Fancy Goldy Pairing

[CoryFan]

Hi
My 2 larger fancies are exhibiting breeding behavior.



The lionhead pursues the telescope and nudges it or lays along it.
Occasionally the lionhead pursues the smaller telescope, but only for two seconds.

There are no signs of damage or lethargy.

The telescope is now staying right in the clump of plants predominantly, and the lionhead goes back and forth.

My questions:

In the long-haul, would it be better for these fish if I made this a one-gender tank?

How would I know if the vent was an outtie or an innie? I look and cannot tell.

If this is ok as is, I will just let them eat the eggs. I am focusing on their health and happiness - not looking to make hybrids.

Any other key info?

Thank you!

This is a 55 and the smaller 2 are a lionhead and a telescope also. They are too young to breed.

 

[CoryFan]

Please note I may be slow replying this week. I will be camping. Any advice is appreciated though!
Thank you.

 

[Andy Sager]

Hi
My 2 larger fancies are exhibiting breeding behavior.

View attachment 100801

The lionhead pursues the telescope and nudges it or lays along it.
Occasionally the lionhead pursues the smaller telescope, but only for two seconds.

There are no signs of damage or lethargy.

The telescope is now staying right in the clump of plants predominantly, and the lionhead goes back and forth.

My questions:

In the long-haul, would it be better for these fish if I made this a one-gender tank?

How would I know if the vent was an outtie or an innie? I look and cannot tell.

If this is ok as is, I will just let them eat the eggs. I am focusing on their health and happiness - not looking to make hybrids.

Any other key info?

Thank you!

This is a 55 and the smaller 2 are a lionhead and a telescope also. They are too young to breed.

This is a canundrum . First off, goldfish need a period of colder water to prepare themselves for spawning. It's during the warm up after the cold that they usually spawn. First sign of desire to spawn is the male gets these breeding tubicles in the gill area. Does your male have these? Why do you think he is showing breeding behavior?
Having said this tho, there is the possibility that the females are old enough to spawn just not that big yet or are genetically stunted.
As for sexing your fish, I've always sexed my goldfish by their pelvic fins. A single pelvic fin is the male while the females have 2 fins. I've never seen the opposite be true but since many generations of goldfish have been produced since the last time I needed to sex goldfish, things may have changed but this is a good start.

There is one downside to spawning goldys in your main tank and that is the milt from the male really pollutes the tank. In my hatchery, I could tell which tanks had spawned from a distance by the color of the water and the froth at the top. The fact that you are using a 55 and have only 1 male might reduce the discoloration.

If it were me, and I had no intention of breeding these fish (on purpose) I would make this a one gender tank. Goldfish coloration is not gender specific so you don't really lose by doing this. It eliminates a lot of possible problems and expense post spawn. Yes, the parents do eat the eggs but that doesn't clean up the water.
Given the choice, that's how I would handle it

 

[jlk]

Heres some clear pics of what you are looking for to ID males & females.
Sexing Goldfish

Andy, I have actually never heard of the reference to sexing via pelvic fins before! You actually made me go look at my fish! There may be an inkling of truth to this (atleast in my tanks) but the pro's insist that a single pelvic fin is actually a genetic defect and it disqualifies any fish from a professional show (and these fish should be culled). As a hobbiest and not a professional breeder, I still find this quite interesting!

In respect to how to handle this, obviously, seperate gender tanks would be ideal but this is likely not possible or practical for most hobbiests. So, as long as no one is being injured or overly harassed/stressed, I would just leave things be. If you do encounter a spawn, I would just do some extra water changes/grav vacs to clean up the mess. If it happens once though, it will likely happen again on successive occasions. Ultimately, its up to you on how you would like to handle the situation!

 

[Andy Sager]

Heres some clear pics of what you are looking for to ID males & females.
Sexing Goldfish

Andy, I have actually never heard of the reference to sexing via pelvic fins before! You actually made me go look at my fish! There may be an inkling of truth to this (atleast in my tanks) but the pro's insist that a single pelvic fin is actually a genetic defect and it disqualifies any fish from a professional show (and these fish should be culled). As a hobbiest and not a professional breeder, I still find this quite interesting!

In respect to how to handle this, obviously, seperate gender tanks would be ideal but this is likely not possible or practical for most hobbiests. So, as long as no one is being injured or overly harassed/stressed, I would just leave things be. If you do encounter a spawn, I would just do some extra water changes/grav vacs to clean up the mess. If it happens once though, it will likely happen again on successive occasions. Ultimately, its up to you on how you would like to handle the situation!

As I said, it's been many years since I've spawned goldfish and some of my older books don't even recognize this as a true sexing technique. Interestingly, to me at least, how it seemed to work on a number of different varieties of goldfish. (Possibly all the males I used were genetically linked to the same defective ancestor?) But as I said, many generations of fish have been produced since and standards change over time that this may no longer be an acceptable or viable method. It was just what I used back in the "dark ages" of fish keeping

As for the post spawning cleanup, I would always breed in one tank with spawning mops then move the mops into a clean tank, clean the spawning tank then move on. I'm currently living next door to a koi farmer and he does his fish the same way (only on a much larger scale. ) You can see the froth on the top of the pools he spawns in so some things haven't changed.
I've changed too much water and cleaned to much gravel over my career that I am now adverse to doing extra work. I keep things simple now-a-days. LOL To each his/ her own I guess

 

[jlk]

I found your insight interesting regardless! Various different opinions and observations (and experience) are what make this forum such a great place to learn!

 

[CoryFan]

Thank you both. It is warmer now, and the chasing came with the weather, which is why I figured it was related to breeding.
I appreciate the photos very much!
So far, all is well and there are no babies.