At a loss :-(

[sanknic]

My name is Sandra and I have recently bought a tank and done a LOT of reading. It's all very exciting and can't wait to get some fish BUT, I have been doing a fishless cycle and once completed I did a 90% water change and gave my tank and gravel a bit of a clean up too, I also put aquasafe in the tank after replenishing the water. This caused a nitrite spike in my readings.

I have continued to cycle my tank again for the past week until my readings were ammonia -0ppm, Nitrite - 0ppm and Nitrate - 5ppm, yay! This time, having learned from the previous water change I did, I simply changed 25% of the water (having used aqua safe in the new water and leaving it for five minutes before putting the fresh water in the tank) and yet again I have a Nitrite spike (5ppm) in my tank again.

I have tested my tap water and it shows no ammonia, nitrites or nitrates.

Am I simply testing the water too soon or is there something not right? I don't understand why I'm getting a nitrite spike after water changes that are supposed to reduce nitrites in the tank.

Any help , much appreciated, getting very frustrated !



Sandra

 

[ImACoolguy]

I forget what aquasafe is? Is it just a water conditioner?

Either way, 0-5ppm instantly doesn't sound right. Try water changing and only use water conditioner. See if that changes the readings.


Caleb

 

[sanknic]

Thanks for the reply !

Aqua safe is a water conditioner yes, it's supposed to instantly dechlorinate the water and it is all I have used when doing the water changes. I thought that just doing a 25% water change would solve the mystery but no

I really don't know what to do about the nitrite spike. I've read that prime will cause a flase reading when added to water and am wondering if this is what the aquasafe is doing

 

[ScotJudd]

Thanks for the reply !



Aqua safe is a water conditioner yes, it's supposed to instantly dechlorinate the water and it is all I have used when doing the water changes. I thought that just doing a 25% water change would solve the mystery but no



I really don't know what to do about the nitrite spike. I've read that prime will cause a flase reading when added to water and am wondering if this is what the aquasafe is doing

Hi. Prime has he effect of breaking down chloramine in the tap water into chlorine and ammonia. The chlorine is instantly neutralised and the ammonia converted into ammonium, which is less harmful to fish but still reads on the ammonia test kit. So adding Prime can look like ammonia levels have suddenly risen, but most of that reading is actually the less harmful ammonium. The filter processes ammonium the same as ammonia and will cause a rise in nitrites before they are processed into nitrates.
I was perplexed by these results at first and have now come to the conclusion that Prime is a fantastic product but don't test your water for the first 24 hours after use. I can't say if Aquasafe has the same effect but would suspect that most water treated with a dechlorintor is best not tested for 24 hours either.
My best advice now is to raise your ammonia to 4ppm and wait it out. Test after a couple of days and see what the ammonia, nitrites and nitrates are doing. Don't WC to dilute NITRITES unless the reading is off the scale on the test kit, then just dilute so the reading is mid way.
You said that you gave your gravel a bit of a clean up so I am presuming that you are cycling with flake or food if you are would recommend using pure ammonia as its a cleaner and more precise way of dosing the tank. You need very little ammonia to raise the tank to 4ppm and a cheap bottle will last a lifetime. Make sure if it pure ammonia (typically 10% strength) and that it had no other ingredients such as fragrances or surficants (soap).
Good luck with your cycling - it's worth it in the end.


Sent from my iPad using Aquarium Advice

 

[sanknic]

HI, thanks for sharing your knowledge,

I have been using ammonia every day at 4ppm. The last time I did the water change it took a week for the nitrites to come back down to zero. Have done my readings this morning (not yet 24hrs since the change). 0 ammonia, 5pmm or more, (it's an API test kit) and 5ppm Nitrates. How long should it take for the nitrates to consume the nitrites back down to zero?

 

[skylane]

You should read the fishless cycle again.
Water changes start to happen when your pH level starts to drop, and your nitrites and nitrates have peaked to their highest, and ammonia level starts dropping where you having to keep dosing it. Thats when you know you are close to a cycled tank!

Clem

 

[sanknic]

Thank you Clem,

Is it possible that the ph in my water which is 7.8 from the tap could be killing the bacteria when I'm adding fresh water to the tank (I have been treating the water with Aquasafe but I don't think it has any effect on ph levels). I haven't worried about the ph levels in the tank because I plan to keep fish that are all able to live with a ph up to 8. Now thinking that perhaps I should lower the ph in my tank and maybe that will stop the nitrite spike occurring when I do a water change each time the cycle completes. What do you think?

Thanks for your help, it's much appreciated.

Sandra

 

[skylane]

You shouldn't be changing your water until your pH starts to drop, and your levels have reached their highest the nitrates and nitrites. Then you do a 50℅ water change, and start the process over, by that time you will notice your levels starting to come down.
0 ammonia ,0 nitrate, nitrites 20-40ppms. Then you have a completed tank!!![emoji1]

Clem

 

[skylane]

You shouldn't be changing your water until your pH starts to drop, and your levels have reached their highest the nitrates and nitrites. Then you do a 50℅ water change, and start the process over, by that time you will notice your levels starting to come down.
0 ammonia ,0 nitrate, nitrites 20-40ppms. Then you have a completed tank!!![emoji1]

Clem

You should be adding a bit of flake food ground up, so it can help with the bacteria to grow and eat, yes you feed the bacterias to get them going , but keep your ammonia up during the cycle so that you can keep this process going . it will all make sense as you do your daily water tests and record them too.

Good luck
Clem

 

[sanknic]

Thanks Clem,

I'll follow your advice re levels and water changes. Not sure about the ph though as that has actually risen over the past 3 or 4 weeks from 7.8 to 8.2. I'm thinking I should get some ph down. Would that help or hinder the process?

 

[skylane]

My friend you can not rush this , you should read up more, at the moment your PH level will be high because you keep changing the water before it starts to cycle.
It will take you about 3 weeks , to start seeing the proper levels, if you get some seeded material from a heathy tank, a friend or even the lfs, add it to your filter or tank it will speed up the process. It takes time to do a fishless cycle, but if you can't wait you can do a fish in cycle , with a couple of fish depending on your tank size, but if you do this type you need to do more water changes and it will cycle faster for you, but its stressful for the fish you put in first, so those first fish will not or maybe have some health issues down the road but they will be sacrificed to do this process. Just take your time to understand this and it will all come together for you... Read read read..


Clem

 

[sanknic]

Thanks Clem,

I have done LOTS of reading which is most likely where all the confusion is setting in. I have been cycling my tank for 3 or 4 weeks now. Ammonia levels were the first thing I checked on a daily basis, these came down to zero after a while. I have put pure (household) ammonia in the tank every day at 4ppm, the reading every day for ammonia has been zero so I pretty much stopped reading the ammonia every day and did it every two days instead as it has remained at zero every day.

At this point I started testing for nitrites, these reached 5ppm (as high as the API testing kit goes) for a week or two before gradually going down to zero. When nitrites were at zero I tested for nitrates and these were at 5ppm. At this point I've read many times that the cycle has completed and to do a water change. I did a 90% water change (using aquasafe), tested the water the next day and the nitrites had spiked back up to 5ppm.

I continued to feed the tank ammonia daily as this has remained at zero every day and after a week nitrates fell to zero again with nitrates at 5ppm. I did a much less drastic water change of 25% this time around hoping this would solve the proble but the nitrites have spike back to 5ppm, ammonia is still zero after around 12 hours and nitrates are at 5ppm. So, I believe that I have cycled my tank twice now, but during this time I never really tested the ph as so much reading said it wasn't that important to the fish as long as it remained between around 6.5 to 8

Having tested the ph today it is at 8.2 in the tank. This is the only variable I can think of that might affect the nitrites other than that I am non-plussed. Sorry for the long winded reply but I thought it would be easier if you had the full picture of what's happened so far.

I should say that I don't wish to get any fish until I'm sure that my tank has cycled properly and water changes are no longer causing a spike in nitrites. I will definitely be doing a lot more testing daily and before and water changes to try and solve the problem. I have a wooden log in my tank, do you think this could be the problem? I also have around five plants in there too.

 

[ImACoolguy]

At this point I started testing for nitrites, these reached 5ppm (as high as the API testing kit goes) for a week or two before gradually going down to zero. When nitrites were at zero I tested for nitrates and these were at 5ppm. At this point I've read many times that the cycle has completed and to do a water change. I did a 90% water change (using aquasafe), tested the water the next day and the nitrites had spiked back up to 5ppm.

Aha!

This is where I think it went haywire.

You can get a nitrate reading before the nitrites have dropped off. I believe at this point this is where the fault was. You thought the cycle was finished so you water changed. When really, the bacteria was not done with the nitrites yet, that's why it continues to spike.

Just let it be and one day you are going to wake up and nitrites will be gone.


Caleb

 

[coralbandit]

Your pH is not the problem IMO

You missed the 'test' step of the fishless cycle?

I learned like you ammonia daily.
Until nitrItes show.
Then only every 4 days.
When the tank processes 4ppm ammonia to zero nitrItes in 4 days then you test.
You the add 4ppm again and expect it to be zero ammonia,nitrite in 24 hrs.
If all that happens then you do large wc an call it cycled.

5 ppm nitrite is too high to be error or in a cycled tank.
Leave the 5ppm nitrite and count down 4 days.

You're still cycling IMO..

 

[absolutangel04]

So, I would consider maybe trying a different water conditioner. From reading about Aquasafe, it has a few additives in it that are supposed to help feed the bacterial colony. I would try out a more basic water conditioner like Prime and see what you get. Also, Prime is more concentrated and you will get a lot more for your money than any of the Tetra brand products. I am guessing that maybe something in the water conditioner is triggering the spike. Perhaps the bacteria need more time to settle in, but I at least if you try it with a different conditioner, you may have a better idea what is going on and how long you need to let the bacterial colony keep growing for to be fully cycled. If you do get another reading like that, definitely keep testing until the nitrites hit zero. It sounds like you are on the low end of the time frame for a completed cycle, so you may well just need more time for the bacteria.

 

[skylane]

The wood is a bonus, driftwood should lower and soften up the water, and the plant are eating up all your ammonia good, but if you believe that you are cycled, mabey you have harder water from your city, or supply source.
What could be happening during your cycle is a cycle crash, because the BB bacteria is not established yet, and make sure you shake the hell out of those test liquids when you do your tests it could give false readings too, but it looks like your almost there with your cycle.

Keep up the good work , you will be able to help someone else one day too after you get through this cycle, I know, I was new to this when I did my 90 gal planted , and my filter has been bullet proof since I did mine, you should be able to stock your tank with fish when the cycle is done, but only add your fish in slowly not all at once to give your filter a chance to handle the bio load .


Clem

 

[sanknic]

Thank you for all your replies. I think the next time my nitrites go down to zero I am going to watch them at zero for around five days and then do a 25% water change. At this stage I'm very much hoping that the water change won't cause the nitrites to spike and then I can get some fish to go in their happy home. Please let me know if this approach would be wrong as I wouldn't want to cause any further problems with the cycle !

 

[skylane]

By the way what is your tank size?
What type of filters you are using?
What is your plans with tank, planted tanks are cool, and what types of fish are you considering?
We can help you plan this too, for the rite amount of fish you could stock and correct specie's, so they won't clash with other tank mates.
Keep us posted and I'm glad to help you if I can, and the other members that answered your post are very knowledgeable, I thank them too!!!
Good luck Sandra!!! [emoji6]

Clem

 

[sanknic]

The tank claimed it was a 54 litre but it has 40 litres of water in it only. I have 6 plants in it already along with a wooden log and two ornaments. The filter and the heater came with the tank so I'm not sure what they are. All I can tell you is that the tank is a Marina.

I plan a community tank and plan to put 5 platy's in it to begin with, month 2 I'll add 5 female guppies, month 3 - two balloon mollies, month 4 - 8 harlequins, month five is very much going to be dependant upon how my levels are looking, if things are going well then I'll add at least 6 black phantom, if I don't think the tank will cope with that many fish I shall add two dwarf angel fish instead. I have a big fish shop near where I live and they have given me lots of advice on what fish I can keep together and how many the tank will hold but I shall most definitely be playing it all by ear as to when I add the fish.

 

[skylane]

Is the filter a canister or hob type?
The plan sounds good, and you are not in a rush which is the way to go!
HOB is a hang on basket type for your information. Research your fish selections to know more about them, as how big they get when they reach to adults. The reason is they eventually start to breed and some types like Angels, which I keep can get big and aggressive but a beautiful fish I must admit!
If you get plants find our their lighting requirements, some are low lighting to high, so you may need better lighting for high light plants if you choice to pick these. Post some pics of your tank when you have a chance, we would like to see your work!!?[emoji39]

It's going to look great, and your going to be happy when you start to see your progress!

Clem