(Still)Pre-planning a 40G Breeder for GBR. I have 2 questions at the moment.

[HopefulHobbiest]

question number one.
How many BNP would you recommend for a 40G Breeder that will eventually hold 4-6 GBR and around 12 Cardinal Tetra??

question number two(2 in 1)
why do some websites advertise GBR as "Blue German Rams" and other advertise as "German Blue Rams"? is there really a difference or is it more a site preference?

OddBallFish.com for example lists them as "Blue German Ram"...

i want to make sure before i order/buy my fish that i'm getting the real deal GBR.
any help would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Maximus13]

the naming is just preferential, but I would suggest keeping just 4 in a 40 gallon B. That way they'll have enough space to claim territories but with 6 it would be too many. I have 2 in my 40

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

Ok I can do 4 thats fine

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

the naming is just preferential, but I would suggest keeping just 4 in a 40 gallon B. That way they'll have enough space to claim territories but with 6 it would be too many. I have 2 in my 40

on second thought, what if i kept the number at 6 to see if i could get 2 pairs and move the extra 2 GBR to my 55G?

 

[Maximus13]

you could do that, so long as you have room in the 55. why not have the 6 in the 55 though? lol

 

[bud29]

German Blue Rams and Blue German Rams are the same thing.

I think you could go with six GBRs as long as 2 are moved to the 55 later.

Lastly, since BNP's are so incredibly waste-heavy, I would only recommend 2 or 3 in that tank.

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

i would like the GBR to have their own tank pretty much lol

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

German Blue Rams and Blue German Rams are the same thing.

I think you could go with six GBRs as long as 2 are moved to the 55 later.

Lastly, since BNP's are so incredibly waste-heavy, I would only recommend 2 or 3 in that tank.

thank you, thats good to know. especially the BNP portion... i was originally planning for atleast 1BNP but if i could get away with 2 that wouldn't be too bad

 

[bud29]

I would say to just be cautious with the Cardinal Tetras. Especially breeding pairs of GBRs may really be aggressive towards the small tetras.

 

[bud29]

thank you, thats good to know. especially the BNP portion... i was originally planning for atleast 1BNP but if i could get away with 2 that wouldn't be too bad

That's good. 2 would be just right in my opinion.

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

I would say to just be cautious with the Cardinal Tetras. Especially breeding pairs of GBRs may really be aggressive towards the small tetras.

i'll definitely make sure to keep an eye on them, i hope they won't have to learn the hard way. do you think the BNP(if i get 2) will have any issues with the breeding GBR or will they most likely keep to themselves?

 

[bud29]

When breeding the rams may become territorial and make sure the plecos know to stay away. However, plecos are bigger than rams so at least in my case, the ram respects that.

You also may see a bit of a spat between the plecos from time to time, as two males can quarrel over territory. However, it rarely turns out to be anything serious, and they are otherwise very peaceful fish.

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

Im hoping it all works out peacefully. Im not really expecting issues between the BNP & GBR normally plecos keep to themselves... except when it comes to pleco territorial issues... i'll probably keep more of an eye on the tetra

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

The pleco will eventually have size on their side

 

[Rivercats]

As far as keeping 2 pairs of rams in a 40, make sure to plant it heavily, add some smooth flat stones as that is what they like to spawn on, and if you really want to make it homey for them get some indian almond leaves and put them on the bottom of the tank. Rams especially like to spawn on leaf litter. Dried, never green, oak leaves can also be used. The tannins have anti-bacterial and anti-fungal properties which also helps with keeping fungus off eggs. Also be prepared there could be some serious fighting when one or both pairs spawn. A 40 might seem big but when eggs and fry are concerned it can get mighty ugly.

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

i'm not sure where i can find the leaves you mentioned... if you know a place that would be awesome.

but now there were getting into scaping for the tank i might as well see what you think about my planned setup:

1/2" Flourite layer

1/2" SMOOTH gravel layer

atleast 2 pieces of clean slate(if not 3 pieces)

very heavy planting using a few different types of plants. leaving a few open areas for free swim.

Hinged glass hood as apposed to the normal black plastic. also using lighting within the 6700k-10k range

Hagen Fluval 305(i'm also in the process of trying to come up with a way to guard the fish from the intake, only idea that comes to mind off hand is to use a breeder net, cut a hole in the bottom just big enough for the pipe and place what would normally be the open top area as far into the two layers as i can get it so i still get filtration but keeps the fry away from the intake.) Might be over thinking this but its all i've got so far.

you see anything that i might have missed or something i need to change/add?

any and all suggestion not only helpful but needed

 

[Rivercats]

You can find people on ebay that sell Indian almond leaves pretty cheap. As for lighting the rams will prefer the softer 6700K over the 10K. I just changed out my 10K bulbs for 6000K and all the fish including the rams are much more active when the lights are on now. Mind you I have T5HO's that are on 12hrs a day with a 6 hour burst of 6000K MH's. When the fish spawn you can just put a sponge prefilter over your intake. But with a 305 Fluval canister you would also do better raising the intake tube higher in the tank. They are made to hang closer to the bottom but you can cut the tube to shorten it up. The fry until much bigger tend to stay low in the bottom of the tank so raising the intake helps alot. You can also use cheese cloth or a pair or two of cut off womans knee high nylons to rubberband over the intake. These allow for water intake without too much resistance as sponges do. You will have to watch they don't get clogged and that if you don't tie/rubber band them on securely that they get sucked up.

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

Hmmm interesting... seems as though I still have some planning to do on the intake tube... I like your idea of cutting the tube... I'll pick up another one off amazon so I have a short tube and a long tube(to use when spawning isnt occuring.)

Anything else in my setup you have advice on? Sorry to keep bugging you but you're definitely smart when it comes to this stuff

 

[Rivercats]

Mind you I haven't gone back and read this entire thread but were it me I wouldn't keep any pleco's in the breeding tank. They can really bother spawning rams just by hanging around where eggs and fry are at. The parent rams can also harrass the BNP alot easier due to the pleco's lack of size. The rams can't hurt them much but it's undo stress on both the rams and the plecos. If you want to do true breeding them you should just keep the species your breeding in the tank. Another thing is even cardinal tetras will pick off eggs and fry if they are able. Just the sheer number of a group of cardinals is too many for the parents to try to fend off. And once the fry are mobile the parents simply can't corral them together close enough for many not to be eaten by the Cardinals, heck even some by the other GBR pair.

 

[HopefulHobbiest]

sounds like i should just do a GBR only tank... lol