Hardness and pH

[Fishyfanatic]

Our pH is 8.4 straight from the tap. I will test the pH sitting out in a little bit, but can't find the test kit as of the moment. The KH is 71.9 ppm and the GH is 89.5 ppm. This is not as hard as our water used to be at the old apt (somewhere around 300 ppm). Is this ok for Africans or do we need to try to add something?

There is already cc in the filter, but it's not increasing the hardness. I tested water from the tap and from the 150 and got the same results in regards to both hardness tests.

The pamplet that came with the test says that is is idea for most tropical fish including angelfish, cichlids, tetras, botia, and live plants. Am I correct in assuming that is for South/Central Cichlids and not Africans? Because in the 200 - 400 range it lists Rift Lake Cichlids.

What other natural component can we add to this tank to increase the hardness? Or is it not even needed?

 

[madchild24]

wether its needed or not rock works well when i added rock from lake erie
when up about 100ppm (i added alot)

 

[Fishyfanatic]

What kind of rock is it? Did it increase your pH?

 

[madchild24]

ya it increased my ph by 0.1 its just normal lake rock

 

[Fishyfanatic]

where do I find rocks like that? The "lake rock" that I have accessable to me is all limestone. The lake is basically an old quarry that filled up with water and so my grandpa threw in some fish and planted some trees.

 

[madchild24]

i got some form the great lakes some fish stores care great lake rock too

 

[Fishyfanatic]

Is that the technical name of the rock, "great lake rock"? I just don't want to look like an idiot.

 

[madchild24]

lots of places call it erie rock
or michingan rock depending on wich lake it came from

 

[travis simonson]

I use sodium bicarbonate (baking soda) to buffer the KH/pH in my ARLC tank. It works very well, is reliable, accurate, and is very cheap. I don't have the formula handy but a solution of 4 TBLSPNS baking soda in 1000 mL of water will raise the KH of my 125G tank by 1 dKH per 100 mL of solution added. You can also purchase calcium carbonate from www.gregwatson.com which will buffer your water at very affordable prices. Magnesium sulfate is also available which should increase your GH. If you want to go the expensive route you can buy Malawi and Tanganyika Lake buffers at your LFS which will also raise the pH/KH/GH of your water but they cost a lot more. HTH

 

[Fishyfanatic]

I'd rather go the natural route over baking soda. It just seems more natural and theres no way I can mess up rocks. I've heard bad things about baking soda, so I try to stay away from things such as that. Thanks for the options though Travis.

 

[greenmaji]

Rock will give some KH and is natural but the natural rout will not give the same results.

 

[Fishyfanatic]

I don't want to mess with non-natural stuff that can be easily messed up. I want a "set it and forget it" type thing.

 

[greenmaji]

I don't want to mess with non-natural stuff that can be easily messed up. I want a "set it and forget it" type thing.

There is no way of doing this in a set it and forget it manor and maintain good, solid and stable water peramiters. That and its not easily screwed up..

 

[Fishyfanatic]

I'm not going to argue with your gm. like I said, I dont' want to use baking soda. It's not natural. I'd rather use something natural like the rocks. Kind of like the cc in the filter is a natural "set it and forget it" pH increaser.

 

[Fishyfanatic]

Also, I don't need to increase the pH. It is already 8.4 so anything that will up the pH is out of the question, and if I remember correctly from when I was trying to up the pH before, you said that the baking soda will increase pH.

 

[greenmaji]

the stone increases your KH and PH. CC increses your PH by raising your KH.. It might be worth considering.. It might not maintain exact numbers like dosing but the changes should be gradule... HTH

 

[Fishyfanatic]

The rocks that madcichlid is referring to increased the hardness and only slightly the pH. I don't mind if the pH increases to 8.5 as long as the hardness increases by a larger amount. I just don't need a substantial increase in pH to get the hardness substantially increased. That's not an option. The smaller the change in the pH, the better. The cc method had gradually increased the pH in the 150 from 7.0 and it maintainted at 7.8. Then we moved to Marion and the natural pH is 8.4. I think it may be time to replace the cc anyways since it has been about 6 months in the tank. But again, that will increase the pH which is something that we do NOT want to do. Eventually we won't even be able to test the pH because it will be off the charts. I realize that Africans like a higher pH, but if I use the cc to increase it, I don't know about having the pH maintained at 9.0 That's high.

 

[greenmaji]

CC and limestone wont really disove at that PH (they stop disloving around the low 8's)... It would take CO2 to get it to disove..ACK! .. sounds like your stuck between a rock and a hard place so to speek..
Have you tested the PH after the water has set out? Im pretty sure that calcium bicarbonate will rase the KH and not the PH but you dont want to add artifical chemicals.. Maybe you could do some geological reserch on what stones look like that containe the elements you would need? thats a really big streach by the way.. Wish I could help you out on this one more..

 

[Fishyfanatic]

I may try the cc since it really helped raise the hardness and pH at the old house. And if it makes the pH get too high, then I'll resort to something else. I have a huge 50 lb bag of it sitting in my living room. Might as well make use of it. I think that the effects have worn off considering that it hasn't done anything to the tank since we re-set it up.

 

[greenmaji]

calcium reactors use CO2 to get CC to continue disolving past a PH of 8 (by lowering the PH in the reactor, with the CO2).. I think your tap water ph might hinder the CC from working... Im just trying to give you a heads up in case you put new CC in and nothing happens..HTH