30 Gallon Tank CLOWNS?

[firerescue2002]

I have a 30 gallon tank set up with 15lbs. figi live rock, 35lbs. of "live sand" and 3 yellowtail damsel fish. I am running the tank with a penguin 400 over the back filter. There is no protein skimmer in my system I was told it was not needed for a small system. My lighting situation is a 24" twin tube flouresant light fixture with just regular aquarium lights. I want to put a host anenome in this tank with preferably one or two Maroon Gold Stripe Clown (Premnas biocelatus). Is this tank large enough for two clowns and an anenome. If so what is a good beginer host anenome for maroon clowns? Is my lighting going to support an anenome? What changes do I need to make to the tank? This tank has been established for 1.5yrs. with the same damselfish with no problems (knock on wood). My damselfish will be moved to a recently set up 55 gallon aquarium to start the nutrient cycles.

 

[jackdp]

The tank volume is fine for 2 clowns and an anemone. The lighting however is not. Most anemones require high lighting, you would need to upgrade to PC or MH lighting. Also, most anemones don't live long in captivity but can live in the wild for ages. For this reason I would recommend against the anemone, especially for younger tanks and lesser experienced hobbyists. Most anemones that my LFS gets in sit in the tanks and whither and die. Forget the anemone, the clowns will do fine without it. Look into getting some other cnidarian that the clowns will host in. I find clowns to be just as interesting without the anemone.

 

[BBReef]

agreed for the most part. However, if you are going to get two maroons, i highly suggest finding a mated pair. They are pretty aggressive and if introduced together not already a mated pair, one will most likely kill the other in that size of a tank.

Also, i suggest not using the damsels to start the cycle in the new 55 gal. Go to the articles section of this site and read the article on how to cycle a tank without the use of fish. or just click Here

 

[firerescue2002]

Where can you find mated moroons? And will I have to watch out for fry or is it hard to actually get them to breed without wanting them to. Thanks, for the help guys...

 

[firerescue2002]

Things forgot to mention or ask.... If I go with a PC do I want 2 day bulbs or 1 actinic and 1 day bulb? And will this PC be efficiant for small corals IE: brain, bubble, star, or rose corals? I would eventually like corals when I feel comfortable with them and have some experience. How many small corals could you put in a 30 gal. tank? I realize they do compete and that certain corals do not mix well. I'm just unshure which ones they are. Also thanks for the fishless cycling procedure. I don't want to loose my damsels.

 

[steve-s]

On a 30 gal you would be fine with a 2x65 w PC for most soft and LPS corals. One white and one true actinic. Works great for my 27. As you said, different corals do not mix well and consideration must be given to those that are more aggressive. As long as you can provide a good 6" around each one, you should be fine but again that depends on type. Some need more, some need less. Posting a wish list when your tank is ready and after researching the needs of each might be an idea.

For the maroons, if you can find two that are still quite small, about 1-1½"; they will have a decent chance of becoming a mated pair and reduce the risk of buying larger fish that most likely will have altered sex by then. Unless you intend on raising the young, they will not be a concern. Might not sound nice but the fact of them surviving is quite low unless a proper rearing tank is set up just for them and the hatchlings transered as soon as they leave the egg sack. Most will be consumed by corals, other fish, pods, equipment and eventually the parents. It's not impossible to raise them but does take a good amount or work and dedication. Once/if they start to breed, it will occure about the same time every month. Keeping up with that will be very daunting.

Cheers
Steve

 

[firerescue2002]

For a rearing tank what would one need? Would another 30 gal. with LR and LS after it cycled be sufficient until new homes can be found? How do you make sure you have no hitch-hiking pods on new live rock? I would like to know what equipment I should invest in for a rearing tank if you could help id appreciate it. My emperor 400 works great on my current 30 gal. would that be ok for a rearing or would it be to strong?

TIA
Andrew

 

[steve-s]

If you are truely up to the challenge I would strongly urge you to get Joyce D. Wilkerson book.. Clownfishes. It will help guide you quite well through the entire process.

There are also a few decent articles on the web.

Breeding Clownfish... by David Bloch
Breeding Marine Clownfish... by Robert Goldstein

You may even have some luck contacting ORA farms...

Cheers
Steve

 

[BBReef]

Just to note on the selection of the clownfish... i thought i would be able to mate two small percs, but they ended up killing each other. im not saying it cannot be done, im sure many people have been successful in doing so, but there is a chance they won't. buying a mated pair is just a sure way getting them to not fight and breed.

If you are going to try mating them yourself, be sure to introduce them at the same time so there wont be any intrusion on territory.

i would reccomend the book clownfishes as well. A lot of good information.

Good luck

 

[firerescue2002]

What else do I need to do to my tank to maintain an anenome and possibly corals in the future. I am going to be purchasing a 24" 2 x 65 watt PC some time in the near future. I am also planning an purchasing 110GPD ro/di unit when those funds become available. My main concern is filtration, I miss stated my filter as a Emp 400 it is a Penguin 330 and thats all I have running. I am concerned, after reading other post about skimmers. My LFS lead me to believe skimmers are pointless. Do I need to get a PH in the tank the 330 makes a lot of current. What other problems do you potentially see with this tank. Keep in mind that I would like an anenome and in the future a few corals both stony and soft.

TIA,
Andrew

 

[Electrobes]

skimmers are not at all pointless. I guess with what you will have in your tank, and that you will hvae LR, I don;t think you'll really need one, plus many tanks do well without them. If you can get a protein skimmer, then thats definately a plus, but you won't have everything die on you without one.

 

[BBReef]

To keep the anemone, you might want to purchase more lights. while the PC's will be fine for LPS and soft corals, you will need more than 5 watts per gallon for the anemone, and the PC's only give yuo a little over 4 watts per gallon.

I would take out the bio wheel on the penguin 330 and just use it for circulation and carbon every once in a while, but never leave it in there more than a week. The LR and LS will be enough filtration as long as you have a good amount of water flow.

i dissagree with your lfs and would reccomend geting a skimmer. I run one on my 25 gal and get a good amount foam that is taken out.

im sure others will give their opinions as well so wait to see what others say.

 

[steve-s]

Your about a good year (or Longer) from aquiring an anemone at this point. The need for an established stable tank is even more necessary in a smaller water volume. In caring for such sensitive inverts, I would not suggest skimping on anything that can aid in water quality unless you do weekly water changes religiously. Personally I would opt for the skimmer as well as a small refugium.

The light you need will depend on the anemone you get (if at all) but on a 30 gal, 2x65w PC's could be considered given the depth of the tank. Again because of the smaller tank volume, you will need to carefully consider the anemone of choice as many get quite large. Once the tank is ready, I would suggest looking for "daughter" clones that should be available in some area's. Usually through local reefers but I would avoid LFS purchases completely. Many anemone's brought in through overseas capture rarely survive past the first 6 months in captivity. Have you decided on the type of eventual "dream" tank you want this to be? Something to very carefully consider is that the anemone must take presidence over all other things you may wish to do later on. Once it's there, the anemone is the ruler of the roost and it's needs must be considered before any new additions can be made.

Cheers
Steve

 

[firerescue2002]

The anenome would be going into my 30 gal. that is set up with 15lbs. figi live rock, 35lbs. of "live sand" currently has the 3 damsels but they will be moved as soon as my second 30gal. cycles with the shrimp. This tank has been established for 1 year and 7 months with the damsels, they will be moved to the new 30gal. I do weekly about a 15% water change.

Optimal Inhabitants for this tank "what I would like"
1 Bubble Tip Anenome Heteractis dorensis
2 Maroon Stripe Clownfish Premnas biaculeatus
3 Checkered Nerite Nerita tesselata
6 Mexican Turbo Snails Turbo fluctuosa

That is all for this system.

From what I have read the clowns will be fine without a anenome but will prefer one for security. I will be buying 4 maroons from different locations all about 1.5" in hopes a mated pair will form. I have not given much thought about breeding them. That may come in the future.

I would opt for the skimmer as well as a small refugium.

What kind of skimmer does everyone recomend for this size system? Also I have seen several posts on refugiums, but I am lost on how one would connect it to the main system? Also would 10 gal. be enough? How do I set it up?

 

[steve-s]

Optimal Inhabitants for this tank "what I would like"
1 Bubble Tip Anenome Heteractis dorensis
2 Maroon Stripe Clownfish Premnas biaculeatus

You mean Entacmaea quadricolor aka BTA. The Premnas will not readily accept a Macrodactyla doreensis aka LTA. At least not for a very long time as a rule. The lighting you have (2x65w PC) would be suffiecient for the BTA but as I said earlier you should try and find a TR one. It will be much hardier and give you an even higher success rate.

From what I have read the clowns will be fine without a anenome but will prefer one for security. I will be buying 4 maroons from different locations all about 1.5" in hopes a mated pair will form. I have not given much thought about breeding them. That may come in the future.

The anemone will offer no more security for the fish than a nearby leather coral would. It honestky makes no difference to the clown. I would definately not suggest more than two in the tank at any given time. They would end up tearing each other to pieces. Maroons can be increadibley aggresiive. Best suggestion is to introduce two at the same time. One much larger than the other or preferabley when they are both quite small. The chances of a mated pair developing with both being sexually immature is much higher and safer than trying to pair two larger clowns that may well be both female.

I would opt for the skimmer as well as a small refugium.

What kind of skimmer does everyone recomend for this size system?

If you decide on a skimmer, I would actually suggest either a BaKPak II or Aquac Remora. Both will do well for that size tank.

Also I have seen several posts on refugiums, but I am lost on how one would connect it to the main system? Also would 10 gal. be enough? How do I set it up?

A refugium can serve several purposes. This article should help with that.... Refugiums, aka fuges or refuge. A 10 gal tank would actually make a nice refugium. They are much the same as setting up a sump as far as plumming but the key to their filtration success is a much slower flow through them and employing macro algaes to allow export of unwanted elements as you harvest the algaes out. I would recommend you steer clear of caulerpa species and just stick with non sexually reproducing algae species.

Cheers
Steve

 

[firerescue2002]

The clowns that I was going to purchase are all about the same size 1.5". One LFS has 5 in a sell tank. I watch them every time I go in and it looks as if there may be two pairs forming (they swim and rub on eachother) with 1 clown always hiding in a peice of LR. I had my LFS remove both possible pairs and acclimate to a new tank and hold for me. Too bad Im not ready only $16.99 each. Annual marine sale.

The anemone will offer no more security for the fish than a nearby leather coral would.

Are leather corals easier to care for than an anenome? Thanks for the anenome correction thats why I wanted to post it.

 

[steve-s]

The clowns that I was going to purchase are all about the same size 1.5". One LFS has 5 in a sell tank. I watch them every time I go in and it looks as if there may be two pairs forming (they swim and rub on eachother) with 1 clown always hiding in a peice of LR. I had my LFS remove both possible pairs and acclimate to a new tank and hold for me. Too bad Im not ready only $16.99 each. Annual marine sale.

Do not mistake fish behavour at the LFS for the norm. Once in your tank and settled, they will quickly change to a more "natural" demeanor. Mated pairs will not tolerate each other in the least once settled. Being at your LFS, there is so much activity and unclaimable territory really, that their normally aggressive nature will be somewhat diminished. If you are able to aquire a pair that looks as if they've "hitched" I would opt for one of those. I still strongy believe that you will have alot of problems introducing 4 clowns in a 30 gal tank. This is rarely recommended for tanks over 100 gal.

The anemone will offer no more security for the fish than a nearby leather coral would.

Are leather corals easier to care for than an anenome?

Much, much easier and much less delicate. There are many corals as well as "dwelling" area's that the clowns will easily claim and cozy up to. The anemone is not needed at all in the sense you mean.

I would honestly suggest doing a search of the forum to see how many "I need help" posts there are in reference to anemone's. It will actually shock you!

Cheers
Steve

 

[tundar]

Interesting Info for caring for Clowns!

Does anyone know what are the feeding requirements or essentials food for Clowns particularily Percula?


Thanks.

 

[steve-s]

Does anyone know what are the feeding requirements or essentials food for Clowns particularily Percula?

Mine eat pretty much whatever I feed the tank, flake or otherswise. I would suggest properly fortified foods and primarily meaty fair. Mine love mysis and ocean nutition flakes.

Cheers
Steve

 

[firerescue2002]

If you are able to aquire a pair that looks as if they've "hitched" I would opt for one of those. I still strongy believe that you will have alot of problems introducing 4 clowns in a 30 gal tank. This is rarely recommended for tanks over 100 gal.

What else can I look for in these two possible pairs to be sure they might be "hitching"? I had the LFS hold the 4 so wouldn't loose them during this weekends sale. They were more than happy to because on Monday they go back up to $24.99 ea. I am only going to buy the pair that seems more compatible not all 4.

Much, much easier and much less delicate. There are many corals as well as "dwelling" area's that the clowns will easily claim and cozy up to. The anemone is not needed at all in the sense you mean.

Thanks for the help on this matter. I will start researching corals more. To do this which does everyone like best I will eventually buy all (before I get any corals) but for now just two... So which does everyone think is the most important? I pulled these from the "suggested readings" announcement.

[/i]Aquarium Corals by Eric H.Bornerman

Corals: A Quick Referance Guide by J. Sprung

The Modern Reef Aquarium Vol. 1,2,&3 by Svein A. Fossa and Alf J. Nilsen

ALREADY ON ITS WAY IS
Clownfish by Joyce Wilkerson

Much Appreciated help...
Thanks Guys,
Andrew