Quote:
Tanks parameters:

pH: 8.0
Phosphate: 1ppm
Alk: 2.40
Calcium: 500+
Phosphate and Ca are high but not a concern in this regard. Alk and pH are low and are a concern in regard to this coral. What time of day was the pH tested?
I would get the alk up closer to 3.0 mEq/l. A good many of your inhabitant would appreciate it. Do you have scleractinians?

Quote:
I add KM Tech 1 for Iodine.
What does this test at?

Quote:
I soak my frozen mysis shrimp in in Selcon, Garlic, Cyclopeeze, zooplankton. I feed frozen brine as a treat every once in a while. I also have KM Platinum carnivore pellets which I feed every day. I use RO/DI water so I'm going to check that for phosphates now but I'm guessing they're coming from elsewhere. Is it possible that old tubing could cause I phosphates?
No, it's coming from your food choices. Cylopeeze, brine and the pellets are the worst offenders. The mysis is okay but you should rinse that in RO and drain it before soaking in the Selcon. Same goes with any frozen foods.

Quote:
So what should my plan be with this toadstool?
Clean/cut the bottom area until no more necrotic tissue is present. Cut some healthy away as well to ensure you get it all. Place the coral back so that it gest good water flow at the base (nothing direct) and do not block it in on all sides like you have. Determine the flow directions and only wegde two sides, not all 4. I'm pretty sure that's where your problem started.

Cheers
Steve
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Old 03-30-2006, 05:10 PM   #16
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Thanks for the great post Steve. I appreciate you helping in this situation. So I pretty much cut the toadstool horizontally through the stalk near the bottom. There were some soft spots but I didn't see much necrotic tissue. To be on the safe side, I took all the questionable tissue and then a bit of the healthy. The cutting actually made it easier me secure him. I glued the bottom down to a rock so all sides are not in contact with anything. I felt terrible moving him again but hopefully he'll pull through. Do you have any experience in their recovery rate?

As for the foods, I soak everything I feed in RO/DI water first and then remove that water. The only thing I don't are the KM Carnivore pellets. Is it possible that the pellets are the main cause?

What can I do about the low pH and alk? Any ideas. I know there are quite a bit of products available commerically to rectify but I don't know what's the best way of doing this.

By the way, I tried to post a new pic but it said I had reached my upload quota. I couldn't figure out how to delete these pics used in the post.

Thanks,
Ct
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Old 03-30-2006, 08:05 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by ctmedman
Do you have any experience in their recovery rate?
Hard to predict. It could be anywhere from a week to over a month. If it stays dormant don't be too concerned. With all the movement, it will be severely stress. As long as no new errosion appears, it should recover in time.

Quote:
As for the foods, I soak everything I feed in RO/DI water first and then remove that water. The only thing I don't are the KM Carnivore pellets. Is it possible that the pellets are the main cause?
Any kind of dried food is definately a source, usually much higher than frozen. Do you use a skimmer, iron media or feed nori?

Quote:
What can I do about the low pH and alk? Any ideas. I know there are quite a bit of products available commerically to rectify but I don't know what's the best way of doing this.
Water changes are usually the best route. Check your newly mixed SW to be sure that's not part of the problem. The alk in and of itself will not control how high the pH gets but rather how stable it remains. CO2 is the biggest factor in the level of the pH. Overall water movement and the tanks ability to breathe and exchange air freely are the major concerns there.

Quote:
By the way, I tried to post a new pic but it said I had reached my upload quota. I couldn't figure out how to delete these pics used in the post.
When your in the thread views looking at posts, click on your user name (not your profile). It will show your public profile. At the bottom right it says "user attachment" control panel. Click that and from there you can delete previously attached pics.

Cheers
Steve
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