White ball on tetras, one dead, town water?

The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an interest in aquariums or fish keeping!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.

Deminox

Aquarium Advice Regular
Joined
Oct 3, 2014
Messages
80
Tank setup: ten gallons. Heated. (Temp is in the high end of green on thermometer. I'm at work don't remember the exact number). Filtered, air stone as well, planted with 5 swords and a moss ball. Gravel substrate. 2 nerite snails. 6 neon tetras >1year old.

Tank condition: ph ranges between 6.9 and 7.1 month to month. Amonia/nitrite/nitrate - 0. KH is 4

Fish problem: over 2 months ago one tetra developed a white ball on the side of its lip, about the size if it's eye, maybe a bit bigger. Still ate and swam fine. Shortly after, a second one developed a smaller ball under its chin. All still behave normally. A week after that, sick goldfish in a different tank (29 gal, they are better now). No cross contamination between any accessories (except the tubing and gravel vac, but that gets washed and dries fully between every use. But no shared nets or anything). I thought maybe a town water issue since two tanks got sick around similar times.

Used melafix in both tanks, slight increase to salt as well, full treatments, water changes after, etc. Goldfish got better. No change in neons. I thought, "ok whatever this is clearly its benign. They still eat, are unaffected in any way"

Last week one started hiding in a cave looking deco. Looked pale. Next day, more of them looked pale, and some red gills. And tops of their dorsal finds look clipped, same with bottom of lower fins. Couple days later, one was stuck under the driftwood dead, belly open (though i guess in tetras that isn't uncommon for the belly to rupture if the body isn't found right away. I did a double shift so if it died in the morning it was about 11 hours between last seeing it and it being dead.) Also, that wasn't even the one that had been hiding.

Water STILL tests ok, so i don't understand the red gills, that usually indicates poisoning via water quality.

I looked up "white cotton fungus".. it doesn't look like that and there is no similar growth in the tank. it looks like a white ball.

I may lose the whole tank (except the snails which have started to lay eggs all over one plant. They won't ever hatch though,conditions won't be right for nerite.

Wondering A) Does anyone know what these white balls are? (More solid than fuzzy)
B) anyone know a safe way to treat the tank, where melafix didn't work)
C) if the tank wipes completely, anyone know how long i should wait before restocking, and how to treat without losing its cycle?
D) any ideas of the cause? Nerites don't normally lay eggs in fresh water aquariums, is that an indicator? Any clues in what I've said to pinpoint what may have happened?

This post brought to you by.. ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD
 
I think its fungus, because i finally got a closer look with a magnifying glass and even though it looks like a solid ball, it's actually like a pompom of very dense fluff in a ball shape. From what i understand fungus usually looks like fluff.

I'm trying fungus cure by api, and i put my two nerite snails in a quarantine tank so the meds won't kill them.

I bookmarked the links though and read up just in case. So thanks for pointing me in the right direction!

This post brought to you by.. ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD
 
I was just reading another, unrelated article and saw something that made me think of this thread:

Alongside morphological deformities common ailments include ‘neon tetra disease’ (NTD), caused by the microsporidian parasite Pleistophora hyphessobryconis and basically untreatable once it reaches an advanced stage.

Symptoms include restlessness, increased respiration, white patches on the skin, and an individual separating itself from the group. The spores (larval stage) of the parasite enter the fish through the mouth and burrow through the walls of the gut before settling in the muscles. There they produce cysts which cause rapid degeneration of the muscle tissue and development of the characteristic white patches.

Brachydanio rerio – Zebra ‘Danio’ (Brachydanio frankei, Danio rerio) — Seriously Fish
 
YES a few weeks ago I had a guppy that died with the exact symptoms op mentioned now I can finally know what caused it. Every web page I searched said fungal but it didn't match that exactly hmmm...


Sent from my iPhone using Aquarium Advice
 
I had looked at neon tetra disease. They have lived now for about 6 months with this problem, only one dead. If it was neon tetra disease they would have all died by now as far as i can tell. Plus I've yet to see it mention the large white balls.

They HAVE started to get a couple white patches, and their fins are not getting better or worse.

So far i have tried anti-fungals with no luck. A couple different antibiotics with no luck. Melafix and primafix with no luck. Nothing working yet. But they are still alive...

This post brought to you by.. ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD
 
I had this problem with one of my tanks. 3 bala sharks and two goldfish. All are still alive and have lost the white bumps although one goldfish still has discoloration on his lip from the bump. For me it was ich. After properly treating the tank with ich away and a daily salt bath for each fish, after around 5 days,everything went back ro normal.
Steps i used were.
1. Take the carbon out of the filter, if you cant remove the carbon then take out the pads but allow the filter to continue to run.
2. Do a 50% water change.
3. Start dosing the tank with ich away. (The meds take 3-5 days to work properly and you MUST remove the carbon or the medication will be neutralized)
4. Individual salt baths for each fish daily. I just used a very large mixing bowl, regular tap water, and regular cooking salt. Leave the fish in the bath until it rolls over (sometimes they fight rolling so if they become really wobbly thats fine too) then drop them straight back in the tank.
5. Add about 2 teaspoons of aquarium salt to the tank per 10 gallons just once.
6. Raise the temp in the tank 1 degree every two hours until its 5-7 degrees warmer.
After 5 days do another 50% water change and drop the temp 1degree every two hours until back to normal temp and everything should be normal again.

I really hope this helps
 
Sounds like a bacterial infection if so many fish are sick with it. YOu need to get a good antibiotic.Ken's Premium Sinking Pellets with Oxytetracycline 2.5mm
Please read this as ive noticed you made other similar threads, you must do some reading on this if it still hasn't resolved!
http://www.americanaquariumproducts.com/columnaris.html
Read ^ ^

After reading up on columnaris this would get my guess as well.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app
 
Yeah, i was gonna say it's definitely not ich, I've had the misfortune of seeing that before
I had thought columnaris a couple of times, especially since heat spikes it and in the summer the tank climbed fast in temp so i had to keep a fan on it. But the lack of any fish (aside from that one, which was one of the smaller ones and last added from the store) none have died.

I'm going to try the salt treatment on the whole tank as its only a 10 gal and all fish seem affected, but I'm a bit concerned about the 2 nerite snails. I don't want to quarantine the snails, as i don't want them reinfecting the water if i beat this thing. Wonder if they will be a lost cause.

But gram negative antibiotics didn't work so that's why I'm not sure if it is the big ugly C bacteria.

This post brought to you by.. ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD
 
There is a slow acting version of columnaris. This is the version I've mainly had and the fish last weeks, if not months (if that helps). Also there are other bacterial types which can infect a tank. Assuming in general that tank stability/stocking and water chemistry are fine, multiple problems in fish mainly suggest bacterial infection to me. White spot would be the main exception but the dotted, white salt-crystal like spots is pretty consistent case by case.

With antibiotics it would depend on what is used and how long you used it for. Generally I'd say needing a second treatment (eg 10 days all up) wouldn't surprise me. I've also found that tank temp spiking will stuff the treatment. Same as us going to somewhere quiet in bed when we have a bad flu I think.
 
Last edited:
After reading up on columnaris this would get my guess as well.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N900A using Aquarium Advice mobile app

I agree.

But gram negative antibiotics didn't work so that's why I'm not sure if it is the big ugly C bacteria.

This post brought to you by.. ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD

Latest best 'cure' for columnaris is both gram negative and positive meds installed at same time.
Kanamycin and furan are the two most effective meds used in combo at this time.


There is a slow acting version of columnaris. This is the version I've mainly had and the fish last weeks, if not months (if that helps). Also there are other bacterial types which can infect a tank.
^+1^
columnaris can wear many different hats!
http://www.myaquariumclub.com/columnaris-and-what-i-have-learned...-1689.html
 
I wonder (in idle moments) if furan/kanaplax are best or just most convenient? Perhaps this is the same thing?!

For example, the tetracycline group of meds (not tetracycline antibiotic itself) would probably work better as medicated food where high ph/mineral level renders them less effective. {Admittedly some of these antibiotics are dated}.

Oxidisers and dyes like potassium permanganate, h2o2, acriflavine, malachite green may be tricky to mix up and dose (ie you have to have your eye in). {also admittedly some of these may be for low level infections only}.

Triple sulpha with/without trimethoprim or ormetoprim - similar deal to furan/kanaplax although the sulpha meds may be a bit dated (or at least there is a view they are dated).

Salt / Melafix / Pimafix - imo an astounding win if they work with no other treatments.

So I can kind of see why furan/kanaplax is suggested as it does work but perhaps convenience plays a part as well? Ie These two work in most situations??
 
Sorry for the late reply everyone. Here's an update and a video link.

I tried increasing the salinity of the water, and they responded very well. No improvement in visible condition but they stopped hiding in the corner only coming out to eat, now they swim around a lot more. I did some more research on colomnaris vs Saprolegnia, and based on the way they respond to the salt and the malachite green / acriflavine mix, as well as the size and shape of the growths, i think I'm leaning more towards it being Saprolegnia, though i could be wrong.

Since i can't get a good photo as they dart around so quickly i uploaded a youtube video. Be sure to set it to view in hd, as viewing it on low quality makes it tough to see any of the splotches/growths.

One fish is either missing an eye or its just not dilated at all (don't think you can see it in the video, but doesn't look like there is a wound like a typical missing eye, but i can't really see the eye anymore either, looks like it was just erased smooth.)

There was also some small fluffy greyish matter almost like mold or cobwebs stuck to one tank deco. I cleaned that before placing the deco back in the tank. If that helps narrow down what is wrong.

Green water in video is because I'm currently doing another malachite green / acriflavine treatment to see if it helps.

https://youtu.be/38eFg2_KR3s

This post brought to you by.. ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOTOAD
 
Back
Top Bottom