Trip to fish store, new fish, water question

[brry]

Hi, a bit of my background information here: stop me before I kill again - Page 2 - Aquarium Advice - Aquarium Forum Community

I was cycling my tank and went down to the fish specialty store. This place looks more trustworthy than one of those chain pet stores with a fish department. It's run by a very ancient chinese man who seems like he's been in the business his whole life. Perhaps even that generations of his family have worked with aquariums.

You'll never see a dead floater in one of his tanks, or a sick one. I asked about buying tank starter products or some of their sand/water to get my tank started with good bacteria.

He sold me 5 gallons of their water and told me I could put my fish in straight away. I asked him if that was correct- because I had heard it takes time for the bacteria to build in the gravel and the filter. Perhaps I should give it two weeks for the bacteria to take hold?

He insisted that this was not true at all and that I could put my fish in today. With his wise wrinkled face and accent he seemed like he must know what he was talking about probably better than anybody.

So I came home with some little guppies. I will wait and see how they do. I also added one teaspoon of salt per gallon to add a stress coat and kill any fish diseases before they get a chance to start. Ick got my last ones and aquarium salt will kill 77% of fish common diseases. I was worried if aquarium salt would kill my 2 golden mystery snails but they're loving it in there. They didn't clamp up in their shells or make a run for the top or anything. In fact, they seem more active than ever.

The man also told me also told me that whenever I needed to water changes I could come to his store and pay like 38c for 5 gallons. That way I'd never need to buy water products or worry about my water quality.

 

[CoyoteWildfire]

I'm still a newbie myself, but my experience with my tank went pretty well. I only have a ten gallon tank, too, so take what I have to say with a grain of salt.

If he's running a business with established tanks, at least you can feel more confident that the water has been properly cycled. If your fish seem to be doing fine, then that's good to hear. It seemed, based on your previous link, that your issue was a lack of good bacteria in your tank. I can only assume since I haven't been able to test your water or determine the quality of the water you're using, but if you run into it again, you might consider using a product like StressZyme.

Stress Zyme® - API

I've been using that to help boost the cycling in my tank, and ensure that there's enough good bacteria for my fish.

I also recommend getting a few live plants, however many your aquarium will take and preferably ones that are pretty hardy. I have an amazon sword for that reason as it was my first live plant. Do your research on plants that might work in your tank and that will help ensure healthy levels.

And lastly, the fish you have now are probably more healthy. Getting it from a specialty store is a whole world of good when buying fish. Just looking at the fish from say, Walmart or Petco? You're bound for failure... they look awful, unhealthy, and unhappy. If this guy doesn't have any sicknesses in his tank like you say, then that will seriously work to your advantage.

Best of luck to you brry. I really hope this turns out well for you so you can enjoy the experience as you once did and as I am.

 

[momo]

You will do good for awhile since the water is good, but i beleive you will has a short period of time when things get rocky. when the water starts to lose its propertys from the established tank and where your new tank trys taking control without have enough of the good bacteria.

Saying that, i recomend when you do your water changes to actually get his water (AA may curse me) but atleast intell your tank is well established. after you have all your good bacteria going, then you can dechlore your tap water and add it. i know his is cheap put its a pain hauling 10G of water back home.

Also, yes, live plants help alot. but if your still upset/iffy about your last tank not doing so well then i suggest your stray away from plants for awhile. sometimes its tough getting the right lighting/temp ect. right for everything at once. so give it some time before you jump into live plants due to the fact that if you kill some plants, it wont further to upset you and bring your mood down. no one wants that around there fish tank

Good luck!

 

[brry]

Thanks Coyote the encouragement is really appreciated : ) I am currently soaking some plant bulbs hoping they will sprout. The last two I tried to sprout were duds and they rotted in the water.

Speaking of- anyone have any good tips for sprouting bulbs?

 

[brry]

Saying that, i recomend when you do your water changes to actually get his water (AA may curse me) but atleast intell your tank is well established. after you have all your good bacteria going, then you can dechlore your tap water and add it. i know his is cheap put its a pain hauling 10G of water back home.

Actually it's only 5 gallons, and they have someone carry it to my car. He's not that far away.

Plus, heh, (blush) I kind of noticed there were a lot of good looking, fit, well dressed men hanging around his store... And, well, I'm an eligible, attractive woman so ...I figure I'll pop by his store once a week and see if any of them work up the nerve to ask me out for coffee. *wink*

 

[momo]

Haha, very very sly

 

[brry]

D@mn it. Even though they are listed as tank mates the guppies keep picking at my Golden Mystery snails. One is hiding in it's shell and the other is sneaking around with it's antenna folded in. Really it seems like one little yellow guy is all the trouble. He is very interested in the snails for some reason and is like "escargot!"

Do you think he'll give up after a while? Or does somebody need to be moved?

 

[James_in_MN]

I was cycling my tank and went down to the fish specialty store. This place looks more trustworthy than one of those chain pet stores with a fish department. It's run by a very ancient chinese man who seems like he's been in the business his whole life. Perhaps even that generations of his family have worked with aquariums.

You'll never see a dead floater in one of his tanks, or a sick one. I asked about buying tank starter products or some of their sand/water to get my tank started with good bacteria.

He sold me 5 gallons of their water and told me I could put my fish in straight away. I asked him if that was correct- because I had heard it takes time for the bacteria to build in the gravel and the filter. Perhaps I should give it two weeks for the bacteria to take hold?

He insisted that this was not true at all and that I could put my fish in today. With his wise wrinkled face and accent he seemed like he must know what he was talking about probably better than anybody.

You really have to be wary of any advice that comes from any fish sellers, including LFS (not just the chain stores). Often times, their bottom line is to make a sale, no matter what the circumstances.

Him selling you water doesn't help with bacteria. The majority of bacteria that builds up in an established tank is in the filter media or gravel, not the water. Truthfully, he probably just sold you water from his water change that he would have just poured down the drain; quite the crafty entrepreneur he is.

I also wouldn't buy any water from him in the future, especially his PWC water; more often then not, your tap water can work out just fine.

You'll want to look at the thread on these boards about cycling with fish now. It's more of a hassle than cycling without fish because the the high number of water changes you'll need to do to keep them alive, but it's still possible.

 

[jespenguin]

What exactly do you have in that 5 gallon, all I caught was a few guppies. I'm pretty sure guppies require more room, mine are very active. Especially if you have a co Ed tank.

 

[glassbird]

James in Mn is absolutely right. He just saved me from a lot of typing, and said it better than I could have. Read up on the nitrogen cycle, get a test kit, and be ready to do lots of PWCs for a while.

His offer of only charging you 38 cents for 5 gallons is pretty crafty. He knows that if he can hook you into visiting his store on a regular basis, you will also buy other stuff while you are there.

 

[Khalix]

I also wouldn't buy any water from him in the future, especially his PWC water; more often then not, your tap water can work out just fine.

You'll want to look at the thread on these boards about cycling with fish now. It's more of a hassle than cycling without fish because the the high number of water changes you'll need to do to keep them alive, but it's still possible.

It'd be pretty messed up if it were his pwc water.. hopefully the nitrates aren't already high.

Never heard of selling water out of the tanks. I will occasionally put some filter floss/foam in a bag of water for free when customers are in a jam.

Hope it works out, anyway.

 

[brry]

When he handed his worker the bucket he said "Go get some water from the main tank." It was tested it and all the levels look good, but then again they also looked good in the tap-water treated tank with the other fish that died :/

This time the tank did get a little bit of a head start. It had been left to fishless cycle for three days before adding his water and fish.

Nothing interesting to report other than the poor snails have closed up shop and are floating at the top due to being picked on by my nippy guppies. They peek an antenna out every now and then and snap shut soon as a they see a guppy.

 

[glassbird]

This time the tank did get a little bit of a head start. It had been left to fishless cycle for three days before adding his water and fish.
.

"fishless cycle for three days"?

Have you read the threads about fishless cycling? Or fish-in cycling? Nothing much happens in only three days, even if you are following the necessary steps......

Please post your actual numbers for pH, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. Then people here (who are not trying to sell you anything) will be able to help you get through the cycle. Without the numbers, we are all in the dark as to what exactly is going on in your tank.

 

[brry]

Glass-

You are being unnecessarily mean. You do not need talk down to people like that. This is what happens when you skim read. It was made perfectly clear, repeatedly, that as soon as it was learned you were supposed to cycle a fish tank, the internet was scoured for all the information that could be found, this (often conflicting) information discussed this with the store owner, who told me to use his water. The specifics of my water levels have already been listed, in the link to my first post. One website, indeed, said that a week was needed for a 10 gallon tank and so 3 days was all that would be necessary for a 5 gallon. It was hoped that this three days would at least help a little bit, and there is no reason to apologize for trying to be positive and hopeful instead of negative. The fish are already in there so why not hope for the best?


Is it the policy of this board for members to harass new people, who come in asking questions? Because that defeats the whole purpose of having an advice board. If this person starts following me from post to post making snippy comments, there will be no choice other than to leave. The reason I speak up is because because if this person is doing it to me it's a safe bet they are doing it to others.

 

[Khalix]

Keeping fish involves leaning new things on a continual basis. I hope you do not leave the forums.

I think text can lead to a lot of misunderstanding.

Most people have been there when it comes to learning more after already having the fish. It's not ideal, but it's doable as long as a little more work is done until the tank is fully established. When I say established I mainly mean that the tank has formed enough of the good bacteria to break down the bad junk. I think one misunderstanding I face with a lot of customers is exactly what a cycle is. Usually some of my coworkers will think it just means the tank is properly heated and that the filter has been running for at least a few days.

Our tanks become little ecosystems all unto themselves and it's good to read up on the whole process. It's pretty neat, really.

Make sure to give updates!

Glass-

You are being unnecessarily mean. You do not need talk down to people like that. This is what happens when you skim read. It was made perfectly clear, repeatedly, that as soon as it was learned you were supposed to cycle a fish tank, the internet was scoured for all the information that could be found, this (often conflicting) information discussed this with the store owner, who told me to use his water. The specifics of my water levels have already been listed, in the link to my first post. One website, indeed, said that a week was needed for a 10 gallon tank and so 3 days was all that would be necessary for a 5 gallon. It was hoped that this three days would at least help a little bit, and there is no reason to apologize for trying to be positive and hopeful instead of negative. The fish are already in there so why not hope for the best?


Is it the policy of this board for members to harass new people, who come in asking questions? Because that defeats the whole purpose of having an advice board. If this person starts following me from post to post making snippy comments, there will be no choice other than to leave. The reason I speak up is because because if this person is doing it to me it's a safe bet they are doing it to others.

 

[Khalix]

One of the issues I have with them giving out water from their tanks, main one or not is that for the most part you're just buying nitrates. Any established tank will have some level of nitrate buildup. Which is why partial water changes are so essential. They are definitely not as bad as nitrites(in moderation), but in excess it's detrimental.

I'm going to have to look into this. I wonder how common it is for people to sell used tank water. Maybe there is something to it, after all. I prefer to try giving the benefit of the doubt, but I am a cynic at heart.

When he handed his worker the bucket he said "Go get some water from the main tank." It was tested it and all the levels look good, but then again they also looked good in the tap-water treated tank with the other fish that died :/

This time the tank did get a little bit of a head start. It had been left to fishless cycle for three days before adding his water and fish.

Nothing interesting to report other than the poor snails have closed up shop and are floating at the top due to being picked on by my nippy guppies. They peek an antenna out every now and then and snap shut soon as a they see a guppy.

 

[tornadonick]

I recently took some of my sisters water for my tank, got everything all set up. It set for 3 days and i added fish. They where fine for the first 2 days and now about a week later, I am worried i am going to lose my whole tank. Don't be angry, they just need information and are trying to help... I assure you they are not being hostile.

 

[jespenguin]

If I read Everything correctly your using test strips, which most members agree are incredibly inaccurate. As far as you 0 ammonia & nitrite, I'd assume your cycle hasn't started yet. And for the lash out, not necessary, it's kind of a pain to go jumping about to find your water parameters. Plus those change constantly so to get help, your UTD parameters should be posted. Lastly, your fish (which really what's in there) are producing waste and ammonia. Which hurts them, hence asking what exactly you have, because in a 5 gallon things build up quickly. Most members recommend the API test kit, much more accurate, and around 30$, and that takes the crafty out of the store people. I watched a women with multiple goldfish (high waste producers), test her water at the store, ammonia was 6.0 (ideally 0-0.25), and then the associate recommended a 25% water chance twice a month. Which is insane, so it's always best to be weary of advise given, and make sure you yourself can get your results.

 

[glassbird]

Wow. My intent was completely misunderstood. Bowing out of this thread.

 

[brry]

The snails were put in their own bowl today because they were being harassed by the nippy guppies. Poor things are still all clamped up in their shells and won't come out. Hope it is not too late, would hate to lose them. Would tetras nip at snails?