X-mas Tank (1st Try at Saltwater)

[jackwagon]

I would like to start my first saltwater tank in the near future. This would be an extended build as I would slowly gather supplies until I can get it all at Christmas. I would like to keep this a 20 gallon long tank in order to keep general costs down. I would like to make this a reef tank also. I would like a pair of clownfish and am undecided on the rest of the stock. As far as corals go I would LOVE to have a Zoa garden like convict's. that's all I really know for sure now. Now here are the questions (sorry) haha.

1. I know for a reef you need 30-40x the turnover rate so would 2 hydor 425 work?

2. Skimmer?

3. Sump/fuge?

4. This tank would be built on a DIY stand and be in my basement so I would need a good heater. Suggestions?

5. Lighting?

6. Am I missing anything?

Thanks in advance

P.s: I hold this forum responsible for my aquarium addiction.

 

[obscurereef]

If you want zoas, and also mushrooms, they don't require much light, so lighting won't be an outrageous cost for you if you're just getting soft corals. I think those powerheads would be fine. Would definitley recommend a sump/refugium. Whatever fits under the stand or next to it if you like. Reef Octupus and AquaC Remora skimmers have great reputations and are high quality. Find out how big your skimmer will be, if you want one b/c you don't necessarily need one, and base that on how big the sump should be. Any heater would do; I use Finnex HMO Heater w/ Digital LED Controller - Heaters - Heaters & Chillers - Bulk Reef Supply on my 70 gallon aquarium and a smaller one on my 20 QT and had no problems, plus since it isn't glass it won't shatter or break if you somehow drop it. Recommend LEDs if you have the money, if not T5 HO work too!

 

[jackwagon]

Ok thanks for the response. Do you think a skimmer is necessary along with a sump or fuge? Could you tell me the benifits of each over not running either?

 

[obscurereef]

Well the refugium isn't going to do much. Yes it might reduce the nitrates a little, but even a 100 gallon refugium isn't going to solve all your problems. I think it is too heavily relied on, when in reality, a small piece of macroalgae isn't going to do miracles. Of course there are all the benefits: filtration, area for pods to grow and not be eaten (same goes for the macroalgae), and reduction in nitrates (since they feed off of this). I made that kind of confusing, hopefully it's somewhat understandable. Benefits of running it is it really helps out with getting a lot of the waste that would otherwise decompose and raise nitrates. Also helps if you overfeed, which many beginners do unknowingly. This can raise nitrates, phosphates, and cause cyano and hair algae, etc. With regular water changes, like 10% or more each week, you can keep waste to a minimum hopefully. If you don't think this is possible, I'd say get the skimmer as it really helps out, but manually taking out waste and water and replenishing it weekly will be enough where you wouldn't need a skimmer. I think Convict runs his biocube with no skimmer and he does 5 gallon water changes a week and you can see those stunning results working!

 

[jackwagon]

Ok speaking of water changes, how would I do that? What water and what salt is best? Distilled? I can't afford an RO unit right now. Also any suggestions on lights? And a skimmer?

 

[jackwagon]

Also what about a refractometer? Or will a hydrometer work? A test kit?

 

[obscurereef]

For my water changes/maintenance for my 70 gallon DT, every weekend I mix 10-15 gallons of SW in a 30 gallon BRUTE trash bin 24 or more hours before hand. You want to allow 24 hours (preferably mixing with a powerhead) for at least 24 hours so the salt can dissolve completely. Try to match the salinity & temp as close as possible w/ the new water made. Blow off debris off rocks, but I don't blow the sand (can use a siphon if you want or even turkey baster) and most of the debris goes down my overflow to my filter sock. Turn off all equipment, drain about 10-15 gallons of water while debris is still floating, then replace it with the new water. I also, I turn on the washing machine and pre-rinse w/ no detergent or anything. Then throw my filter sock in there w/ no detergent and let it air dry. One last thing is I clean out the skimmer, the more it's cleaned, the higher efficiency. Overview: blow debris from rocks, turn everything off, empty some water, fill it with pre-mixed new water, turn everything back on except for lights so fish don't get stressed. Can you afford distilled water from the grocery store? That would be much better than tap. What's your budget on lighting and do you only want to keep soft corals? I use 6 60" sunlight supply TEK T5 HO which will grow almost anything. Here's some lighting if you're you want to look on your own.
24 Inch T5 Fluorescent Light Fixtures | Marine Depot

 

[obscurereef]

For highest accuracy, and if you're keeping a lot of corals and want to make sure you know your exact salinity, then go with refractometer. Otherwise a hydrometer would be fine. API standard SW test kit works for cycle and can use the reef one too, but they aren't super accurate. Salifert and Red Sea are more accurate and awesome

 

[jackwagon]

Ok here is what I understand

If I don't run a protein skimmer, I will have more water changes to do. So 2 gallons of a 20 gallon tank is 10% once a week. Is this enough? How expensive?

My budget is pretty low. I am hoping to either get equipment for x-mas or amazon gift cards.

Lighting is one of the most expensive parts but also one of the most important. I am planning on only growing beginner, easy care corals to start. Maybe an anemone later for the clowns but nothing special.

I still don't understand what kind of filtration to run though.

 

[obscurereef]

It would be best to do 10 % water change even with a protein skimmer, just means you'd have "cleaner" water. Protein skimmer is just a piece of equipment to help out. On larger tanks it is preferred b/c of how much waste there is. Smaller tanks, it's not a huge problem.

 

[jackwagon]

It would be best to do 10 % water change even with a protein skimmer, just means you'd have "cleaner" water. Protein skimmer is just a piece of equipment to help out. On larger tanks it is preferred b/c of how much waste there is. Smaller tanks, it's not a huge problem.

Ok thanks. So without a tank, filter, and protein skimmer, rock, sand and etc. I'm looking at around $230. Is this light ok? http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B0002DIRBY/ref=mp_s_a_7?pi=SL75&qid=1349749792&sr=1-7

 

[jackwagon]

As far as corals go I really need some good ideas that will work. I am a beginner, so ones that allow some room for error are nice. . I would like to try to buy a good lighting fixture but I would like to keep it 70> if at all possible. Also I'm seeing that an upgrade from a 24" fixture to a 30" fixture is nearly $20! So maybe a standard 20 gallon would be the easiest. Also I have been looking at test kits and the API one looks good but everyone else doesn't seem to like it. So my question is could I get both the marine and reef test kit and be ok in the long run even with some corals? What would I need to dose for beginner corals?

 

[jackwagon]

Also could I just run an emperor 280 for filtration?I would rather do that because I already have an emperor 400 on my 55 and would like to keep the cartridges the same. And how much live sand/rock would be needed. And then how much sand/rock total?

 

[Luis1662]

As far as dosing goes I have a 40gal reef and I don't dose at all. U can see my pic of my tank in my profile and the corals I have in it. By doing water changes you replenish a lot of the stuff(calcium, magnesium etc..) the corals need. It's only a 20gal so water changes help out quite a bit. I used a bout 2 1/2-3 bags of sand for my tank gave me about a 2" sand bed. Some people like deeper some like it none at all, it's up too you. The rocks is different I'm sure everyone will have there own opinion about how much to put in there. I just put what looked good. Obviously 4 or 5 rocks isn't going to cut it as I've seen some people use there live rock as most of there filtration. If your budget is low buy it used. Go on Craigslist and find people that are getting out of the hobby that's what I did. The stores here in fl sell it for 7-8$ a pound and i got it for 2-3$ a pound. Just make sure the tank is healthy before buying it. Don't want to be introducing bad stuff in the new tank. Once everything is in let it do it's thing for a while(cycle) good luck and ask questions. a lot of people on this site know quite a bit about tanks.

 

[jackwagon]

Ok thanks. I am planning in getting mostly base rock and then adding a little live rock I seed the rest. As far as stocking goes, I definitely want a pair of occellaris (spelling?) clowns. I also would like a goby of some kind but I'm open to all suggestions. Thanks. If someone could answer my question about filtration that would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Luis1662]

Not 100% but the next thread down from your it's marked (lots of newbie questions) he's starting a new tank and from some of the pics he's running two of those hang on filters. I didn't read it but maybe youll have some answers there about those filters. I have seen saltwater tanks with them on there and the tank looked awesome but they were established tank. Not sure of that makes a difference.

 

[jackwagon]

I couldn't find it. Could you provide a link? How about my lighting idea?

 

[Luis1662]

Nicoleisstoked. I believe that's her username. Don't know how to make a link to her posts but u can look her up and find the one with the "newbie questions". As for the lights I'm don't know how deep your tank is can't be that much being a 20gal but u can prob keep lower light softies and lps maybe. Lighting is such a big aspect of this hobby it's hard to tell u what to get and I know there damm expensive

 

[obscurereef]

As far as corals go I really need some good ideas that will work. I am a beginner, so ones that allow some room for error are nice. . I would like to try to buy a good lighting fixture but I would like to keep it 70> if at all possible. Also I'm seeing that an upgrade from a 24" fixture to a 30" fixture is nearly $20! So maybe a standard 20 gallon would be the easiest. Also I have been looking at test kits and the API one looks good but everyone else doesn't seem to like it. So my question is could I get both the marine and reef test kit and be ok in the long run even with some corals? What would I need to dose for beginner corals?

Yeah standard sizes are going to be less money than others. I would know from having a 70 gallon 5 foot tank and having to buy a 60" light instead of a 48" . I think you'd be okay in the long run. If you keep corals that are easy and allow some room for error which would be soft corals/polyps, etc. I think a semi-accurate test would be okay. Hard corals are a different story, plus they need more lighting and consistent/ideal parameters most of the time creating more light/work than I think you want to commit to right now. If you have a good salt, say Red Sea Coral Pro Salt (I use this, it's awesome ) or reef crystals, I don't think you'd need to dose much. Maybe you can get some B-ionic 2 part system bottles to dose on occasion if your levels get too low, but since you have a small tank, and prob. not a lot of corals that require high calcium, you should be fine w/ just the salt.

 

[obscurereef]

Also could I just run an emperor 280 for filtration?I would rather do that because I already have an emperor 400 on my 55 and would like to keep the cartridges the same. And how much live sand/rock would be needed. And then how much sand/rock total?

Are these biowheel type filters? If so, it would probably be best to get a different filter that is rated up to twice your tank. So something for a 40 gallon would work. Reef tanks require lower nitrates, and filtration helps with keeping them down. Lot's of people recommend and love the aquaclear filter for their SW reef tanks/FOWLR.