Constipated, dropsy, or just fat?

[shepz]

I'll give her another bath, I'm going to put her into the main tank.

 

[J.Mcpeak]

Right I'll try the Epsom salts just to be sure, can Epsom also help with worms at all?

I'll have to order something or either pick some up on Sunday, Friday I'm at college and on Saturday I'm at a powerlifting competition, as for meds, are they reliant on brands? Or could I get any and it should do the trick?

Also, what's the youngest age a fish can breed, my two black moores are chasing and bumping, one has gotten fatter and the other one doing the chasing does look like he's getting these white tubercles that you've both been talking about. There both eating and laying perfectly fine waste, and are active and seem happy. I haven't had them ages though, maybe half a year tops, if that.

Ps. Jamie, I've seen pictures of your fishes on Flickr, bloody gorgeous!

Copy from post 61.

Piscine constipation.
2.5grams per 18 litres of MgSO4, continuos bath for 1-3 days.
Water change to reduce/remove treatment from water course.

It isn't dropsy so no cure for that.

I'm sorry I missed this post I got busy with the other heads on here. I would like to say thank you for the P.S. Part of the quote.

To be fair, pip is a wizard on breeding, from this point perhaps he should be considered.
I'm not sure what the baths are for?
At least you can rule out constipation I guess. That's two off of the list.
That leaves, Just fat (full of eggs)

I hope is helps?

 

[pip walters]

Well, certainly looks like a female from the photo and I would stake a week's wages on it being gravid.

Did you put her in the main tank? Any action?... may not see any activity until the morning, but any males in with her should start chasing her soon

 

[shepz]

It's fine we all get caught up in things.
Thanks for replying though

I was just thinking though I spent at least 1 whole hour a day watching her hoping for some faeces, that's why I don't think constipation is fully ruled out, but I guess I've done everything I can.

As for her movement she's in the main tank now, not as active and her dorsal fin isn't as high pointed as it was in the other tank, but I think she's just getting used to it.
I fed them some flakes and sinking pellets but had to rush out so I didn't see if she ate or not (probably did).

No chasing or anything yet, just some chilling.

My two loach are now inseparable too and twist around each other, don't tell me more breeding ha ha.

But yeah I trust you know what your doing pip so I'll see how this plans out.

Can you just explain what could be happening again in terms of eggs rotting or something like that? Do you think she's likely to die or is it too hard to tell?

 

[shepz]

I think she's possibly on her way, I put food in this morning and it appeared like she ignored it. She's also looking even fatter

 

[pip walters]

It's fine we all get caught up in things.
Thanks for replying though

I was just thinking though I spent at least 1 whole hour a day watching her hoping for some faeces, that's why I don't think constipation is fully ruled out, but I guess I've done everything I can.

As for her movement she's in the main tank now, not as active and her dorsal fin isn't as high pointed as it was in the other tank, but I think she's just getting used to it.
I fed them some flakes and sinking pellets but had to rush out so I didn't see if she ate or not (probably did).

No chasing or anything yet, just some chilling.

My two loach are now inseparable too and twist around each other, don't tell me more breeding ha ha.

But yeah I trust you know what your doing pip so I'll see how this plans out.

Can you just explain what could be happening again in terms of eggs rotting or something like that? Do you think she's likely to die or is it too hard to tell?

If the eggs have dropped to the lower ovary and spawning does not take place, then yes, the eggs will rot inside the fish and will likely cause death. The eggs can be gently squeezed out as I described before, if you are willing to try - damage to internal organs etc is not as likely as previously made out as the visceral organs are above and in front of the ovaries.

If you think the fish looks even fatter, then it could mean that the eggs haven't yet dropped, but are in the process of hydrating due to the added stimulus of the fish being back in the main tank. Just keep an eye on her keep me posted.

Where in the world are you?

 

[shepz]

Hmm I can't really tell her body weight/fatness looks like it fluctuates a lot.

I will keep you posted, and I'm based in the uk near hull, in north Lincolnshire.

What about you

 

[pip walters]

Hmm I can't really tell her body weight/fatness looks like it fluctuates a lot.

I will keep you posted, and I'm based in the uk near hull, in north Lincolnshire.

What about you

I am in Worcester.

 

[shepz]

Cool cool,

For the fish, should I just treat it normally as I do with the others and see what happens?

Currently she's mid tank and just floating around in a similar place all the time

 

[pip walters]

Yeah, just keep your eye on her. If you are confident to try, you can give her a gentle squeeze to see if any eggs come out. Let me know and I will pm my number if you need any guidance.

 

[shepz]

Will do and I did a little one earlier but I'm not too sure if I put any pressure on it realistically.

Could you run through it quickly and depending on how confident I am I could use your number,
Thank you.

 

[J.Mcpeak]

I'm still watching! This is a very interesting thread now. Pip is ok, hopefully we are going fishing next year. I'm not a fisherman, I'm the photographer! Still it should be fun.

Perhaps the rivers of Nottinghamshire would allow you to join us, it's kind of in the middle of the Hull, Worcester, Slough (ish) (South Buckinghamshire) triangle.

 

[shepz]

Oh good! I love fishing, used to go loads when I was younger! And if possibilities arise then id love too! Especially now that I haven't been in awhile.

Did I forget to mention that when I first moved this fish it was just his belly that was a little bloated, which then eventually led to its belly and also the lopsided area further down its body.
Is this what would normally happen to a gravid female? Due to eggs moving or anything like that?

 

[pip walters]

Oh good! I love fishing, used to go loads when I was younger! And if possibilities arise then id love too! Especially now that I haven't been in awhile.

Did I forget to mention that when I first moved this fish it was just his belly that was a little bloated, which then eventually led to its belly and also the lopsided area further down its body.
Is this what would normally happen to a gravid female? Due to eggs moving or anything like that?

Hi Shepz
Yes it is normal for a gravid female to be more swollen on one side. As I said in my earliest post I think, this is what first convinced me that this was a female with eggs.

Right, if you are going to have a little squeeze, here is what to do.
Lift the fish out in a net and hold it upside down. Place you thumb and forefinger either side of the fishes abdomen about an inch away from the vent and with light a light pressure, squeeze gently and move your thumb and forefinger towards the vent.

You can start further towards the front of the fish, but starting near the vent should give you an idea, because if she has 'dropped' the eggs ready for spawning, they should flow easily. In fact, as I have already said, id spawning is imminent, the eggs may just flow when the fish is lifted. I don't think she is necessarily that far ahead yet, unless she looks even more swollen??

Her lower abdomen, where the swelling is, should feel fairly soft if pressed lightly if she is getting close. Also, whilst the fish is upside down, try leaning her from side to side and see if the 'mass' moves about at all.

If no eggs are forthcoming, try the same thing each day for the next two or three days and if still nothing, just leave her be. It could just be she has a lot of eggs in there and isn't going to spawn, so she may reabsorb them. This doesn't mean she will lose that podge though, as the next lot of eggs may be developing! Female goldfish, as with many other species, tend to be somewhat plumper than males anyway due to being egg carriers!

I will pm my number, just ring or text if you need to and I will ring you back.

If we do get chance to go fishing, we can squeeze some carp on the bank

More info:
What temperature is your tank? If I am right about this fish, then raising the temperature to 23 - 25 degrees C will almost certainly trigger spawning if there are males present. If no males, then don't raise the temperature as this will mean you HAVE to strip the fish.

 

[shepz]

Right okay thanks I'll try this tomorrow if she's not too restless, should I attempt this at the surface of water (I can lean the net over the side so she would be only just at the surface) or out of water?

And okay thanks, think I'm going to get my old fishing books out again, I miss that sport. Hopefully I can get back into it again by summer.

And please, call me Sam!

 

[pip walters]

Right okay thanks I'll try this tomorrow if she's not too restless, should I attempt this at the surface of water (I can lean the net over the side so she would be only just at the surface) or out of water?

And okay thanks, think I'm going to get my old fishing books out again, I miss that sport. Hopefully I can get back into it again by summer.

And please, call me Sam!

Cheers Sam

Perhaps over a bucket of water, just in case she jumps - you don't really want eggs ging into the tank. They would get eaten mostly, but if not, then they would just be another pollutant!

 

[pip walters]

I have just added a couple of pics of me spawning a koi - have a look on my profile if you like.

 

[shepz]

Ahh right okay I'll do that, and will do!

 

[shepz]

I can't pm you anymore Phil, it says you have too many stored messages!

 

[pip walters]

I can't pm you anymore Phil, it says you have too many stored messages!

Sorry pal, emptied them now! Its that J.Mcpeak clogging my mailbox - he wants to know everything