Hypothetical ammonia levels question...

[bluerose]

How long would it take for water in an itty-bitty betta bowl to hit 8.0ppm ammonia? I'm thinking several days at least.

Trying to convince a friend that he did not kill the betta he was taking care of, but filthy slimy water and 8.0+ ammonia levels did... (he told me betta looked thin and water was 'dirty'-- it was more like sludge).

Betta was barely breathing, not eating for some amount of time, and extremely thin, pale, and his fins were very jagged... he was also canting his tail to one side constantly. This was Thursday, he died today (Saturday).

I'm thinking he was on his way out when my friend got the fish due to ammonia poisoning, myself.

 

[mike47517]

It probably wasn't his fault but he does need to do water changes. Ammonia is more deadly than chlorine so if there was any ammonia in the bowl then that is probably whhat did it.

 

[bluerose]

He got the fish on Thursday... was at a loss because of the extreme condition of the bowl so asked me to come look. I scrubbed the bowl, cleaned all the gravel, rinsed about 10 times to get all the gook out (twice with dechlor water). So as of Thursday he was in clean water... and seeing as he's been eating the betta pellets I provided, there hasn't been any wasted food since then.

You didn't answer my question though.

 

[mike47517]

You didn't answer my question though.

Sorry. I don't know how long it takes for ammonia to build up. I have never had ammonia in my tanks and as long as he keeps up with his water changes he won't either.

 

[jsoong]

This is a hypothetical <theoretical> answer:

Assuming that all the ammonia comes from fish food (eaten or not), and that the betta food contains 40% protein, and the bowl is 1 liter (1/4 gal), and the tank is NOT cycled:

1g of fish food has 40% protein = 400mg
400mg protein has 16% nitrogen = 64 mg
which would make roughly 75 mg of ammonia.

8ppm of ammonia = 8 mg/l

So you would need to add about 1/10 of a g of fish food to get to 8ppm in a 1 l bowl.

How much food is that? about 1/20 of a teaspoon. That is a LOT of food for a betta. I say at least a week's worth of feeding.

 

[bluerose]

Thanks! I fail miserably at this math stuff...

Friend is considering replacing betta. It's a really odd situation... I suggested he not unless asked to because poor betta #2 will probably suffer the same fate.

 

[OldMan]

My first question is why you want to get to such high ammonia levels. 8 ppm is much higher than a toxic level for his fish. If he has the betta in something as small as a litre, anything much less than daily 50% water changes are not enough. The right answer is of course to get a large enough container that it doesn't become a chemical toxic bath in the first day but if that is not possible, use frequent very large water changes.

 

[Sombunya]

I've seen 3 gallon tanks with tiny HOB filters.

They can be cycled. Then a 1 gallon water change once a week. What could be easier?

 

[bluerose]

Apparently nobody's read the thread properly..

Fish died. IS DEAD. No more bowl, no more fish. PS-- the bowl was probably less than 3 cups of water, culinary measure. Could hardly get my hand in it to scoop out fish.

Temporary caretaker thought it was his fault.

Fish arrived to caretaker in HIDEOUS water conditions as noted.

I was attempting to figure out how long it would have taken for the water to get to 8.0+ppm ammonia so I could attempt to tell the caretaker that it was the other caretaker's lack of care, not his, that killed the fish.

Mods can close the thread...