Do gold fish tanks ever really cycle?

[stoneydee]

I've got a 37 gallon goldfish tank that has been set up for almost three months now, and it still hasn't cycled. Nitrite readings are always very low, and nitrate is zero. I do twice weekly water changes to keep ahead of the ammonia, which stays stubbornly between .25 and 1 ppm.

The substrate is 3/4 inch gravel (I read an article about goldfish getting smaller gravel stuck in their mouths - I work about 9-10 hours a day, and it just horrified me to think I could have a fish at home with a rock in its mouth for that long. . . ), which I've been told is still small enough for bacteria to colonize on.

My tank has an Eclipse 3 hood on it with a bio-wheel, and I've just bought an in-tank canister filter on eBay - the mechanical filters in the Eclipse get just putrid looking after about 3-4 days, with water cascading over them not really touching before winging onto the bio-wheel. They are incredibly difficult to scrub off to put back in the filter chamber, since they are attached to the little carbon holder. I thought maybe the sponge in the canister filter would have a greater chance of building up the nitrifying bacteria I'm obviously missing.

Is this common to have a nearly 3 month old "new" tank? (I haven't had this problem with my other tanks, which all have tropical fish in them.)

 

[Bearfan]

Goldfish are waste machines. How much are you feeding them. They will eat forever, and the tendancy is to overfeed them, which could be leading to some of the readings.

Nice part is, goldfish are the tanks of the ocean and can and do live in the worst of tanks.

 

[Sati]

I have a very similar setup but my tank had a very obvious ammonia spike along with high nitrate and nitrate readings. It's just about worked itself out now.

 

[jsoong]

I cycled mine with 2 fantails in about 6 weeks. There is obvious NH3 spike followed with NO2 spike - pretty much by the book. This is during the summer so the temp is 75-80 F. If your tank is colder, it might take longer.

Since you have other fish tank, why don't you seed your filter with some bacteria from the other tank. That should speed things up.

 

[lyquidphyre]

You should try the other suggestions first- but I have 3 goldfish (two common and one calico) along with a handful of other fish. Well, my ammonia level was getting to a point to where all my other fish were dying so I couldn't wait to cycle my tank, or try to cycle my tank so I bought this packet thingy that reduces ammonia. It's called C-100 and it has really helped. I did a 20% water cahnge and added that stuff and my fish are the happiest I've ever seen them.

Now, this is a "chemical" method to keep ammonia down because I didn't want to risk anymore fish and so far everything seems to be going really well in my tank. but like Bearfan said they can live in the worst of tanks!

Good luck on whatever you do =o)

 

[tkos]

Part of your problem is scrubbing off the biowheel. You should never touch that. It is where the good bacteria grow really well and if you scrub it clean then you loose a lot of bacteria.

 

[stoneydee]

No, not the bio wheel, the replaceable mechanical/carbon filter. I don't touch the bio wheel. Those things are nearly $4 a piece and at the rate of two a week, I decided to scrub the crud off the sponge and put it back in, instead of putting a brand new one in every time.

 

[ferret]

Goldfish overwhelm most filters. The general rule I would say is twice, if not three times, the filtration needed for the tank size. My two goldfish, a ryukin calico and red cap oranda, are currently trying their absolute best to overpower a Penguin mini and a Penguin 125. I will probably be putting my spare Penguin 330 on the tank today. Gah, a 75 gallon filter for a 20 gallon tank.

And that's just to deal with the gunk.

 

[stoneydee]

Well, the canister filter came in the mail last night, and I put it in. Ammonia was 0 (after a water change), and I'm pacing around, getting ready to test again to see if the canister helped to hold the line overnight.

Bearfan, I feed Tetra flake ("the primary meal") and sinking granule ("the brilliant blend) 2X per day, and this is the tank I feed slowly, to make sure it all disappears. I supplement with zucchini strips on veggie clips 2 to 3X weekly, removing the stobby nubs after they've attacked it (they love their veggies) and as a treat, about once a week, they get a slice of orange on the veggie clips. (Demolished in, no joking now, about 5 mins.) I only feed orange right before a water change, because I don't like the look of the oil floating on the top of the water. (I also feed orange to my goldies - comets - in my pond.)

 

[Madame_X]

No, not the bio wheel, the replaceable mechanical/carbon filter. I don't touch the bio wheel. Those things are nearly $4 a piece and at the rate of two a week, I decided to scrub the crud off the sponge and put it back in, instead of putting a brand new one in every time.

I have an Eclipse 12, and while the filter cartridges do get nasty looking I think they contain quite a bit of nitrifying bacteria. I didn't replace mine for the first month while my tank was cycling.

Letting the water flow over that filter pad onto the bio-wheel helps to colonize it. If it were me, I'd leave that pad alone until the tank has cycled.

 

[stoneydee]

Madame X, I had not thought of that. I'll just leave that little puppy alone, and see if that helps. Because of the shape of the cartridge chamber, I don't have any seeded filters from other tanks that will fit it. . . Thanks for the input.

 

[TankGirl]

I agree with Madame X about leaving the filter alone. I have that Eclipse setup and I agree that it does not appear the water is getting much contact with the filter, and it gets gunked up rather quickly. Wait until you are cycled and then I do what you mentioned, scrubbing the gunk off the filter manually in a bucket of spent tank water (to preserve the bacteria) and I don't actually change the filter until it is hopelessly damaged. I do think it is a good idea to use the internal filter in conjunction with integral filter in the hood when keeping goldies. Sounds like otherwise your feeding and maintenance regimen is just fine, so a little more time and you should be there! Good luck,

 

[preciousmoments]

I would suggest adding an undergravel filter to go along with your current filter for a tank that size.

 

[PK Tester]

precious have you ever kept and eclipse? I think it would be quite hard to maintain an UGF on an eclipse. I have heard so many bad things about normal UGFs. Now reverse UGF with atleast another power filter I have been told are GREAT.

 

[TankGirl]

I don't discourage anyone from getting a UGF, but I don't think I would ever "recommend" one, because I don't believe they are necessary. For an Eclipse system it is a better idea to keep a small number of fish that do not create a lot of waste, contrary to the photo on the box!

 

[tkos]

I agree with PK Tester TankGirl. The way the eclipse is desinged it doesn't really allow for the addition of any equipment without modifications to the tank itself. UGF are fine filters but tend to be a lot more work or they can go bad. Sticking with a light fish load is the best thing to do.