Cichlid info please

[Fishmasters44]

How many cichlids can I fit in a 10 gallon? 20?

 

[rocksor]

for a 10g you are stuck with only a pair Neolamprologus multifasciatus

for a 20g, you could do 2 pairs

Neolamprologus multifasciatus

 

[phishfriend]

No South Americans can go in a 10. You could put 2 Rams in a 20. I don't believe you could house any Africans in those sizes either

 

[phishfriend]

for a 10g or 20g you are stuck with only Neolamprologus multifasciatus

Neolamprologus multifasciatus

I stand corrected! forgot about shell dwellers

 

[bamadude91]

You're going to find few individuals on this forum that are going to recommend an aquarium tank size for cichlids smaller than the size of the African Rift Lakes themselves. You may as well glass in your entire house, because that's the size you're going to need.
Sarcasm aside, in all seriousness the larger the tank the better obviously. If you provide your cichlids with ample hiding spots and keep the tank clean, you can make a 10 or 20 gallon work.
I started with a 10 gallon (tetras. boooooring) and I've been working my way up to a 55 gallon cichlid tank. 10 gallon was sitting empty, so I put it on my desk and put 3 african cichlids in it. Behavior isn't any different than the fish in the larger tank.

 

[Mrc8858]

You're going to find few individuals on this forum that are going to recommend an aquarium tank size for cichlids smaller than the size of the African Rift Lakes themselves. You may as well glass in your entire house, because that's the size you're going to need.
Sarcasm aside, in all seriousness the larger the tank the better obviously. If you provide your cichlids with ample hiding spots and keep the tank clean, you can make a 10 or 20 gallon work.
I started with a 10 gallon (tetras. boooooring) and I've been working my way up to a 55 gallon cichlid tank. 10 gallon was sitting empty, so I put it on my desk and put 3 african cichlids in it. Behavior isn't any different than the fish in the larger tank.

I'm sorry but that's not good advice at all. A 4ft tank isn't that big, we aren't requesting "lakes" be provided for these fish just enough room to spread out some territory. Most cichlids are very territorial and if not provided enough space (which a 10 for Africans is way to small) once they begin to mature you will see aggression issues. OP-If you give us an idea of what kinds of cichlids you would like to keep we can go from there because cichlids come in all shapes, sizes, and colors.

 

[bamadude91]

I said you can make a 10 or 20 gallon work, I didn't necessarily recommend it. I also said the bigger the tank size, the better.
I've had 3 African cichlids in the 10 gallon since June. They have plenty of hiding spots and each fish has its own territory. All three of the fish are female. The Kenyi occupies a cave on the left side of the tank, the Auratus on the right. The Acei occupies a hollow pirate skull in the center (and the dug out gravel hole next to it).
But it doesn't matter what I say because I'm going to be criminalized for it.

 

[Mrc8858]

I said you can make a 10 or 20 gallon work, I didn't necessarily recommend it. I also said the bigger the tank size, the better.
I've had 3 African cichlids in the 10 gallon since June. They have plenty of hiding spots and each fish has its own territory. All three of the fish are female. The Kenyi occupies a cave on the left side of the tank, the Auratus on the right. The Acei occupies a hollow pirate skull in the center (and the dug out gravel hole next to it).
But it doesn't matter what I say because I'm going to be criminalized for it.

........

 

[Freakgecko91]

In a 10, 5 n. multifasciatus will work actually, not just a single pair. They don't require large territories, I have 4 comfortable in a 6.6 gallon. They occupy each corner and all three females are spawning constantly with the single male.

As for the 10 gallon with Africans, you are going to be criminalizes for it because you are talking about fish that are highly aggressive as they mature! Auratus are HIGHLY unpredictable as adults and are known to be quite aggressive. Plus keeping a super aggressive mbuna like a Auratus or kenyi with a more peaceful mbuna like an acei is just going to end up with a dead acei. Please remember that the whole "fish only grow to the size of their container" has been proven to be 100% myth. What happens is the body stops growing, while the organs continue to grow, causing a slow and painful death from deformity. 100% avoidable by being responsible. Please get them the correct tank or rename them, as you'll soon have 3 dead fish.

 

[Wyomingite]

I'm really gonna get some people goin' here, but I'm gonna cry "Foul!" on half the posts above. One of my biggest pet peeves is folks who immediately make broad statements that something can't be done or shouldn't be done, and don't provide justification to back it up.

A breeding pair of the majority of the 3"-4" Neolamprologus, Julidochromis or Telmatochromis species from Lake Tanganyika, a pair or trio of any of the South American dwarf cichlids (apistos, rams,Taeniacara, Nannacara, Dicrossus, etc.), a pair of any of the smaller West African cichlids, and two or three pairs of any of the shell dwellers (with room for a bit of population expansion) will work fine in a 20 long.

A 20 long is 30" long and 12" wide. How does anyone figure that a compatible breeding pair of 3.5" fish shouldn't go in there? That's around 8x the length of the fish long and 3x times it's length plus wide. Folks will keep a breeding pair of JDs in a 75 with similar relative proportions and not think twice about it. Even more amazing, is how do ya justify that it isn't appropriate for a pair of 2.5" fish? Speaking, from experience, there is plenty of room for the species and combos above in a 20 long.

10 gallon? Well, I'll admit cichlids and 10 gallon tanks are trickier, but not impossible. I'd limit to a pair of the Congochromis species and the smaller Nanochromis species, a pair of any of the smaller apistos that aren't strict harem breeders, Nannacara anomala, Taeniacara candidi, a pair of Telmatochromis brichardi, or a couple pairs of multies (again with a small bit of room for population growth with these). These combos can be successful, but I wouldn't recommend trying any of the pairs without a second tank available to remove one or the other should aggression get out of hand. I can agree that multies are your best option for a 10 gallon, but I would not outright say it is your only option.

Multie females barely reach an inch and a 1.5" male is large. They're a colonial species that do not demand huge territories. Throw in 3-4 shells per individual and there is still room to keep some of the offspring. If ya do go the shelldwellers route for a 20 long, multies aren't your only option. There's are several species of shell dwellers that average in the 1.5-2" range for males; brevis and occies come to mind immediately.

These fish will grow to full size, breed, and have perfectly normal lifespans. To say that there are no cichlids that can go in a 10 or 20 is opinion, not fact. The fact is that there are cichlids that will be comfortable and can be kept in a 10 or 20 gallon tank long term with no ill side-effects.

What is really being said, is "In your opinion it shouldn't be done." How many have actually kept many of the species from the genera named above, the species that WILL do well in smaller tanks, other than the commonly sold species? Over the years I've had to special order 3/4 of the species from the genera I've named above because they aren't commonly available and ya won't see 'em every day in your LFS.

I'm sorry, but this is goin' the same route as a previous thread where posters were on a kick that JDs and GTs can reach a foot long and can't be housed comfortably in a 55 gallon tank. Before I bash bamadude91 for keepin' three Africans in a 10, I'll at least ask what species. I'll likely bash him anyways, in all fairness, since most Africans shouldn't be kept in a 10. But I'll at least give him the benefit of the doubt.

WYite

 

[KryptiCouple]

I said you can make a 10 or 20 gallon work, I didn't necessarily recommend it. I also said the bigger the tank size, the better.
I've had 3 African cichlids in the 10 gallon since June. They have plenty of hiding spots and each fish has its own territory. All three of the fish are female. The Kenyi occupies a cave on the left side of the tank, the Auratus on the right. The Acei occupies a hollow pirate skull in the center (and the dug out gravel hole next to it).
But it doesn't matter what I say because I'm going to be criminalized for it.

I'm really gonna get some people goin' here, but I'm gonna cry "Foul!" on half the posts above. One of my biggest pet peeves is folks who immediately make broad statements that something can't be done or shouldn't be done, and don't provide justification to back it up.

A breeding pair of the majority of the 3"-4" Neolamprologus, Julidochromis or Telmatochromis species from Lake Tanganyika, a pair or trio of any of the South American dwarf cichlids (apistos, rams,Taeniacara, Nannacara, Dicrossus, etc.), a pair of any of the smaller West African cichlids, and two or three pairs of any of the shell dwellers (with room for a bit of population expansion) will work fine in a 20 long.

A 20 long is 30" long and 12" wide. How does anyone figure that a compatible breeding pair of 3.5" fish shouldn't go in there? That's around 8x the length of the fish long and 3x times it's length plus wide. Folks will keep a breeding pair of JDs in a 75 with similar relative proportions and not think twice about it. Even more amazing, is how do ya justify that it isn't appropriate for a pair of 2.5" fish? Speaking, from experience, there is plenty of room for the species and combos above in a 20 long.

10 gallon? Well, I'll admit cichlids and 10 gallon tanks are trickier, but not impossible. I'd limit to a pair of the Congochromis species and the smaller Nanochromis species, a pair of any of the smaller apistos that aren't strict harem breeders, Nannacara anomala, Taeniacara candidi, a pair of Telmatochromis brichardi, or a couple pairs of multies (again with a small bit of room for population growth with these). These combos can be successful, but I wouldn't recommend trying any of the pairs without a second tank available to remove one or the other should aggression get out of hand. I can agree that multies are your best option for a 10 gallon, but I would not outright say it is your only option.

Multie females barely reach an inch and a 1.5" male is large. They're a colonial species that do not demand huge territories. Throw in 3-4 shells per individual and there is still room to keep some of the offspring. If ya do go the shelldwellers route for a 20 long, multies aren't your only option. There's are several species of shell dwellers that average in the 1.5-2" range for males; brevis and occies come to mind immediately.

These fish will grow to full size, breed, and have perfectly normal lifespans. To say that there are no cichlids that can go in a 10 or 20 is opinion, not fact. The fact is that there are cichlids that will be comfortable and can be kept in a 10 or 20 gallon tank long term with no ill side-effects.

What is really being said, is "In your opinion it shouldn't be done." How many have actually kept many of the species from the genera named above, the species that WILL do well in smaller tanks, other than the commonly sold species? Over the years I've had to special order 3/4 of the species from the genera I've named above because they aren't commonly available and ya won't see 'em every day in your LFS.

I'm sorry, but this is goin' the same route as a previous thread where posters were on a kick that JDs and GTs can reach a foot long and can't be housed comfortably in a 55 gallon tank. Before I bash bamadude91 for keepin' three Africans in a 10, I'll at least ask what species. I'll likely bash him anyways, in all fairness, since most Africans shouldn't be kept in a 10. But I'll at least give him the benefit of the doubt.

WYite

Highlighted what fish he said he has in his 10.

 

[Wyomingite]

Highlighted what fish he said he has in his 10.

LOL, thanks. Read right over it.

They have no business bein' there...

WYite

 

[Viperchaos]

Just to notify a previouse comment, I keep 20+ 3-4" Auratus in a 26 gal with 100gal turn over, All oxygenation created by water movement, which the fry grew in 6 months, feeding them solely a vegetable diet, they're stil growing are very meaty and always are breeding,
Baring in mind that I haven't had a single animal die in my care for 3 years.I don't think keeping those 3 fish in 10 gallons of water is criminal at all.

 

[Wyomingite]

Just a quick link to some "cookie cutter" cichlid set-ups, including set-ups for 10 and 20 gallon tanks. I don't totally agree with some of the the options stated in the 20 long set-ups, especially the SA and CA set-ups. But this can get the OP thinkin' 'bout what kind of cichlids he might like and then he can bounce it off some folks to help him choose fish appropriate for his tank.

Aquarium Quick Reference Resources - Cichlid Keeping

WYite

 

[Wy Renegade]

I said you can make a 10 or 20 gallon work, I didn't necessarily recommend it. I also said the bigger the tank size, the better.
I've had 3 African cichlids in the 10 gallon since June. They have plenty of hiding spots and each fish has its own territory. All three of the fish are female. The Kenyi occupies a cave on the left side of the tank, the Auratus on the right. The Acei occupies a hollow pirate skull in the center (and the dug out gravel hole next to it).
But it doesn't matter what I say because I'm going to be criminalized for it.

First of all, lets address this. It may be working for you right now, while the fish are juveniles and haven't started establishing real territories, but it isn't going to work out in the long run. People who say, "oh I've done this for a few months, so it can be done successfully," lack the experience of dealing with the full grown adults. Some of these cichlids will take a year or more to reach maturity and establish territories, and once they do reach that point you are going to see a whole different level of aggression in that small tank. IME, either the Kenyi or the Auratus will end be the sole survivor, most likely it will be which ever fish is male.

Just to notify a previouse comment, I keep 20+ 3-4" Auratus in a 26 gal with 100gal turn over, All oxygenation created by water movement, which the fry grew in 6 months, feeding them solely a vegetable diet, they're stil growing are very meaty and always are breeding,
Baring in mind that I haven't had a single animal die in my care for 3 years. I don't think keeping those 3 fish in 10 gallons of water is criminal at all.

I'd like to see a picture of your set-up and a detailed explaination of how you are accomplishing this, because quite frankly I have a lot of experience keeping cichlids and I know quite a bit about this particular fish, and I find what you are describing to be highly unlikely.

 

[Mrc8858]

I agree about the auratus tank. Your talking about close to 80" of fish in a 26 gallon tank. I know the inch per gallon rule means nothing but that tank has got to be jammed pack. Plus all the auratus I've owned once they hit 2" they became little demon fish attacking/bullying fish of any size. Your tank is extremely overstocked and unless only one of those fish are male your gonna start seein sub doms dropping like flies lol

 

[Wyomingite]

...I'd like to see a picture of your set-up and a detailed explaination of how you are accomplishing this, because quite frankly I have a lot of experience keeping cichlids and I know quite a bit about this particular fish, and I find what you are describing to be highly unlikely.

Ditto, on all counts. Auratus are one of the most aggressive species I've ever kept and I'm havin' a lotta trouble picturin' that bein' successful. How often do ya do water changes? With that bio load and that low of a filtration rate, I can't imagine it's easy keepin' high water quality. Not to mention, dominant males are absolutely intolerant of other males, and I seriously doubt ya have 1 male and 19 females. Sub-dominant males would have no escape, so how have ya avoided losses?

WYite

 

[garfy]

Ditto, on all counts. Auratus are one of the most aggressive species I've ever kept and I'm havin' a lotta trouble picturin' that bein' successful. How often do ya do water changes? With that bio load and that low of a filtration rate, I can't imagine it's easy keepin' high water quality. Not to mention, dominant males are absolutely intolerant of other males, and I seriously doubt ya have 1 male and 19 females. Sub-dominant males would have no escape, so how have ya avoided losses?

WYite

Likewise male Auratus do not tolerate each other and death will be the end result.They are ruthless when it comes to other males when they hit 3-4"