Please please help!

[Mlanstey]

I am super new to fish of any kind. I have been reading for a week straight about my problem and have learned a great deal but am still unsure what to do, here's my problem.
My teenage daughter brought home a goldfish (not fancy) in a bag last week. I'm soooo against this! Now I have a responsibility to this living creature to care for it. I went out immediately and put in a small plastic bowl with the water from the bag, a decorative hiding place and rocks from the local pet store. Then I started reading and reading and realized how complicated this was going to be to keep him not just alive but healthy. I bought a 20 gallon set up, filter, fake plants, and started the cycling process. A week into the process I decided to check the water in the bowl the fish is living in for ammonia since I've been keeping track in the cycling tank. The ammonia is 4ppm! I had been doing daily water changes 20% to the small bowl, but levels are still way higher than they have been in my tank (around .5-1 ppm). I'm rambling! My question is is he better off in the bowl at 4ppm or cycling in the tank? Please help me, I've become attached to the little guy!
Thanks
Melissa

 

[BTM88]

The best thing to do in this situation would be to put the goldfish in the 20 gallon tank and do a fish in cycle. More water is in the larger tank so the ammonia will not be concentrated as fast, needless to say a daily partial water change may be needed or at least test the water for ammonia and nitrite levels. As long as you are watchful of the toxin levels in the 20 gallon the goldfish will be fine.
This link could be helpful also for you. http://www.aquariumadvice.com/forums/f12/fish-in-cycling-step-over-into-the-dark-side-176446.html

 

[Mlanstey]

Thank you so much for your quick reply! It was very very helpful and I will be transferring little Darryl as soon as I take out the heater I had been using for cycling and bring the temp down.
Thanks again
Melissa

 

[Sillyfishies]

Being completely honest, your better off rehoming him if he is one of the bigger species of goldfish.

If you like goldfish get a fancy for the 20 gallon and call it good. Or you can make the tank a tropical tank.

 

[flitabout]

Thank you so much for your quick reply! It was very very helpful and I will be transferring little Darryl as soon as I take out the heater I had been using for cycling and bring the temp down.
Thanks again
Melissa

Just remember goldfish are very dirty. Anytime your ammo or nitrites get over .25ppm do a water change. Also I would use prime as a water conditioner. It can temporally convert ammonia and nitrite to a less toxic form that is still available to your bb. Don't be surprised if you need to do water changes in the first couple of months until the bb is established. Test your water daily, and water change when necessary and you will be fine

 

[Sillyfishies]

Just remember goldfish are very dirty. Anytime your ammo or nitrites get over .25ppm do a water change. Also I would use prime as a water conditioner. It can temporally convert ammonia and nitrite to a less toxic form that is still available to your bb. Don't be surprised if you need to do water changes in the first couple of months until the bb is established. Test your water daily, and water change when necessary and you will be fine

Prime permanently removes ammonia. However it just detoxifies nitrite/nitrate.

 

[brennae]

Goldfish don't always need a heater. Usually room temps are ok for them.

Good Luck and good for you for helping this little goldie!

 

[Krissycakes]

Since you bought the tank already, I think you should rehome him and get community fish once your tank is cycled. But if your goldfish is of a smaller species, and your fine with just him then keep him and do a fish-in like said above =) not sure what to say, sorry your daughter gave you more responsibility, or congrats on the new friend. Lol however you look at it, whats done is done. Blah I need sleep. Good night, hope all goes well with the cycle!

 

[Mebbid]

I agree with the rehoming of the goldy. Common ones get absurdly large and live a long long time.

However aside from the stocking I would like to point out that a 20% change just isn't sufficient. When doing water changes to remove ammonia, nitrite, or nitrate a 50% change is much better.

For example, in a 4ppm ammonia solution a 20% change won't even drop the ammonia level down below 3ppm. However, a 50% water change will drop the ammonia from 4ppm to 2ppm. It would take 3 20% water changes to equal one 50% water change.

 

[jlk]

Prime permanently removes ammonia. However it just detoxifies nitrite/nitrate.

Prime temporarily detoxes ammonia by converting free ammonia (NH3) to ammonium (NH4) up to 1ppm at a standard dose. There is isn't a single water conditioner or amm-lock type water additive on the market that can permanently remove ammonia.

I definitely agree to do atleast 50% water changes- more would be better if toxins are high. Do not be afraid to do back to back water changes either to bring levels under control. Just make sure you are temperature matching and properly conditioning the new water. Please ask if you have any questions!

 

[Sillyfishies]

Prime temporarily detoxes ammonia by converting free ammonia (NH3) to ammonium (NH4) up to 1ppm at a standard dose. There is isn't a single water conditioner or amm-lock type water additive on the market that can permanently remove ammonia.

I definitely agree to do atleast 50% water changes- more would be better if toxins are high. Do not be afraid to do back to back water changes either to bring levels under control. Just make sure you are temperature matching and properly conditioning the new water. Please ask if you have any questions!

That isn't temporary is it? From my understanding, it binds ammonia into ammonium, permanently.

 

[Tank Girl]

Prime does NOT permanently remove ammonia. It detoxifies it temporarily. From the Seachem support forum:

"Prime will bind ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate for 24-48 hours. At which point, if they are still present, will be released."

 

[Sillyfishies]

"Prime works by removing chlorine from the water and then binds with ammonia until it can be consumed by your biological filtration (chloramine minus chlorine = ammonia). The bond is not reversible and ammonia is still available for your bacteria to consume."

If it just "detoxified" ammonia for a fixed amount of time, you'd be adding an excessive amount of ammonia everytime you did a waterchange.

 

[Tank Girl]

What? I don't understand how you'd be adding excessive ammonia with a water change.

 

[Fresh2o]

What? I don't understand how you'd be adding excessive ammonia with a water change.

Some water treatment facilities combine ammonia with chlorine to make it more stabile. If a dechlorinator breaks the chlorine-ammonia bond and neutralizes the chlorine, then you are left with ammonia in the water. Prime detoxifies the ammonia making it safe for aquatic life.

 

[Tank Girl]

I know about chlorine and chloramine and that Prime detoxifies ammonia, but my point is that it doesn't detoxify it permanently. Seachem states this in their own support forum.

 

[Sillyfishies]

I know about chlorine and chloramine and that Prime detoxifies ammonia, but my point is that it doesn't detoxify it permanently. Seachem states this in their own support forum.

It converts it to ammonium. Which is irreversible. How prime gets rid of chloramine (ammonia and chlorine combined) is by turning chlorine into Cl- and turning ammonia into ammonium. If it didnt turn ammonia into ammonium, you'd be left with ammonia.

That is why my water tests with .50 ppm of ammonia. Which in reality it is .50 ppm of ammonium.

 

[Tank Girl]

From a recent post on Seachem support:

Thanks for your question. Actually, Prime removes the chlorine and chloramine, so you don't have to worry about it after dosing with the proper amount. It can be confusing because Prime is also used to treat ammonia and nitrite by binding them into a less toxic form and this effect is only temporary. Ideally, the bacteria in the biological filter will utilize any ammonia or nitrite before they are released after about 48 hours. Chlorine and chloramine are removed and won't return after treating with Prime.

 

[Nelo]

This post isn't of any help but I wanted to say that is great you decided to do research and buy a better set up. When I went to the petstore to grab a few things today I saw some college girls trying to buy two gold fish to put into a tiny fish bowl. One of the staff had said it was ok and another had to intervene (thankfully someone who works there has some knowledge) and advised them not to buy the fish.