90 gal tank ammonia problems

[limojica]

OK understand. Added Prime last night after coming from PetSmart. No ammonia! Checked again this morning...no ammonia. Here is my question/concern, is the Prime masking the issue or is the bottom line to get rid of ammonia threat? In other words, I am sure if I didn't use something that dissolves ammonia I would still have it. Are the fish okay? Should I still do pwc everyday or just when the ammonia returns? Sorry for the questions but I am confused since its been so long. I grew my fish from babies but understand the tank became overstocked by keeping some of the babies.

I started a hospital tank for the fish with visible issues. I have three in there now and had to use a 20 gal up from a 10 gal since they are fairly large cichlids. I've healed two fish so far and hoping to heal this next batch as well.

My gut tells me I should unload a few more fish to the petshop to ease the load in the tank. Things have changed so should I. I no longer have a healthy tank. Its never easy

I tried to save my fish by putting them in another tank but that tank now is stressed. I am consiidering buying an upgrade tank. I have a 55 gal. Not sure if I should go to 75 gal or another 90 %!)? I would then have two 90 gal with the same occupants. Yes I have two 10 inch tilapias. A friend is telling me to get rid of one but I feel they are safer with me than at the petshop in a 15 gal for six months. One I grew from a baby and the other was a reject from killing his tank mates in a 55 gal. Currently he resides in the 90 gal with the africans and seems to be okay. I don't know what to do.

Thanks for any and all advice.

Last water change last night. Added Prime no ammonia as of this morning.

 

[limojica]

OK understand. Added Prime last night after coming from PetSmart. No ammonia! Checked again this morning...no ammonia. Here is my question/concern, is the Prime masking the issue or is the bottom line to get rid of ammonia threat? In other words, I am sure if I didn't use something that dissolves ammonia I would still have it. Are the fish okay? Should I still do pwc everyday or just when the ammonia returns? Sorry for the questions but I am confused since its been so long. I grew my fish from babies but understand the tank became overstocked by keeping some of the babies.

I started a hospital tank for the fish with visible issues. I have three in there now and had to use a 20 gal up from a 10 gal since they are fairly large cichlids. I've healed two fish so far and hoping to heal this next batch as well.

My gut tells me I should unload a few more fish to the petshop to ease the load in the tank. Things have changed so should I. I no longer have a healthy tank. Its never easy

I tried to save my fish by putting them in another tank but that tank now is stressed. I am consiidering buying an upgrade tank. I have a 55 gal. Not sure if I should go to 75 gal or another 90 %!)? I would then have two 90 gal with the same occupants. Yes I have two 10 inch tilapias. A friend is telling me to get rid of one but I feel they are safer with me than at the petshop in a 15 gal for six months. One I grew from a baby and the other was a reject from killing his tank mates in a 55 gal. Currently he resides in the 90 gal with the africans and seems to be okay. I don't know what to do.

Thanks for any and all advice.

Last water change last night. Added Prime no ammonia as of this morning.

 

[Jmedic25]

Prime is awesome...Good luck you sound to be getting a hold on things. Can you add any Seachem Matrix? Its a really good product. It holds lots of good bio filtration in a small area. Some crushed live rock is very good as well

 

[limojica]

Thanks for the tip Jmedic25.

Ammonia was 1.0 again when I got in this evening. Changed 50% and added Prime. No ammonia now but continue to monitor. This feels like an eternity. I have ammonia pads in the filters too. What's the deal!

 

[Jmedic25]

Aeration, prime, and lots of room for good bacteria to grow. You can supercharge your filtration with matrix or liverock. Substrate is where ammo can hide. Im changing my gravel out tommorow for sand. Thin layer, I have no expierence with ammo pads. You can also add more prime than the standard dose. No more than 5x the standard dose. It sounds like you need more ammonia eater bacteria. The only way is to get more bio filtration. Your making progress, keep it up

 

[Jmedic25]

Oh and one more thing that im sure you learned the hard way. Wash your sponges in a rotation not all at once...LOL ive done the same thing dont feel bad. Also you should really look into a large sump style filter. Fluvals are great filters. Sumps just give you a very large area of bio filtration. Overstocking is ok if you have the filtration to handle it. I like bioballs but I think liverock of matrix is better. Being overstocked sand is a must. Its near impossible to get all the detritus out of the gravel. It just sits on top of the sand. Thats why im switching

 

[limojica]

Awesome. I am feeling a little better like I won't lose all my fish. I will keep working at it. I also just put bioballs in the filter. I will research the sump. Its not easy having to donate fish in order to let them live. I raised them all from small babies so its depressing. As a fish keeper we know no two fish are the same. The personalities are amazing. Miss the buggers I had to donate gosh sure hope I don't have to wait 6-8 weeks. My nerves are shot already! I am testing the water every 2-3 hours. No ammonia tonight so I'm off to bed until testing starts again tomorrow. Thanks again.

 

[limojica]

Checked ammonia this morning and all is well. Tonight I will look for additional bio filtration and do a 50% water change. Prime is really helping! Of course I've had to add more than the standard dosage but happy to know it's not hurting the fish by adding more.

 

[Jmedic25]

good deal!!!

 

[limojica]

Ammonia is spiking again so I removed all the rocks yesterday and found most of the babies dead. I've been doing twice daily 50-60% water changes. A few weeks back prior to cleaning the filter my catfish died. Then I noticed one fish was lying on its back so I started a 10 gal hospital tank. He is back to normal and is in a 55 gal but this tank is severally overloaded with fish. I am also changing the water in this tank twice daily. I've since found a few fish with scabs or white foam on them so I've been adding them in the hospital with Melaflex. I've since had to increase the hospital to a 20 gal since there are at least 10 fish in there. Ammonia level is high so I've been changing the water as needed.

The 90 gal is in bad shape. Seems like there is a virus or some parasites in there killing the fish. I vaccumed the gravel and removed everything, changed the water and added salt and Melaflex. I'm not sure what I can safely do anymore. By the time I notice the white stuff (not ick) it spreads quickly and the fish dies. I am going to take as many fish to the pet shop as I can to save them then continue to treat the tank. I'll have the Tilapia left with 4 fish. I don't have anyplace else to keep them.

I purchased a 75 gal tank and will set up tomorrow to put the bunch from the 55 gal since they do need more water to control the ammonia.

How can I get rid of the virus or parasites in the 90 gal?

 

[Bl80]

Are there any fish in there? Maybe slowly raising the temp and adding salt and some garlic... These kill alot if things. Tho if you moved all your rocks and deco and found dead fry, this can raise your ammonia.... Since you will be getting a 75.... Which really isn't that much less col than a 75.. You should break down and sterilize everything in the 90? Clean your filter well and put new media in it and run it in your 55 to get it seeded.... IMO that's what I would do. Instead of chasing it, since your fish will be in another tank. Boil or change out your substrate and boil if possible your rocks and deco...

 

[Jmedic25]

You seem to have done everything you could do given the situation. I have no more advice. You may need one of the pros to help you. It does sound like something other than the cycle. Maybe a paraiste. I wish you the best of luck

 

[limojica]

Thanks Jmedic25. It does appear there is something in there.

Bl80, I am upgrading the 55 gal to the 75 gal because of size. The 55 gal housed one fish (Tilapia) prior to this. I have since placed most of the healthy fish in there (20 now) to get them out of 90 gal that was having problems. I don't have room for a 55,75, and 90 so I am getting rid of the 55 and replacing with the 75 gal. I hope to be able to put more fish in the 75 gal to save them. The 90 gal has the second Tipalia and 10+ fish, 6 I am taking to the pet store tonight. Hopefully if healthy, I can transfer the 4 remaining into the 75 gal and leave the Tilapia which appears to be healthy but not eating. The 90 gal started eating again earlier in the week but has since stopped. They just swim by the food.

My only chance seems to be to get EVERYTHING out of the 90 gal, boil and run the filters for a while. If I need to remove the Tilapia I will take him to the petstore to save his life. This is so amazing to me because I have always done weekly water changes. But I see my mistakes though. I am going to do what you've suggested and pray for the best.

Too many rocks (and caves) and overfeeeding caused dead spots which is essense grew and once exploded killed my tank. This along with washing out the filter in water because it was so full of waste. Looks like I may have to start over but lesson learned. A few rocks are good but just make sure they are moved and cleaned as debris will accumulate.

Thanks all for so much great advice. I am hoping to get this under control sooner rather than later.

 

[Bl80]

Where are you globally?

 

[limojica]

New York City...the Bronx. Just called the fish store and was told it sounds like the slime is coming out from the fish and that's the reason they are dying so fast. What a MESS!

 

[limojica]

I read that plants use ammonia and cycle the tank. What kind of plant? Anyone know...

 

[limojica]

Update:

I took both tanks apart Friday drained all the water took out all gravel and washed everything. Actually upgraded the 55 gal to a 75 gal tank. Here's what I noticed. The filter on the 90 gal was filthy even though I cleaned it just two weeks ago. It was filthy from the debris when I disturbed the rocks when I removed the babies then cleaned the dead spot areas. What I did was place a tremendous amount of waste (dead fish toxins) in the filter without cleaning it. I noticed this was the issue when I started the filter up once clear clean fresh water was in the tank. The filter emitted brown waste! I had to drain the water, then rinse out the filter, restart...but it was still dirty. Rather than drain and clean it again, I let it run and added water clarifier. I don't believe the water is healthy though. The FX5 is a pain to clean. I have to have someone pick it up for me because it's too heavy to lift so I will clean it with salt and hot water in a few days. I realize I will lose any good bacteria but it's so toxic it will be better to have it clean than toxic. Most of the fish that were in the tank have died and the three remaining seem to be okay. What a lesson! I noticed the fish in the 55 gal tank were fine and any fish put in the 90 gal ran into trouble but once put in the 55 gal were fine. I haven't had any deaths in the 55 gal...it's only in the 90 gal.

I hope to help others with this experience. I allowed a situation to get out of control and didn't realize how quickly things changed from the events.

 

[Jmedic25]

Thanks for sharing...You couldnt fight that battle with just water changes...Good luck from here on out...Im dealing with bloat in my 75 now...Its claimed 3 fish in 3 weeks...UGH!

 

[limojica]

Jmedic25, I've been trying to get to the bottom of the problem for weeks. I've read articles, asked people...etc. The pet store helped me with cleaning the tank to get it restarted and a breeder told me to clean the filter after asking questions. I didn't really clean it the way he told me. I rinsed it out but didn't wash and soak in hot water and salt. I thought rinsing it would be good enough but it wasn't. The water was never clear with the water changes since the debris was still there. I didn't realize. I thought about just leaving it alone BUT that is cutting corners from being lazy I would think. I really should get it sterilized because of the deaths and uneaten food in large amounts over a number of days. Funny but I thought the filter wasn't working. Little did I realize, it was because the filter is so strong how much it was able to catch. The pet store said it would hold fish for me until my tank settles. I'll take the weakest fish on Monday.

From what I've read on bloat you shouldn't feed during the period and medicate. Good luck! I'm sure you'll be able to get it under control.

Thanks for all your support during my ordeal. I appreciate it.

 

[joejeff]

My advice for both Africans and south Americans is over filtration and a good bottom feeder. A large plecto who is tough enough not to be dinner. I say use double. If the filter claims 50 gallon tank, call it 25 gallon and go from there. My 75 gallon is rocking two penguin biowheel hang ons. They claim 70 gallon a piece. That and my 9 yr old plecto do wrk and keep it clean.