lauritastlouis
Aquarium Advice Apprentice
I have 1 male betta (Jar at Petsmart said halfmoon, but I suspect he's a delta tail).
10 Gallon Tank
Ammonia currently 0
Nitrates: 0
Nitrites: 0
PH ranges between 7.8 and 8.0 (St. Louis water! Oh Joy...)
Filter: Top Fin "Power Filter 10", 80 gph
15w heater. Tank kept between 80 - 82.
Feeding him 1 small flake in the evening when we turn the light on.
FYI: this tank is used as a "night light" for my 4 year old. Lights off during the day, til it gets dark outside, (when the room turns pitch black) and then on until around 7am. (The room is fairly dark during the day though) We intend to continue this until I can find day/night led lights that will work with our hood.
I got the tank and the betta 7 weeks ago from petsmart. Yes, I know I should have done more research first. This is my first tank since the one my parents had when I was a kid.
Followed bad advice from a supposed "specialty fish store". Was told not to change the water til the tank cycled. All was good for about 5 weeks. Ammonia never spiked above 0.5ppm. Finally, it hit 0. Nitrites spiked to 3.0ppm, and then Nitrates slowly raised to about 15ppm and nitrites lowered to 1.0ppm. Was told this was a good thing.
Around week 4 I noticed that the tips of both pectoral fins were turning white symetrically. Was told that if it didn't look fuzzy and if he was eating and swimming normally it was probably new fin growth or he was changing colors.
2 days after the nitrates started going up, I came home from work at about 2 am and realized that my hubby forgot to turn the light on in the tank since my son was spending the night at grandma's. Turned it on, and noticed he had 3 almost perfect triangles missing from his tail (was monitoring his fins due to the white fins so I know it wasn't there earlier that day). Thought it was maybe nipping due to the extended "night", but called Tropical World Pets the next day and they told me to come in and get some Maracyn. Treated for 5 days per instructions. Left in charcol cartrige since it was more than 8 days old, also per instructions. It turned the water cloudy but by the end of the treatment, I saw new growth, and 3 days later only one chunk was not completely healed. Day 8 post treatment I did a 25% water change and added a new filter.
2 days after that when to check on him, and it looked like someone hacked at his tail fin with scissors. Three 1/2" perfect slices and a pinhole in another section. I checked on him at 5pm before going to work and he was fine. No cuts, chunks or whatever. I got home again at 2 am from work, and there it all was.
The day before the Ammonia went back up to 0.5 ppm and the Nitrates and Nitrites were back down to 0. Even though Maracyn wasn't supposed to affect biological filter I chalked it up to that.
I called several different specialty stores and got all kinds of answers. One guy said to leave it in "god's hands" and that I should take out the heater. All they were good for was raising the electric bill as long as my house was kept above 70. (Not an option. my kid loves "Fish-Fish"). Another store told me to come in and buy a ph buffer and ammonia detox and change the water 25% weekly and he would heal all by himself. A third store told me add bacteria supplement and all would be well. So much conflicting info was annoying so I called around until I was referred to a local vet that actually knew something about aquatic vet. sciences. (Local vet that works with the St. Louis Zoo and consults on their aquatics, according to my hubby's cousin, who works for a different vet clinic). He prescribed 250mg flagyl, to be ground up and administered 1 x daily, with a 20% to 25% water change to prevent the flagyl from reaching toxic levels.
2 days later, the fin rot had gotten a lot worse. 1/4" inch lost top to bottom on the tail fin per day. Called the vet after on Black Friday (Got the Meds the day before Thanksgiving) and he said I could cross medicate with Maracyn. I added Maracyn 2 just in case it was gram neg. bacteria for good measure and I also picked up some aquarium salt.
I did a 25% change that day and added 3 tbs salt (roughly 1 tps per gallon, if you figure 1 gallon is displaced with substrate and decorations). He has had a dose of all 3 meds since last Friday.
For the past day or two, I noticed that the deterioration has either slowed or stopped. With so much of his tail fin gone, and his dorsal fin now affected, I could be wrong about it having stopped completely.
His tank is cloudy as can be now. Since I had recently changed the filter cartrige, I took it out before beginning meds this time. I do vacuum the gravel with each water change, but either it's a cruddy syphon, or I'm not doing it right because the darn thing won't even pick up the pieces of rotted fins without me breaking the syphon off and "catching it" in the tubes.
So now you know what's going on. Where do I go from here? Once the meds are done, do I do a major water change? If so, how much? How often? Should I do 100% to clear the meds out and then resalt the tank (I have not added salt since the initial dose, and it has been 3 daily 20 - 25% changes since)?
If these meds don't work, and either he gets worse or relapses then what? Do we euthanise, re-medicate? I plan on going 8 days with both Maracyn and Maracyn 2 because I read that this often needed.
I read on one site that I should be putting him in a bowl and salt 2 tsp per gallon and change 100% water daily with no meds and this will cure it, but the vet said that this is a horrible idea and the constant changes will stress him. If the meds don't work, should we try this as a last ditch effort? Or, should we put him in a smaller bowl for a few days with salt to help heal if he does start to get better and then clean the tank out witih 100% water change to get rid of the meds, and then acclimate back? Some people swear by the salt, others say that it's ineffective at best, unhealthy at worst.
Basically, every forum, store, expert, etc has a completely different opinion, and it seems that what one person swears by, a second will tell you that same method is the fast track to dead fish.
What next and what now? In the long run, we had planned on turning this into a community tank. I know I can only put a few different types with a Betta, but we were thinking a dwarf frog, a few tetras or platys and maybe a cory cat or snail (eventually we were going to upgrade to a 20 gallon before we had all of these in there of course).
Assuming we can get him healthy again, how do we recover the tank after all of this before we can add new fish? I am at a total loss here... Please, any thoughts solutions, advice, etc would be appreciated. And, sorry this is so long.....
10 Gallon Tank
Ammonia currently 0
Nitrates: 0
Nitrites: 0
PH ranges between 7.8 and 8.0 (St. Louis water! Oh Joy...)
Filter: Top Fin "Power Filter 10", 80 gph
15w heater. Tank kept between 80 - 82.
Feeding him 1 small flake in the evening when we turn the light on.
FYI: this tank is used as a "night light" for my 4 year old. Lights off during the day, til it gets dark outside, (when the room turns pitch black) and then on until around 7am. (The room is fairly dark during the day though) We intend to continue this until I can find day/night led lights that will work with our hood.
I got the tank and the betta 7 weeks ago from petsmart. Yes, I know I should have done more research first. This is my first tank since the one my parents had when I was a kid.
Followed bad advice from a supposed "specialty fish store". Was told not to change the water til the tank cycled. All was good for about 5 weeks. Ammonia never spiked above 0.5ppm. Finally, it hit 0. Nitrites spiked to 3.0ppm, and then Nitrates slowly raised to about 15ppm and nitrites lowered to 1.0ppm. Was told this was a good thing.
Around week 4 I noticed that the tips of both pectoral fins were turning white symetrically. Was told that if it didn't look fuzzy and if he was eating and swimming normally it was probably new fin growth or he was changing colors.
2 days after the nitrates started going up, I came home from work at about 2 am and realized that my hubby forgot to turn the light on in the tank since my son was spending the night at grandma's. Turned it on, and noticed he had 3 almost perfect triangles missing from his tail (was monitoring his fins due to the white fins so I know it wasn't there earlier that day). Thought it was maybe nipping due to the extended "night", but called Tropical World Pets the next day and they told me to come in and get some Maracyn. Treated for 5 days per instructions. Left in charcol cartrige since it was more than 8 days old, also per instructions. It turned the water cloudy but by the end of the treatment, I saw new growth, and 3 days later only one chunk was not completely healed. Day 8 post treatment I did a 25% water change and added a new filter.
2 days after that when to check on him, and it looked like someone hacked at his tail fin with scissors. Three 1/2" perfect slices and a pinhole in another section. I checked on him at 5pm before going to work and he was fine. No cuts, chunks or whatever. I got home again at 2 am from work, and there it all was.
The day before the Ammonia went back up to 0.5 ppm and the Nitrates and Nitrites were back down to 0. Even though Maracyn wasn't supposed to affect biological filter I chalked it up to that.
I called several different specialty stores and got all kinds of answers. One guy said to leave it in "god's hands" and that I should take out the heater. All they were good for was raising the electric bill as long as my house was kept above 70. (Not an option. my kid loves "Fish-Fish"). Another store told me to come in and buy a ph buffer and ammonia detox and change the water 25% weekly and he would heal all by himself. A third store told me add bacteria supplement and all would be well. So much conflicting info was annoying so I called around until I was referred to a local vet that actually knew something about aquatic vet. sciences. (Local vet that works with the St. Louis Zoo and consults on their aquatics, according to my hubby's cousin, who works for a different vet clinic). He prescribed 250mg flagyl, to be ground up and administered 1 x daily, with a 20% to 25% water change to prevent the flagyl from reaching toxic levels.
2 days later, the fin rot had gotten a lot worse. 1/4" inch lost top to bottom on the tail fin per day. Called the vet after on Black Friday (Got the Meds the day before Thanksgiving) and he said I could cross medicate with Maracyn. I added Maracyn 2 just in case it was gram neg. bacteria for good measure and I also picked up some aquarium salt.
I did a 25% change that day and added 3 tbs salt (roughly 1 tps per gallon, if you figure 1 gallon is displaced with substrate and decorations). He has had a dose of all 3 meds since last Friday.
For the past day or two, I noticed that the deterioration has either slowed or stopped. With so much of his tail fin gone, and his dorsal fin now affected, I could be wrong about it having stopped completely.
His tank is cloudy as can be now. Since I had recently changed the filter cartrige, I took it out before beginning meds this time. I do vacuum the gravel with each water change, but either it's a cruddy syphon, or I'm not doing it right because the darn thing won't even pick up the pieces of rotted fins without me breaking the syphon off and "catching it" in the tubes.
So now you know what's going on. Where do I go from here? Once the meds are done, do I do a major water change? If so, how much? How often? Should I do 100% to clear the meds out and then resalt the tank (I have not added salt since the initial dose, and it has been 3 daily 20 - 25% changes since)?
If these meds don't work, and either he gets worse or relapses then what? Do we euthanise, re-medicate? I plan on going 8 days with both Maracyn and Maracyn 2 because I read that this often needed.
I read on one site that I should be putting him in a bowl and salt 2 tsp per gallon and change 100% water daily with no meds and this will cure it, but the vet said that this is a horrible idea and the constant changes will stress him. If the meds don't work, should we try this as a last ditch effort? Or, should we put him in a smaller bowl for a few days with salt to help heal if he does start to get better and then clean the tank out witih 100% water change to get rid of the meds, and then acclimate back? Some people swear by the salt, others say that it's ineffective at best, unhealthy at worst.
Basically, every forum, store, expert, etc has a completely different opinion, and it seems that what one person swears by, a second will tell you that same method is the fast track to dead fish.
What next and what now? In the long run, we had planned on turning this into a community tank. I know I can only put a few different types with a Betta, but we were thinking a dwarf frog, a few tetras or platys and maybe a cory cat or snail (eventually we were going to upgrade to a 20 gallon before we had all of these in there of course).
Assuming we can get him healthy again, how do we recover the tank after all of this before we can add new fish? I am at a total loss here... Please, any thoughts solutions, advice, etc would be appreciated. And, sorry this is so long.....
just keep up on daily water changes and monitoring. He will turn around!
