Brand New To The Hobby...Please Help

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NJNewbie

Aquarium Advice Regular
Joined
May 27, 2012
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Ok guys....brand new to the Hobby so let me tell you what I have done so far and please stear me in right direction. I have a 2 1/2 year old son who loves fish and wanted to get a tank. We had heard to go as big as possible so we purchased a 65 Gallon Aqueon Column tank that is 36 inches wide, 18 inches deep and 25 inches height wise. We have a stand, also have a cover as well as a Solarmax 36inch HO light which has a blue light, white light and night blue led lights which never shut off(very dull to little light at all). I also have a 3.5 Gallon aquarium bucket as well as a scrub brush and a Gravel vacumn to do cleanings and PWC.

I have filled the tank with water as well as decorations, gravel and some fake plants. I have 2 emperor 400 filters's running on the back of the tank with only the 2 carbon cartridges they come with in them both. Why 2 emperor 400's on a 65 gallon? Someone told me (LFS) the more filtration you have the better and always have 2 filters going in case something happens to one of them. The other 2 grey media cartridges they come with are empty, as my LFS told me the carbon filters is all I need and I have no idea what else to stick in these(Please help if anyone has any suggestions). I also have a 300W heater currently set to 79 degrees and it has my water currently sitting at 75-76 degrees after running since 12pm today(approx 14 hours). I have my heater in the right back corner of tank and my thermometer in the left front corner to get a temperature reading. I have had to adjust the heater temp upwards every couple of hours to get the water to the mid 70's I assume I needed as I want to stock this tank with tropical semi-aggressive fish which I think need to have a water temp between 72-80 degrees. I also added around 7-8 ML of Top Fin Tap Water Dechlorinator when the tank was first filled. After running the filters and heater for approx. 5 hours I added 13 rounded tablespoons of API Aquarium Salt (1 TBL for every 5 Gallon...65 Gallons=13 Tablespoons). Then after leaving this alone for another couple hours, approx 8pm tonight I added a 4 oz bottle of Fresh Water Start Smart which is a Instant Cycling Liquid that I purchased from my LFS which they said to add and wait 24-48 hours and then I could add fish...BTW bottle says 4 oz for 50 gallons so I may have under dosed the tank a little. So this is where I am at and I started reading on-line and found this great forum. I was originally planning on allowing my tank to continue running for all day tommorrow also and then going out on Monday to purchase like 5-7 Tiger Barbs to put in as I had heard they were very good starter fish, needed to be in schools(5 or more) and could withstand some water changes...also the local Pet chain Giant has them for $1 so I thoiught this would be a good start to make sure things are up to snuff....but after reading some of the forum and such I am confused if this is what I should really do or do I have to wait weeks and weeks for my tank to cycle....please help as I am lost and don't really know what to do next....:ermm::( Should I start over and not use the liquid bacteria to cycle the aquarium? Continue with my current course of action?? The good news is I found this forum befor I purchased any fish so I can do it right from the start with sound advice from you guys here on the forum...

Also when explaining to me realize I am not familiar with alot of the terms and need it to be spelled out in baby terms for me to understand.:thanks: And please be patient with me as I hope you guys can get me up to speed and started with this tank for my son and my family....:oops: as I want to have all my fish healthy and my son and the fish very happy :fish2:
 
additional info....

also just a FYI...water is slightly cloudy...when looking from the front water looks clear but when you look from the sides straight to the other side you can see the water is slightly cloudy and not crystal clear. Is this something that will clear up??? Filled the tank with cold tap water....do I need to do a PWC to help clear this cloudyness up? Or will the filters running clear it up for me???:popcorn:
 
Welcome! I just wanted to say I'm impressed at the lengths your going to for your son. You have things off to a good start it sounds like. Hopefully someone will come along soon with more knowledge than I have. For now definitely hold off on purchasing fish until you are fully aware of the options of both fish in cycling and no fish cycling.
Good luck!
 
Carbon is good for removing toxins and medication, but generally not necessary. In place of carbon or in those empty baskets most people run extra biofilter media like ceramic rings or a bag of purigen or something like that.

Ideally you'll want to get a liquid test kit for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.

Simply put, the fish produce ammonia with their waste and ammonia is toxic to fish in high enough doses. Bacteria will convert the ammonia to nitrite, which is also toxic. Another species of bacteria will convert the nitrite into nitrate. Nitrate is nowhere near as harmful and can be removed doing partial water changes weekly or bi-monthly as needed.

The fish store is recommending a fish-in cycle. By using the quickstart you're hopefully adding the two species of bacteria needed to keep the ammonia and nitrite at zero or close to it. These products don't always work. The key is having a test kit so you can test daily for ammonia and nitrite, and if they register do a large partial water change. If after adding the school of fish the aquarium remains stable for a week or so you can slowly add more fish and test daily.

The alternative to fish-in cycle is to supply your aquarium with ammonia from another source and let the bacteria build up consuming that source and once you get zero's on the ammonia and nitrite tests you do a large partial water change and stock fish. (keep testing daily after adding fish to make sure it's stable, once stable you can test weekly)

If you can you want to mix the dechlorinater with the water before adding it to the tank. Most people use prime, it works well and is cheap.

Salt I'm not so sure about. Seems like a lot to me but I've never used it, as long as your fish are fine with it then thats all that matters. Before buying do lots of research a lot on any fish you add. Some fish will do better with some salt, other fish will die sooner. Salt added temperarily can also be used to cure some problems.

As for cloudiness. It could be from the bacteria you added, could be from the gravel, or anything else you added. Can't really give advice on it, but if it was me I'd put some purigen in the filter, with some extra ceramic rings or stars or whatnot, and maybe use some extra fine filter cloth in the filter till it clears up.
 
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Good info above. Get a liquid test kit (API Master is best). A better dechlorinator is Prime; it's more concentrated so you'll use less. You'll have to decide whether you want to do a fish-in or fishless cycle. Both are valid and have their pros and cons. The link Mumma gave you will explain both. If you go with fish-in just be prepared to do daily water changes for 1-3 months if needed. Tiger barbs are semi-aggressive, mostly toward each other but can be to other fish as well so that might limit your stocking options. A school of 10+ is generally advised to minimize aggrsession but if you are going for a fish-in cycle I wouldn't add that many at once. The bacteria starters, etc can be hit and miss and most are useless; plus without an ammonia source for the bacteria to feed on (whether it's from live fish or you adding ammonia manually) the cycle won't start.

I wouldn't bother with the salt; it does nothing really and generally isn't needed in freshwater unless you're treating for an illness.
 
alright guys have decided on a few things. First off my water still is slightly cloudy even after having the filters running for 2 days, do I do a PWC to help with this? A total drain and refill? Run extra filter media which will clear it up??

also today I'm going to go get a api test kit as well as some extra filter media to run in the extra grey media holders in both my emperor 400's, any suggestions??? Amonia remover??? Purigen??? Foam pad?? Ceramic rings??Something deifferent?? I can get 4 different things or 2 of the same, 1 in each of the 2 filters??? or any combo??

Next I going to do the fishless cycle. Quick question, do I need to remove all the water and start over, or can i just start with the water that is in there that has the bacteria added from the bottle and the aquarium salt. I know some others have said the salt isn't necessary but I have a family member who swears by it, so I think I may keep using it for now until I see how it affect my tank and my fish.

My last question is right now I fill the tank with a bucket (thinking about a python but I don't have a tradition faucet in the sink so don't know if it will fit, have to do some more reseach). Once I have the tank stocked and I do a PWC, I would assume I would empty about 15 gallons of my 65 gallon tank (little less than 25%) and then refill. My question is 2 fold, first off how do I get my water close to the 75 degrees my tank is? (use warm water straight from the tap? Set out water for a day or so before and let come up to room temp?)

Secondly, do I add the declorinator to each and every bucket dividing the full dose (enough for 65 gallons even though I am only replacing 15) between the buckets? or just add the full dose to one bucket???


Thanks again for all the help and help getting this newbie up to speed to get his tank up and running....
 
I always add the full dose of dechlor to one bucket
Don't go by readings now as they're often perfect
I recommend a fishless cycle and if the relative you mentioned has a tank, see if you can borrow some used filter media to get your cycle going and finished more quickly
If you get the media, keep it in tank water for the drive home to prevent die off of bacteria
As mentioned tiger barbs are rather aggressive and limit your stock significantly
However if you like the look of them go for it!
 
Thanks Emerald for the quick response....3 quick questions...

#1)any suggestions on what filter media to get for my additional holdersin my emperor 400's?

#2)when I do fishless cycle can I just the water I already have in there or do I need to empty and start over??

#3) when you do the full dose to one bucket, is it the first bucket or the last?? And how do I get the water close to my 75 degrees in my tank?
 
looks like your off to a good start. Any filter media should do. You can use the water you have in there now. The first. Get a heater and thermometer.
 
Any media will do: sponges, ceramic rings, bio balls. I wouldn't get ammonia removers though-- these will remove the ammonia that the bacteria need to get established in your tank to cycle it.

You can keep the same water.

To temp match the water, you can just feel both with your hand. Mix hot and cold from your faucet and try to get it to feel the same to the touch as the tank water. It doesn't have to be precise.

For the dechlorinator, you can do it two ways:
---Add enough dechlorinator to each bucket for the amount of water you are putting in (so if a bucket is a 5 gal bucket, add enough to each bucket for the 5 gals)
---OR drain the tank and then add dechlorinator straight to the tank but add enough for the whole volume of the tank (so if the bottle says one capful treats 50 gals, add about 1 1/2 caps (it's ok to add a bit more than needed) to the tank, then start to refill the with water from the buckets.

If you have relatives with a freshwater tank see if they'll give you some media from their filter; it'll help seed your filter with bacteria and the cycle go a bit faster.
 
NJNewbie said:
Thanks Emerald for the quick response....3 quick questions...

#1)any suggestions on what filter media to get for my additional holdersin my emperor 400's?

#2)when I do fishless cycle can I just the water I already have in there or do I need to empty and start over??

#3) when you do the full dose to one bucket, is it the first bucket or the last?? And how do I get the water close to my 75 degrees in my tank?
Click to expand...

1-Sponges,filter floss,and bio rings,also Purigen is great.Carbon is only good for removing tannins and medicine.
2-You can keep the water you already have.The bacteria are on solid surfaces like gravel,your filter,and decorations.
3-the first bucket as that way you don't poison the fish with chlorine.Just fell the temp of the water and estimate it.It doesn't really matter if you're off a few degrees.
 
alright guys were getting there. I just got home from the pet store and ace hardware. I have purchased the ammonia from ace hardware to start my fishless cycle. I also have purchased my API Master test kit for freshwater as well as a bottle of Prime. I also purchased a 250 ML bottle of Purigen that I will fill one of my Emperor 400 media holders with. I also purchased 2 boxes of the Fuval Biomax 500g ceramic rings so I can fill 2 more of the media holders with those (1 in each emperor) Unfortunately the LFS only had 1 bottle of the 250 ML Purigen, should I order another bottle to fill the last media filter or should I run a sponge in that one??? Or is it important to have both emperor 400's with identical setups, so then I need to make sure I have 1 media holder with rings and 1 with Purigen???

Also, the bottle of Purigen says that is helps remove amonia, nitrates and nitrites from water...so i assume I don't want to put these products in my filters until the tank has cycled already? Am I correct or should I put the purigen and the porcelin rings in now befor I start the fishless cycle?

Thanks for bearing with this newbie and all my questions....
 
ok guys turned up the heater to get the water up to 80 degrees and I am ready to add ammonia to start fishless cycle. Should I put the biomax and purigen in my filters now or after the tank cycles???? I am really confused...please help out the newbie
 
Add the ceramic rings now as the bacteria will use them to populate on, and I'd probably wait till you're done cycling before adding the purigen.

Also, the 250ml bottle of purigen treats 250 gallons so you don't need more. You're going to want a fine meshed bag to hold the purigen or you'll have those little balls everywhere (some people just use pantyhose). Split it into 4 bags and use two at a time. Then when you need to recharge it you can pull the two bags out to recharge and add the two you had saved.

You don't need to fill evey slot in the filter I don't think. Just put in what you feel you need.
 
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Ok just tested my tank water for the first time with the API Master Kit and got the following readings:
Ammonia : 0
Nitrite : 0
Nitrate : 0
pH : between 7.4-7.6

Note** test was kinda weird when use the normal pH solution I got a dark blue that was darker than the 7.6 color on the chart so i assumed must be higher cause this is the highest. So I retested using the high pH solution and I got the exact color of the lowest 7.4 rating for that solution.

So I assume my pH reading is somewhere in between 7.4 and 7.6....am I correct in assuming this??

So now I am going to add my ammonia from the ace hardware store and according to the calculator (Calculator) looks like I need to add 9.84 ML since it is a 65 gallon tank with 10% ammonia to get it to a 4ppm reading. Going to add 9 ML and wait 20 min to test and see what reading I get as I don't want to overdose it....wish me luck, here we go...be back in 25-30 minutes to post results....
 
ok...I have started the fishless cycle...added 9ML of the ammonia from ace hardware, waited the 20 minutes re-tested and got a reading of 4 ppm....so now I wait until it drops down to like 1 right???? I assume test every day and record my results??? Do I redose the ammonia everyday after testing or only redose once it drops down to 1 ppm? Thanks and please check back daily to give me a hand with all my test results and how to react accordingly and getting this newbie through this fishless cycle....
 
Yeah you'll want to test daily but in the beginning you can just test for ammonia. When ammonia levels start to drop you can start testing for nitrites and nitrates. Keeping a log of the test results and dosing schedual can definately help identify and correct any problems.

One tip I hear a lot is to add a pinch of flake fish food to your tank. This will give the bacteria any trace minerals and such they might need.

I'll let someone with more experience chime in on the best method of re-dosing ammonia, but waiting untill it drops to 1ppm then adding 5-6mL to bring it back to 4ppm sounds good. It will take less and less time to drop back down again, until one day it drops from 4ppm to zero in 24hrs. Once nitrites do the same you're done and can stop adding ammonia (if you're ready for fish, if not keep adding ammonia until you're ready). Do some large water changes to get rid of all the excess nitrates and the tank is ready for fish.

On your mark... Get set... Wait! And the cycling has begun :).
 
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Ok....since my tank is just starting the fishless cycle...now I need to decide on what fish to stock with??? Being a 65 gallon clumn tank with gravel what are some suggestions....my son and wife like color and neat looking fish...so please point me in the right direction...I kinda like the sharks (Bala...maybe too big for my tank since you need to keep in groups of 3 or more....or a Red Tail as my tank centerpiece as I know they are very territorial and aggressive to other sharks).....I'm open to anything and everything, but remember I need to keep my son and wife happy, so colors and cool looking are the most important....thanks
 
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