Sick rainbows

[ThievingSix]

Hey!

So i have these 2 boesemani rainbow fish that i recently purchased about 3 weeks ago, soon after bringing them home i noticed they had white cotton like stuff around their mouth, which i attempted to treat with pimafix but it appeared to have no effect. In the last 2-3 days i noticed that the smaller of the two has developed what appears to be ick.

No other fish in the tank has ick or cotton mouth like stuff. Although i did pick up that one of my albino bristlenoses appears to have red worms coming out of its anus(Callamanus Worms?). To make matters worse my 2 kribensis just put out a batch of fry, so i'm a little concerned about dosing the tank with medications. Although i'm not intentionally trying to breed them, i don't want to go killing them either.

Any help on treatments or ideas would be helpful. I feel like i'm caught in a bit of a pickle as i don't have access to a quarantine tank, but if absolutely necessary i'm willing to go out and buy one.







Tank - 240L(64 gal) w/ Fluval 406 + Juwel Bioflow (default one that comes with the Juwel RIO 240). The tank is around 6 months old, 0 ammonia/nitrite, temp at 25*C(77F), pH is 7.4, 0 copper, 0.5 ppm phosphate, nitrate around 20ppm + added pressurised CO2. I do a 30-50% water change weekly.

Current inhabitants include 3x mystery snails, 2x M+F Kribensis w/ 30 fry, 10 harlequin rasboras, 2x boesemani Rainbows, 3x bristlenose(1 albino, rest regular). The tank is planted with live plants.

 

[Delapool]

Hi there,

Is the ick the white spots along the body I can see? My thought would be cottonmouth infection on the lips. Are you US based? I'd definitely go for a QT if you can.

 

[ThievingSix]

I'm in sydney Australia. Yeah the white spots on the body are what i think could be ick. Although i did have a look today and they appeared to be gone.

The problem is the quantity of pimafix required to treat a 240L tank is way too expensive, hopefully i can locate a cheap tank on gumtree. Thanks!

One more thing i just observed is that the larger of the two rainbows appears to be shaking a lot, hard to describe, kind of shimmying?

 

[Delapool]

Pimafix and melafix are ok for low level infections or if infections are caught very early. Sometimes you get a great win. Is the pimafix making any difference now? First post didn't sound encouraging.

The QT suggestion is just as much to protect your other fish if it is columnaris (cottonmouth) that they have as unfortunately meds here in Australia are not great compared to US options. To me having both fish sick suggests bacterial rather than fungal.

Triple sulpha is pretty cheap and worth a shot for bacterial infections. What ick treatment did you use? Usually they will help.

Edit - are you still dosing the pimafix? That could cause the shimmy if the pimafix was not well mixed in the water and got a chemical cloud?

 

[fishman888888]

I'm in sydney Australia. Yeah the white spots on the body are what i think could be ick. Although i did have a look today and they appeared to be gone.

The problem is the quantity of pimafix required to treat a 240L tank is way too expensive, hopefully i can locate a cheap tank on gumtree. Thanks!

One more thing i just observed is that the larger of the two rainbows appears to be shaking a lot, hard to describe, kind of shimmying?

The shimmying i believe is from parasites, although it could be from poor conditions or anything causing the fish to be stressed. Some of my bosemanis (have 11) ...i had 12 but lost 1 to the same issue youre going through when i first got him. i just raised the temp and did a few wcs, then treated with api general cure....

I dont know how to treat camallamus worms though, sorry. Some kind of dewormer.....

Good luck

 

[ThievingSix]

Updated Pictures






The shimmying appears to have stopped, perhaps it was a chemical cloud as you said? Or perhaps it is because he is missing a pectoral fin(bought him like that).

The Pimafix appears to at the most prevent it from getting worse. I haven't been able to get to the shop to buy something specifically for the ick yet. Do you know where i could get triple sulfa from thats cheap? Also do you have any suggestions on the best treatment for ick? I'm attempting to buy a QT tank tomorrow and hopefully get it set up soon.

I did some reading and an australian person appears to have recommended Avitrol Plus Bird Wormer plecoplanet: Treat Camallanus Worms hopefully thats the solution to the worm problem.

 

[Delapool]

Updated Pictures






The shimmying appears to have stopped, perhaps it was a chemical cloud as you said? Or perhaps it is because he is missing a pectoral fin(bought him like that).

The Pimafix appears to at the most prevent it from getting worse. I haven't been able to get to the shop to buy something specifically for the ick yet. Do you know where i could get triple sulfa from thats cheap? Also do you have any suggestions on the best treatment for ick? I'm attempting to buy a QT tank tomorrow and hopefully get it set up soon.

I did some reading and an australian person appears to have recommended Avitrol Plus Bird Wormer plecoplanet: Treat Camallanus Worms hopefully thats the solution to the worm problem.

Malachite green and formalin I've used quite often for ich with success. MG and formalin are stronger together but not too damaging on good bacteria.

Blue planet multi-cure I have and it has MG, methylene blue and acriflavine. Not as effective on ich but more effective for fungal and bacterial. The MB will kill off nitrifying bacteria so keep an eye on ammonia levels. There are others out there as well which are similar.

I would do a water change to lower organic levels in the tank which will soak up meds. I'd use the MG / formalin combo to knock the ick off and follow up with MG, MB and acriflavine. I'd treat with triple sulpha at the same time.

If you can find medicated fish food that would be best for the worms otherwise try soaking the fish food in a solution. The levamisole sounds fine. I have used prazi with no problems I found.

Another way to treat ich is just lift the tank temp to 30C. This stops the ich breeding and they die off. Quite effective however I wouldn't do this for your tank as if it is cottonmouth bacterial then it will just speed up this infection. Cottonmouth (columnaris) is imo the worse of the lot to get.

Edit - I'm not sure on a cheap place for meds. In general I find online cheaper.

 

[ThievingSix]

Thanks for all the help. I thought i'd post a quick update of the results.

I went out and got a 2ft QT tank, and separated the sick rainbows, within 2 days of dosing the pimafix, the mouth fluff has reduced quite a lot. The ich appears to have disappeared, which seemed strange to me, i'm not sure what caused it to dissapear, but i haven't dosed any other meds other than pimafix and seachems stress guard when i moved them into the QT tank. Perhaps the fish's own immune system managed to kill it off. My only concern is that since separating them, the larger of the two fish isn't really eating. I've managed to feed it one or two pellets, but it usually consumes 5 or 6. Hopefully that isn't an ominous sign!

 

[Delapool]

Interesting on ich - maybe the two products are increasing slime coat somehow. Unless the seachem product is sealing around the ich!

I had a look through the pimafix patent and no mention of ich there. Just read the top section.

 

[ThievingSix]

Another update, this time not so bright. It appears the larger of the two fish has some kind of cuts/scratches/wounds on its right side. There's none on the left. As far as i can tell these only appeared after moving it to the QT tank but i'm sure its not getting attacked in the QT tank because the two fish in there are quite peaceful/float around next to each other most of the time. The other smaller fish shows no similar signs.

It feels like its one hurdle after the other with these two! The larger one appears to have very little appetite too, whereas the smaller one is eating normally.

 

[Delapool]

Anything sharp in tank? Did he have ich there?

 

[ThievingSix]

Once i put him in the QT tank for a day the ich went away. He doesn't have ich now, and the white spots in the photo are from the glass. Although that white spot on his eye has been there since i got him.

 

[Delapool]

Could it be a wound from where the ich was I mean? Usually where the ich was they may have a scale go. I've not seen it looked sliced like that though .

 

[ThievingSix]

I thought i'd post a final update, both fish are now very healthy and recovered in the end. I continued with the treatments you suggested and eventually they showed signs of recovering, and after moving them back to the main tank they've returned to full health.

It seems the slice injury must have occurred when the fish got stuck somewhere in the QT tank, but it healed nicely in the end.

Thanks for all your help!

 

[Delapool]

I thought i'd post a final update, both fish are now very healthy and recovered in the end. I continued with the treatments you suggested and eventually they showed signs of recovering, and after moving them back to the main tank they've returned to full health.

It seems the slice injury must have occurred when the fish got stuck somewhere in the QT tank, but it healed nicely in the end.

Thanks for all your help!

Great news! Much appreciated on the post.

I was looking back on the thread and it looked a pretty complicated situation. Would you mind listing the treatment order and duration out of interest? Just curious on how it all went down.