Clown fish.. Ich?

[Fluff]

The pains of not QT'ing new fish. I'm really sorry. I have no suggestions for easy removal of a damsel. I've had to tear apart a 110g tank to remove a damsel (remove 100lbs of rock). It sucks but sometimes is necessary. Good luck.

 

[roka64]

Some one suggested to leave the net in the tank so the fish gets used to it. Feed and grab him!

 

[quixand]

Nice idea Roka. I'll give that a shot.

 

[quixand]

Update:

I ended up having to re-aquascape. *mad*

Needless to say, the damsel is gone. Brought it back to my LFS.
Clowns not doing to well. SG 1.010 temp 80 degrees.

Did not eat last nights feeding.

 

[roka64]

How fast did you drop the salinity and raise the temp?
Have you tested your water?
What are the results?

 

[quixand]

The male is NOT doing good guys. He's laying on his side at the bottom of the tank, and his breathing is labored. I've tried scooping him out but he darts away with all this energy.

He has eaten in 24 hrs now. The female ate alittle today. I did a 10% again earlier, and cleaned out any detrius etc on the bottom of the QT.

PH is 8.4
Ammonia is 0.5
Nitrates are 10 ppm
temp is 80 F
SG is 1.010

Should I icebox the male?
I'm absolutely gutted at this, and if there is no way for him to improve.....I dunno.
This is downing me out alot. I feel helpless.

 

[melosu58]

The problem now is the ammonia. It must be at 0. He might be suffering from ammonia poisoning. I would think about doing a 30 or 40 % PWC and try to get that ammonia down.

 

[quixand]

I've actually never had ammonia at 0%. In any tank I've ever had.

0.5 is rather nominal IMO. They were both just about dead this morning, and probably are too far gone now. By the time I get home from work I'm expecting them to be gone.

If not, I'll deff. try a 40% PWC.

*edit*
If they are alive, how do you all feel about a product like this?
http://www.petco.com/Shop/Product.aspx?R=10670&Nav=1&N=35+30&Ntt=ammonia&sku=846970&familyID=7929&

 

[melosu58]

I know people that use it but I choose to remove it by way of my RO/DI unit. I have no experience with it.

 

[quixand]

If by some miracle they are alive when I get home, and it is ammonia poisoning....can they be saved if it's gone this far by doing a 40% pwc and adding some of that supp? Or should I put them down?

 

[roka64]

I think they can be saved or at least more at ease with a 40% PWC, not sure about that supp either, I like to do it the natural way.

 

[quixand]

Ok. No supps. I'll do a 40% as soon as I get home and post results.

 

[Fluff]

Sorry to hear about your clowns. All you can really do at this point is support them and hope they pull through. If they are pretty bad off to begin with, they may not be strong enough to make it through the treatment but it's always worth trying. I agree ammonia in any trace amounts is going to make recovery much much worse for them and should be avoided. What type of test kit are you using? To have even a small amount in your system is bad so to say it's always there, I'd think something is wrong and it may just be your tests. Keep up with the water changes, this will help. I can't say it will save them but it will help them if only to keep them a bit more comfortable. Good luck, I hope they pull through.

 

[quixand]

I use the Red Seas kit with Ammonia, NO3, PH, Nitrite.

 

[Fluff]

Oh, ok. I use Aquarium Pharmaceuticals brand and sometimes it can look like you have ammonia when you don't. You may want to take a sample to the lfs for a second opinion just in case but since they are in an uncycled tank, it will go through a cycle and frequent water changes, even as many as every other day, may be necessary. Best of luck to you and your fishes.

 

[quixand]

Fish are dead.

RIP

/cries

 

[roka64]

ACK, sorry to hear that!

 

[Fluff]

Fish are dead.

RIP

/cries

Sorry for your loss.

 

[Tomd]

I am really really surprised that people feel that ich is always present.

1. Ich needs a host. How can a fishless system have ich? It is brought in through poor quarintine procedured.

2. Ich cab be "managed" with things like garlic, uv, cleaner shrimp....It can not be erradicated unless the system is left fallow.

3. The only time I would advise to leave a fish in the main is if it is so bad that moving it may make it worse by stressing the fish. In this case the determination needs to be made, whether to "manage" or erradicate.

There is a reason why people feel that ICH is always present and it always seems to be those people that say ICH can be defeated with the use of garlic and other remedies. That is because ICH is always present in their systems because they do not properly erradicate it.

Sadielynn, you can leave LR, inverts in a tank and the ICH will go away after its life cycle and it has no host.

 

[roka64]

I agree with Tom, but that is for another discussion. I believe Sadie was telling what happened to her tank. From what she stated, she did all the right things. I think ich can be present in a fish (not a system), as a cyst that can stay "encrusted" (look at all the critters that grow on our base rock/dead rock) for as long as needed and just the right parameters can bring it out of it's cyst stage, like temp, stress or moving. From what I have read, once infected a cyst (sorry, I don't have the correct name for this stage of ich, in front of me) will burrow in the the fish's gills or fins and lay dormant until said parameters are reached. (KEEP IN MIND, this is only what I have read on ONE book and am still searching for how long the "cyst" can remain dormant....)
PS, I wasn't yelling, just wanted folks to read the last part.