Water PH

[sieski]

So about 10 days ago my crab died. I took a water sample to the LFS and my water tested 5 for PH. Weird as I had a Ph of 7.9 and was told by another LFS that could be the cause of the death of my honey gouarmi and he refunded me my money rather than replace.

I didn't mention this at the time. I did say I hadn't changed the water half as regularly as I had used to due to increased workload. The woman advised me to do 5-10% changes daily over a week to bring it up slowly. Went back a week later and it has come up to 6.

I then mentioned the other LFS and my high PH readings. She said they have notice a lot of low ph readings of late and have found people with very soft water and asked me to bring some tap water as she did expect the ph to be higher than that. So I did. It tested positive for soft water. She then proceeded to tell me about lack of buffers etc which i had half an understanding of half a er sure I get that..... and a lot more of 2 bored kids with me lol.

She pointed me to some ph buffer salt Interpet Aqualibrium Aquarium Salt, from Aqua Biotope for Aquarium Products, Marine Products, Pond Products, Water Features

I'm going to give this a shot but don't want to use it long term, as it even says on the box long term (how long is long term? lol) could damage plants (which I have..... lots of too)

I remember reading somewhere about getting and keeping Ph up by adding rocks and other stuff to add buffering capacity naturally but can't really remeber where and what

so any ideas on the rock or the aqualibrium stuff?

 

[jsoong]

If your tap water is 7.9 and your tank is down to 5, you are experiencing a pH crash, which might be lethal.

First thing to check is if your tap water is stable on its own. Let some sit out in a bowl for a day or 2 & recheck the pH to make sure it is not volatile. Idealy, you should check the KH fro its buffering capacity as well. However, you can infer the KH from the pH of water that is equilibrated with room air. <You have to make some assumptions to do that, so might introduce errors ... direct checking is best.>

If your tap water has stable pH & adequate KH, then the best way to maintain your pH is to do water changes. Buffering capacity (KH) is used up with the break down of fish waste (and also absorbed by some plants), so over time, the pH will drop. You maintain the pH by replenishing the KH by doing pwc's. Depending on the KH of the tap, it might take quite a while for you to bring the pH back up with pwc's. But the first lfs has the better advice IMO. It is actually better to bring the pH back slowly over weeks. At 10% pwc, You actually need 40 changes to completely turn over your tank water, so it is not surprising that your pH had only came up to 6 after a week. <you don't want the pH to move much faster than that anyway.>

If the tap water has inadequate KH, then you might consider buffering. You may use anything containing Calcium Carbonate (ie limestone, crushed coral, crushed shells, etc.) However, I would think that you should carry on with more pwc's first (and check the tap's KH/ long term pH) before going down that route.

 

[sieski]

If your tap water is 7.9 and your tank is down to 5, you are experiencing a pH crash, which might be lethal.

First thing to check is if your tap water is stable on its own. Let some sit out in a bowl for a day or 2 & recheck the pH to make sure it is not volatile. Idealy, you should check the KH fro its buffering capacity as well. However, you can infer the KH from the pH of water that is equilibrated with room air. <You have to make some assumptions to do that, so might introduce errors ... direct checking is best.>

If your tap water has stable pH & adequate KH, then the best way to maintain your pH is to do water changes. Buffering capacity (KH) is used up with the break down of fish waste (and also absorbed by some plants), so over time, the pH will drop. You maintain the pH by replenishing the KH by doing pwc's. Depending on the KH of the tap, it might take quite a while for you to bring the pH back up with pwc's. But the first lfs has the better advice IMO. It is actually better to bring the pH back slowly over weeks. At 10% pwc, You actually need 40 changes to completely turn over your tank water, so it is not surprising that your pH had only came up to 6 after a week. <you don't want the pH to move much faster than that anyway.>

If the tap water has inadequate KH, then you might consider buffering. You may use anything containing Calcium Carbonate (ie limestone, crushed coral, crushed shells, etc.) However, I would think that you should carry on with more pwc's first (and check the tap's KH/ long term pH) before going down that route.

Sorry my tap water has been tested (left to stand first) An it's ph was 6.5 though it has been tested before at 7.5. The KH was tested and found to be low can't remember the exact reading as it's on a sheet in the GF'S car. The LFS did say my tap water has no buffering capacity. I've carried on the 5-10% changes and it read 7 the day before yesterday and 6 yesterday.

I've done 13 5% and 7 10% changes now in 3 weeks. I have the aqualibrium stuff here but I'm not sure if I want to go down this road or do I?

 

[Blueiz]

You don't want to add chemicals to your tank to buffer the water. A quote from jsoongs post..

You may use anything containing Calcium Carbonate (ie limestone, crushed coral, crushed shells, etc.)

Go the natural route. It will be longer lasting, cheaper, and healthier for the fish. Usint chemicals will cause unsafe ph swings.

Out of curisoity, what kind of test did the pet store use to test the PH? Most test kits for aquariums only go down to 6. Also, I do you have any driftwood in your tank?

 

[jsoong]

OK, your water appears to be acidic with low buffers (KH) according to all the tests. Your water co. must have doctored the water by adding Ca(OH)2 or similar to raise the pH for delivery (to prevent pipe corrosion), but the effect of that is transient, so your pH drops.

With low KH water, water changes won't bring the pH to stable. If you do constant changes, you might be able to maintain the 6.5, but that is going to be a lot of work & hit or miss.

I am not familiar with interpet products. It is possible to add commercial buffers to raise the KH. But a lot of the pH altering chemicals are not effective & you end up with yo-yo-ing pH. The good buffer products are composed of CaCO3 (&/or NaHCO3) and have to be dose appropriately to increase KH. But I would think that it is simpler to use crushed coral/limestone instead.

Instead of doing a specific amount of buffer per water change to get at a specific pH/KH, the cc route relies on the equilibrium KH/pH of carbonates. You add a large amount of cc (like a cup or more in a med sized tank), and let it dissolved in until it reaches equilibrium. This will give you a pH of ~7.8, close enough to your tap. The beauty of this is that as the KH is used up, more will dissolve in, keeping pH rock steady. <It will also precipitate out if the pH increases ... say your water co overdose on the CaO ... to prevent wild increases of the pH.>

The only thing to watch for in this system is that you can't do big pwc's with untreated water (since it take a day or 2 for the cc to dissolve in). For emergency big pwc's, you need to doctor the water with baking soda. You also need to replenish the cc as it is used up, generally once or twice a year.

A basic primer on doctoring your water:
Beginner FAQ: Water Chemistry