Ammonia drops slowly, but no rise in nitrite

[frogtoad]

I'm on day 12 of a fishless cycle. It is a 10 gallon tank with filter running, air bubbler on, heater on keeping the water at 78 degrees. I've got gravel and decorations in as well. I also have a marimo moss ball in the tank. I initially dosed to 4 ppm for ammonia. When the ammonia levels drop to about 1 ppm, I dose back up to 4 ppm. In total, I've added ammonia 3 times including the initial dosing. The problem is, I have never had a rise in nitrite. Shouldn't I see a simultaneous rise in nitrite as my ammonia levels drop? Could my drop in ammonia be solely due to the marimo's affect, thus not producing nitrite?

 

[Fresh2o]

I am not sure that the marimo ball can consume that much ammonia.
What's the nitrate at? If you are reading nitrate greater than 10 or 20 or more, then what might be happening is that nitrites are being produced but being converted before you test them. Do you test 1x day? If possible, test nitrite a few times a day. You should be able to catch the nitrite spike that way.
Same thing happened to me when I was doing a fishless cycle with seeded media. Never saw the nitrite spike; had to test a few times throughout the day to detect it.

 

[frogtoad]

Hi Fresh2o,

I don't test nitrates regularly but just ran down to test it now. It's at 0 ppm. Here are my values that I've logged. The nitrate levels are not actual test numbers. I only tested at baseline and just right now. I've never changed the water.
Lately, I've been testing twice a day (morning and evening) just in case, but I don't record the second test because there's not much change between the two.


Date Temp Ph Ammonia Nitrite Nitrate
29-Jul 78 8.1 0 0 0 (Baseline)
30-Jul 78 8.2 4 0 0
31-Jul 78 8.3 4 0 0
1-Aug 78 8.3 4 0 0
2-Aug 78 8.3 2 0 0
3-Aug 78 8.3 1 0 0
4-Aug 78 8.3 4 0 0
5-Aug 78 8.3 2 0 0
6-Aug 78 8.3 1 0 0
7-Aug 78 8.3 4 0 0
8-Aug 78 8.3 4 0 0
9-Aug 78 8.3 3 0 0
10-Aug 78 8.3 2 0 0
11-Aug 78 8.3 2 0 0

 

[Fresh2o]

The ammonia is progressing as if it were in a cycled tank, however, the lack of nitrites/nitrates suggest otherwise.
What are you using for an ammonia source?
What kind of filter(s)?
Brand new media? Established media?
Besides the marimo ball, any other plants?
New substrate?
While testing for nitrate, are you vigorously shaking the bottles?

 

[PNWaquarist]

That doesn't seem too far from the norm, as it takes a while to establish a bacterial colony from scratch. See the chart below...

Beginner FAQ: The Nitrogen Cycle

I'd give it another week before worrying that something's wrong. In the meantime, I'd crank the temperature up by 5 degrees or so. That'll help speed up the process.

 

[frogtoad]

Thanks Fresh2o for all of your help so far.

The ammonia is progressing as if it were in a cycled tank, however, the lack of nitrites/nitrates suggest otherwise.
What are you using for an ammonia source?
Ace hardware janitorial 10% ammonia

What kind of filter(s)?
Tetra internal filter (10i?) as part of the aqua culture 10 gallon LED kit

Brand new media? Established media?
brand new media, no seeding material

Besides the marimo ball, any other plants?
Marimo is the only live plant

New substrate?
Everything is brand new, new gravel, new deco.

While testing for nitrate, are you vigorously shaking the bottles?
I shook it well and timed it as per the instructions. After reading a few more posts, I'll go down and test it again really shaking hard. I hadn't tested it much since I figured it might be too early for nitrates to show especially considering that my tank and everything in it was so new.

I don't know if this matters but my tank is in the basement that is mostly finished. It has drywall, ceiling, and flooring that was installed over a year ago. Since it's not 100% complete, it gets very little traffic, stays pretty cool and dry. The water heater keeps the tank water at a consistent 78 degrees though. I guess what I'm getting at is, I wonder if the air down there could hold less bacteria.

I know that the cycling process takes patients and I'm willing to wait. But at this point, I'm just wondering if it's doing anything weird. From my understanding, as ammonia is converted to nitrites, based on chemistry as ammonia drops, the nitrites should increase at almost the same time. As you pointed out, I could be missing it IF the nitrites is immediately converted to nitrates but I don't think that's the case here since everything is so new. I'm afraid that I'm not growing any bb It's just weird that my ammonia is slowly disappearing but no byproducts to show for it.

 

[frogtoad]

That doesn't seem too far from the norm, as it takes a while to establish a bacterial colony from scratch. See the chart below...

Beginner FAQ: The Nitrogen Cycle

I'd give it another week before worrying that something's wrong. In the meantime, I'd crank the temperature up by 5 degrees or so. That'll help speed up the process.

Hi PNWaquarist,

So you don't think that it's weird that I see a slow drop in ammonia while not seeing ANY rise in nitrite? I'm wondering where the nitrogen is going since it can't just disappear. Could it just be too low of a level to show on the test? I'm using API master test kit.

If I can get out today, I might try to go pick up another heater as the one I have has a preset temperature. And I'll continue to try to be patient.

Thanks for the help so far.

 

[Fresh2o]

Fishless cycle starting from scratch can take weeks. If it is possible, perhaps you can obtain some seeded media from another fish keeper or pet store. There are AA members as well as online sites that sell seeded media. If you pursue that route, look up AA member MrFisher.

 

[frogtoad]

Thanks Fresh2o,

I was / am expecting my cycling to take some time as I figure I have no real seeding material. I think I've read about Mr. Fisher and had heard good things. At the moment, I'm willing to just be patient. I just wanted to see if what I had going on was uncommon to see the change in ammonia while not seeing a change in nitrites.

"Just keep swimming, Just keep swimming, Just keep swimming"

 

[PNWaquarist]

Hi PNWaquarist,

So you don't think that it's weird that I see a slow drop in ammonia while not seeing ANY rise in nitrite? I'm wondering where the nitrogen is going since it can't just disappear. Could it just be too low of a level to show on the test? I'm using API master test kit.

If I can get out today, I might try to go pick up another heater as the one I have has a preset temperature. And I'll continue to try to be patient.

Thanks for the help so far.

No problem. Ammonia is a gas at room temperature, so at least some of it will volitalize away. The vast majority of the ammonia in your tank is in the ammonium form, which is not volatile, so the loss of ammonia will be slow.

I don't think that explanation accounts for the appreciable initial losses of ammonia during a cycle. There is likely more going on. However, it is normal to see ammonia loss well before nitrite begins to appear.

 

[frogtoad]

Ok. Thanks PNWaquarist. I will wait patiently for a while longer.

 

[frogtoad]

After about 24 days of waiting, I've finally got nitrites on the rise! YAY !