Goldfish owners - help with the fish my son won at the fair!

[tony3]

Hello,

I am 6 weeks into the cycle process for a saltwater tank, and the grandparents won a goldfish for my son at the fair yesterday. They paid the extra $5 for the "deluxe" tank, which is about 1/3 gallon rectangular tank. I put some gravel and small plastic plant in the tank, and added a few more cups of RO water to the tank.

I have read as much as possible on keeping these fish in a "bowl" and I know that it is very cruel on the fish and they may not be happy in this small tank with no filtration, heater, lighting, and limited space (I cannot spend the $30-50 on a small tank, because I have already spent more than $1,000 too much on our saltwater tank setup). Please do not yell at me for keeping these fish, because I would not have allowed it to happen if I was there -- he would have had to settle with the fish stuffed animal. So please help me with these fish... I have a few questions:

1. How often and how much should I change the water? I was thinking about a 30-40% water change three times a week, is that too much? Is it more stressful to perform the water change often or more stressful to live in the contaminated water?

2. How often should I do a full tank cleaning? I was thinking every 3 to 4 weeks? Or do you just wait until you can see the junk piling up in the gravel or the water becomes cloudy?

3. Would one of those cheap $5 disposable filters hooked up to a cheap $5 air pump help make this small tank (1/3 gallon) more livable, or is this a waste of $10?

4. How big will these fish get? Can I keep them in a 1/3 gallon tank for long, or will they outgrow it quickly? I could not find anything on the Internet for the max captive size for the common goldfish.

5. Is there any else that I can do to help keep these fish alive and healthy?

I know that it is hard to give advice to someone that is not being nice to fish, but I really want to make these fish as happy as they can be in the small tank. Thanks you for your help.

Tony

 

[Zic]

OK. I have recently looked into seeing if I can "get by" with a plain old glass bowl for a goldfish. I decided against it for reasons you already understand. If the bowl you have now is only 1/3 gallon, I'd try to upgrade. For about five bucks you can get a bowl that holds about a gallon and a half. If you can afford a bigger one, even better.

I would get an air pump to pump some air into the bowl. I think that would help some. As for the changing of the water, I can't really say, as I haven't actually done this before.

Unfortunatly, the fish has probably been handled poorly before you even got it. I doubt the carnies cared if the fish had clean water. So, you may have the fish die even if you take very good care of the water. if this happens, your small tank will house a betta quite nicely. They don't require as much as the goldfish you now have.

 

[Zic]

Also, you didn't say how old your son was. If he's old enough, you may be able to explain why the fish won't be happy. Maybe you could see if he could earn money to buy his own tank by say, mowing Grandma and Grandpa's yard (They started this, remember ). You can buy a ten gallon tank at PetSmart for 25 bucks (includes the hood and light) another twenty dollars will buy him a filter and he'll be good to go.

 

[tony3]

Hi Zic,

Thanks for your advice. I appreciate your helpful and "nice" replies (I was expecting to get yelled at by serious fish keepers -- which I deserve).

My son is only 3, and he really loves fish. 2 months ago, we both wanted to have Nemo, Dory, Bubbles, and Bruce in a 50 gallon tank. After researching these fish and saltwater fish keeping, we have decided to start with Nemo and Marlin (a mated clownfish pair) only, because Dory needs 100 gallon tank, and Bruce would need 1000 gallon tank -- so he does understand the limitation of our 50 gallon saltwater tank, but he has already fallen in love with A, B, and C (I did not mention that the carnies at the fair actually put 3 fish in this 1/3 gallon tank).

After looking at PetSmart.com, I think I will make Mom buy the Marineland Eclipse System 3 for these fish, if they make it a few weeks. This is the only fair thing for the fish in the long run.

I will add the $5 air pump and the $5 disposable filter for now, because it can't hurt. I will also do a 50% water change every other day, and monitor the ammonia and nitrite levels.

Are there any other ideas on how to keep these fish for the next 2-3 weeks before we get a real tank with filtration and lighting?

Tony

 

[tony3]

Also, are there any chemicals or conditioners that I can add to the water to help with the "bad" water conditions in this type of fish bowl? Will the 50% water changes every other day keep the ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates in a safe range?

I am very quickly coming to the realization that I need a real tank for these fish today, not in a few weeks (it will be cheaper than buying the air pump, replaceable corner filter, chemicals, etc. today).

So, if I decide to buy a real tank for these fish today: The new tank must cycle too (just like my saltwater tank I assume), which will take 4-8 weeks. What do I do with the fish during the cycle? Will they live in tank while it is cycling? Or do I leave them in the small bowl and perform the frequent water changes while the tank cycles, and then add the fish after the tank has cycled?

 

[sweetsuvvyb]

Hello there!

I bought 2 goldfish in March, dumped them in a 2 gallon novelty tank with an underground filter, and bubbler (a sarcastic thank you to the man at petco who said they'd do fine in there).

The tank was never clean, nomatter how many water changes...it never really cycled. I ended up relying heavily on ammo-lock, because the ammonia levels were uncontrollable. My fan-tail still ended up with ammonia burns (Thankfully, he survived).

I finally just bought them a 10gallon...which still isn't really enough room for 2 fish (should be sufficient for one), but they are quite happy. The tank does need to cycle...but my goldfish survived the cycle without so much as a flinch (I'm guessing the cycling tank conditions, while bad, were still so much better than those in the little tank). I did add a pinch of salt when the nitrites were high, and did daily water changes to keep things dilute. It cycled in about 10 days.

Sadly, I'm sure their lifes have been shortened from the poor conditions early in their life...but I strive to give them a happy home now.

I think the general recommendation is 10-20 gallons per goldfish...but like i said, I have 2 in my 10 gallon right now. the fish will probably do fine with the cycling (just keep checking the levels + doing partial changes, and if they get too unruly, or the fish appears stressed, maybe consider taking them out).

Something else to consider...goldfish are pretty dirty little guys...the smaller the tank you decide on....the more you'll need to clean it. Since I'm really pushing the limits with the 10g...I have to gravel vac at least 2x a week, if not more...and consequently, I keep going through little "mini-cycles" (since the bacteria haven't had a chance to really situate themselves before i suck them out).

Anyway...good luck!

 

[harleychick]

I've seen a feeder goldfish get pretty big (like 8".) Don't use RO water because it lacks the necessary minerals that the fish need. Plain old tap water with a dechlorinator thrown in will do. If you do use RO, buy some of the stuff that puts the minerals and trace elements back in.

Keep your eye on the Thrifty Nickel or whatever newspaper it's called in your area. You know, the freeby that comes out once a week and lists all kinds of things for sale. Also ask anyone you know that goes garage saleing to be on the lookout for you a used 10 or 20 gallon. Wal-Mart also has some inexpensive tank set-ups.

Good luck with your goldfish.

~ T

 

[Allivymar]

Heh, no reason to yell at you. Now if you put the grandparents on we might want a word with them

There's a great website devoted to goldfish here: www.goldfishinfo.com . Full of goldfish specific info.

Keep in mind well kept goldies can easily live up to 20 yrs. The oldest one on record is 43! They are truly a long term commitment, despite their usually short term lives.

 

[tony3]

Thanks for the good advice SweetSUV and Harley! I did add the stuff that adds the minerals and other stuff back to the RO water, but I better make sure that it is safe for fresh water fish. I think I will just use the cheap 1 gallon filtered water at the grocery store in the future.

I will also check Wal-Mart -- I bet they will have a very cheap tank setup too. I like the Marineland Eclipse System, because it has the BIO-wheel built in. Fish keeping is a major responsibility, and I want to make sure my son learns the importance of taking good care of his pets.

 

[tony3]

Thank you Allivymar for the kind words (I still feel responsible for these poor little fish ), in fact everyone has been very helpful and very nice to me -- this web site is great for getting help -- the guys at the local fish store were not too helpful last night!

Thanks for the reference to www.goldfishinfo.com -- it is very helpful!

 

[Madame_X]

I will also check Wal-Mart -- I bet they will have a very cheap tank setup too. I like the Marineland Eclipse System, because it has the BIO-wheel built in. Fish keeping is a major responsibility, and I want to make sure my son learns the importance of taking good care of his pets.

Do check at Wal-Mart, Tony. They have a 5 gallon Eclipse clone (I've been told its actually made by Marineland and sold under another name) that is the same price as the Eclipse 3. The more space, the better!

Just don't look at the horrid condition of the tanks while you're there. 8O

 

[tony3]

Thanks everyone again for the advice and help. Unfortunately, we suffered a loss yesterday -- "A" died. So now we have two goldfish "B" and "C" in this small tank.

The ammonia in the tank was relatively low last night (0.5 ppm) after two days in the tank. I did a 60% water change, and the ammonia went back to 0 and the tank was clear. If "B" and/or "C" are living by Saturday, then I will buy them a new 5 gallon tank from Wal-Mart (thanks for the tip Madame).

 

[sweetsuvvyb]

good luck!

and do keep in mind that even in a 5gal, you'll still need to change the water very frequently, you might not even actually get a cycle (I'm still struggling with my 10gal and 2 goldfish...they just output so much ammonia and poop!)

 

[echo7]

i definately wouldn't do 50% water changes every other day- the stress alone would kill it. i would suggest 10 or 20 % water changes every other day for the first week marbe and then 2 10% water changes every week. i would get that eclipse tank or a 5 gal. I don't even think a zebra danio could survive for long in your current setup. but like you said its the grandparents fault.

i wouldn't get anything from wal-mart! they are the people who put the goldfish in tiny bowls- have you seen thier fish dept! i can't see how anything can survive- they put 3 bettas and maybe 30 tiger barbs with 2 gold fish in a tank! Aquarists should all boycot Wal-Mart