hi i am planning on setting up a 40 gallon long planted tank, connected by and Ehiem canister filter, and a siphon return to a 20 gallon high tank. Te plants i want to keep are amazon swords, java fern, vallisneria, hornwort, and maybe water sprite. The fish i want to breed are cockatoo chiclids, and will do good with a ph of 6.5 How much peat moss should i use with 60 gallons total? do i have to use peat processed for aquariums, or can i just get some from a gardening store? i have heard that hornwort and vallisneria will be able to get CO2 from calcium carbonate. will adding some calcium carbonate (probably in the form of 1tbsp. crushed coral) raise the PH? also, what is GH? how can i maintain it. will too much peat lower the PH too much? i am already familiar with the basics of PH and KH, but besides these and GH is there any other water conditions i should worry about? (i am also familiar w/ the nitrogen cycle). i know i am asking alot now, but answering just one of these questions would be a great help.
Peat and PH
- Thread starter echo7
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an interest in aquariums or fish keeping!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
the coral can raise the ph.
not sure on the peat from the lfs vs. garden center peat. i have seen accounts of garden peat but i couldnt verify anything.
gh - general hardness - a measure of the amount of calciuma nd magnesium salts in the water. water high in calcium is hard. people in these areas get white to yellow crusts of calcium buildup on things like shower heads and whatnot. water with low amounts of these salts are soft. it's highly linked to alkalinity or KH, this is temporary hardness. to put it easily it's the measure of baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) in the water. both are linked to ph. say you add the coral it will make the water harder, and will raise the ph. and buffer alot.
its been explained to me that harder water is buffered and therefore safer than softer water. but i could swear that both ends of the scale have buffers. that you'll have to check on. i'm foggy on it.
well it's been said that softer acidic water is more beneficial to plants. i cant promise or verify that i can tell you that co2 content is important, and adding it will lower your ph without softening the water. theres some great charts on this. co2 and kh and ph are all intertwined and co2 is absolutely needed for photosynthesis.
iron is very important to plant growth. and temperature. the rate of photosynthesis greatly increases with temperature increases, but you'll want to take into acount your livestock in that as well and theres a limit to that... thats all i can think of. your plants with good lighting and care will eat those nitrates up.
HTH
not sure on the peat from the lfs vs. garden center peat. i have seen accounts of garden peat but i couldnt verify anything.
gh - general hardness - a measure of the amount of calciuma nd magnesium salts in the water. water high in calcium is hard. people in these areas get white to yellow crusts of calcium buildup on things like shower heads and whatnot. water with low amounts of these salts are soft. it's highly linked to alkalinity or KH, this is temporary hardness. to put it easily it's the measure of baking soda (sodium bicarbonate) in the water. both are linked to ph. say you add the coral it will make the water harder, and will raise the ph. and buffer alot.
its been explained to me that harder water is buffered and therefore safer than softer water. but i could swear that both ends of the scale have buffers. that you'll have to check on. i'm foggy on it.
well it's been said that softer acidic water is more beneficial to plants. i cant promise or verify that i can tell you that co2 content is important, and adding it will lower your ph without softening the water. theres some great charts on this. co2 and kh and ph are all intertwined and co2 is absolutely needed for photosynthesis.
iron is very important to plant growth. and temperature. the rate of photosynthesis greatly increases with temperature increases, but you'll want to take into acount your livestock in that as well and theres a limit to that... thats all i can think of. your plants with good lighting and care will eat those nitrates up.
HTH
G
Guest
Guest
CO2 is your best bet. On a 40g tank plus a 20g sump, pres. CO2 should be used. 60 g of water for DIY CO2 will cause more trouble than its worth with PH swings, algaes etc....
Whats your water para's out of the tap after standing for 24hrs?
Peat can be used in the filter to help soften water. It also helps polish the water. Keep in mind, the peat must be changed ever so often. I used the peat you get at most home improvement stores. You'll want to rinse the peat to get all the fines and dust out. Otherwise they will be trapped in your filter.
Adding peat to a filter does"nt magically drop GH from 8 to 3 ( well, maybe if you stuff a huge canister full of it, never went that far). It takes several days to notice small results. The best thing is trial and error.
Driftwood also helps soften water. Maybe a combo of driftwood in the tank and peat in the filter?
Can't say as I know what water cockatoos like to breed in. Perhaps if you posted thier needs as well as, your taps para's we could help more
Whats your water para's out of the tap after standing for 24hrs?
Peat can be used in the filter to help soften water. It also helps polish the water. Keep in mind, the peat must be changed ever so often. I used the peat you get at most home improvement stores. You'll want to rinse the peat to get all the fines and dust out. Otherwise they will be trapped in your filter.
Adding peat to a filter does"nt magically drop GH from 8 to 3 ( well, maybe if you stuff a huge canister full of it, never went that far). It takes several days to notice small results. The best thing is trial and error.
Driftwood also helps soften water. Maybe a combo of driftwood in the tank and peat in the filter?
Can't say as I know what water cockatoos like to breed in. Perhaps if you posted thier needs as well as, your taps para's we could help more
TeutonJon78
Aquarium Advice Regular
check out these pages regarding peat.
http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/docs/filtration/softening.shtml
http://hjem.get2net.dk/Best_of_the_Web/peat page.html
I'm looking to use some peat to make my water softer/lower ph. I got it from the garden store, boiled it for 20ish minutes to get the gunk off and make it a little slower acting. I need to experiment with it in different contexts to see how it affects the ph in a little larger conext.
But you should be able to use this unprocessed peat as long as it has no fertilizers in it. That's the important part.
http://www.skepticalaquarist.com/docs/filtration/softening.shtml
http://hjem.get2net.dk/Best_of_the_Web/peat page.html
I'm looking to use some peat to make my water softer/lower ph. I got it from the garden store, boiled it for 20ish minutes to get the gunk off and make it a little slower acting. I need to experiment with it in different contexts to see how it affects the ph in a little larger conext.
But you should be able to use this unprocessed peat as long as it has no fertilizers in it. That's the important part.
malkore
Aquarium Advice Addict
using a mix of tap and R/O water will also give you softer water, and lower pH.
well, i can't get to you with the exact water parameters now, the fish tanks are set up in school. This also rules out compressed CO2 (probably not the best idea in a school) My town does have well water though, and i live close to the highschool. my PH is 7.5, KH is 4.5, i don't currently have a GH test kit, but i believe it is quiet hard maybe 12 or so, as i used to get calcium crustation on my freshwater tanks, if i really neglected to do water changes and just topped off for a while. i was hoping to get my water conditions to PH-6.5, KH-2-4, and GH 1-4. what is your opinion on hydrocloric acid? i am experinced with water altering substances, and understand how cautious you must be, lessons i learned in saltwater reefing.
What about mixing rainwater PH about 4.1 and tap water, using acticated carbon (on my rainbarrel) to filter out any pollutants? I was hoping to provide most of my CO2 by trying not to disturb the water surface, using peat, fish (my 40 gallon will have discus and large schools of tetras or rasboras) and my driftwood. also i think you misunderstood what i said about attatching my tanks.
as always thanks for the help.
What about mixing rainwater PH about 4.1 and tap water, using acticated carbon (on my rainbarrel) to filter out any pollutants? I was hoping to provide most of my CO2 by trying not to disturb the water surface, using peat, fish (my 40 gallon will have discus and large schools of tetras or rasboras) and my driftwood. also i think you misunderstood what i said about attatching my tanks.
the two tanks are set up side by side, and an ehiem canister filter will take from one tank and return to another. a U shaped piece of tubing will be run connecting the two tanks, and will have a siphon.
as always thanks for the help.
G
Guest
Guest
AHH OK,
I misunderstood. I was thinking it was a 40g with a 20g sump filter.
Interestingly enough, I just so happen to have a 40g planted Discus tank that is very similar to what your considering.
IMO, using a single filter on multiple tanks is a bad idea. Especially on a Discus tank. If one tank is infected with something. It will be transmitted to the other tank. If it were me, I'd use the Ehiem for the 40g and get a seperate filter for the 20g and run them independantly.
Seeing how these tanks are in a school, I'd say try and keep it as simple as possible, with maint to a minimum. I see your point as to were pres CO2 might not be a good idea for a school.
Maybe you could do a planted tank using easy to maint. low light plants such as Anubius, Java, certain Cryptocornes etc.... that don't even require CO2 injection. These would also save a little money on ferts seeing how these plants don't consume nutrients as quickly or require as much lighting.
Seachems also has a supplament out that might work. For the life of me I can't recall the name or tell you if its worth using. Maybe someone will chime in on that one.
BrianNY is or resident Discus guru. Maybe he will chime in here soon. Best I can recall, hes got a 55g planted tank running without CO2. Maybe you can get some ideas from his set up.
Discus require a little more attention and maint than most FW fish. Seeing how this tank is in a school, do you have access and the time to maint this tank and care for it? Remember, a stable PH is far more important than the perfect PH. There are people that keep Discus in a PH of 8-9. You probobly would'nt have success in breeding at this PH, but the fish are certainly healthy. HTH
I misunderstood. I was thinking it was a 40g with a 20g sump filter.
Interestingly enough, I just so happen to have a 40g planted Discus tank that is very similar to what your considering.
IMO, using a single filter on multiple tanks is a bad idea. Especially on a Discus tank. If one tank is infected with something. It will be transmitted to the other tank. If it were me, I'd use the Ehiem for the 40g and get a seperate filter for the 20g and run them independantly.
Seeing how these tanks are in a school, I'd say try and keep it as simple as possible, with maint to a minimum. I see your point as to were pres CO2 might not be a good idea for a school.
Maybe you could do a planted tank using easy to maint. low light plants such as Anubius, Java, certain Cryptocornes etc.... that don't even require CO2 injection. These would also save a little money on ferts seeing how these plants don't consume nutrients as quickly or require as much lighting.
Seachems also has a supplament out that might work. For the life of me I can't recall the name or tell you if its worth using. Maybe someone will chime in on that one.
BrianNY is or resident Discus guru. Maybe he will chime in here soon. Best I can recall, hes got a 55g planted tank running without CO2. Maybe you can get some ideas from his set up.
Discus require a little more attention and maint than most FW fish. Seeing how this tank is in a school, do you have access and the time to maint this tank and care for it? Remember, a stable PH is far more important than the perfect PH. There are people that keep Discus in a PH of 8-9. You probobly would'nt have success in breeding at this PH, but the fish are certainly healthy. HTH
Thanks for pointing this thread out to me Troll. Echo7, IMO it's very easy to over complicate the importance of pH as it relates to a specific number. Keeping it as simple as possible, if your KH is 4.5 your water has enough buffering capacity to maintain a stable pH WITHOUT any additives (including cc or peat).The pH of your water is fine for discus. My discus are spawning in a pH of 7.6. Just keep in mind that the MOST important factors for keeping healthy discus are clean water, clean tank, and clean filters.
