Dosing Community Tank Q

[swammy]

Hi everyone,

I was wondering if I could get everyone's rule in on my main tank's situation.

I have a fancy goldfish with swim bladder. It started honestly some time back and to try and circumvent I've maintained the water parameters and used aquarium salt. She still gets around and eats, but shows obvious signs of swim bladder being upside down/on her side and at the bottom of the tank.

I'm interested in treating with amoxicillin, but due to my living situation I can't set up an isolation tank. Not jumping the gun, but looking I found this product https://www.tractorsupplyrx.com/aqua-mox-amoxicillin-52208.html


Would it be so terrible to treat the community tank with this? None of the other fish are sick (dojo loaches, albino corries). I want to treat my fancy, but I obviously don't want to harm the rest of the tank. For reference, it's a 55g. I'd love any advice you guys have. ��

 

[Andy Sager]

Hi everyone,

I was wondering if I could get everyone's rule in on my main tank's situation.

I have a fancy goldfish with swim bladder. It started honestly some time back and to try and circumvent I've maintained the water parameters and used aquarium salt. She still gets around and eats, but shows obvious signs of swim bladder being upside down/on her side and at the bottom of the tank.

I'm interested in treating with amoxicillin, but due to my living situation I can't set up an isolation tank. Not jumping the gun, but looking I found this product https://www.tractorsupplyrx.com/aqua-mox-amoxicillin-52208.html


Would it be so terrible to treat the community tank with this? None of the other fish are sick (dojo loaches, albino corries). I want to treat my fancy, but I obviously don't want to harm the rest of the tank. For reference, it's a 55g. I'd love any advice you guys have. ��

You don't want to treat your main tank with antibiotics as most of them will either suppress or kill off your bacteria bed that keeps your ammonia level from rising. That said, most of the Penicillin/Ampicillin based meds do not really work on fish as much as we used to think they did. They really only work of fungal infections on fish and there are better meds for that than the penicillins.

If you can't set up a hospital tank, swim bladder issues in Goldfish are sometimes cured by fasting the fish for 3-4 days and adding Epsom salt ( not aquarium salt) at a rate of 1/8 teaspoon per 5 gallons of water. If that doesn't cure the fish, feeding them deshelled boiled peas. If that doesn't help the fish, you can actually treat the fish in a 5 gallon bucket that you can get at places like Home Depot or Lowes or Tractor Supply like stores. A hospital tank is a temporary tank so you shouldn't inconvenienced for long. In a hospital tank, if your water's Ph is above 7.2, I'd treat with Kanamycin ( Kanaplex). If your water's Ph is 7.0 or lower and your GH is not high, you can treat with maracyn 2 ( minocycline). Both of these meds are absorbed through the skin. If your Ph is lower than 7.0 but your GH is high, you'd be better served to get medicated fish food for bacterial issues. This way the meds are getting into the fish directly and not effected by the water.

Hope this helps.

 

[swammy]

You don't want to treat your main tank with antibiotics as most of them will either suppress or kill off your bacteria bed that keeps your ammonia level from rising. That said, most of the Penicillin/Ampicillin based meds do not really work on fish as much as we used to think they did. They really only work of fungal infections on fish and there are better meds for that than the penicillins.

If you can't set up a hospital tank, swim bladder issues in Goldfish are sometimes cured by fasting the fish for 3-4 days and adding Epsom salt ( not aquarium salt) at a rate of 1/8 teaspoon per 5 gallons of water. If that doesn't cure the fish, feeding them deshelled boiled peas. If that doesn't help the fish, you can actually treat the fish in a 5 gallon bucket that you can get at places like Home Depot or Lowes or Tractor Supply like stores. A hospital tank is a temporary tank so you shouldn't inconvenienced for long. In a hospital tank, if your water's Ph is above 7.2, I'd treat with Kanamycin ( Kanaplex). If your water's Ph is 7.0 or lower and your GH is not high, you can treat with maracyn 2 ( minocycline). Both of these meds are absorbed through the skin. If your Ph is lower than 7.0 but your GH is high, you'd be better served to get medicated fish food for bacterial issues. This way the meds are getting into the fish directly and not effected by the water.

Hope this helps.

Thanks so much for your reply! I tried fasting to no avail, but I've yet to do epsom salt. I can go ahead and set up a bucket quarantine - I'm moving from a shared space (hence the mild constraint) to an apartment in about two weeks, so that's why I'm anxious about treating her. I imagine a 10g HOB would be fine for the bucket? Also, for making the medicated food, plain gelatin is fine to bind the medication/food with right? As a last question, the parameters are at about 6.8 for the PH and then the GH is high. With that in mind, would you recommend Kanaplex or maracyn 2? Thanks again so much - I really appreciate it

 

[Andy Sager]

Thanks so much for your reply! I tried fasting to no avail, but I've yet to do epsom salt. I can go ahead and set up a bucket quarantine - I'm moving from a shared space (hence the mild constraint) to an apartment in about two weeks, so that's why I'm anxious about treating her. I imagine a 10g HOB would be fine for the bucket? Also, for making the medicated food, plain gelatin is fine to bind the medication/food with right? As a last question, the parameters are at about 6.8 for the PH and then the GH is high. With that in mind, would you recommend Kanaplex or maracyn 2? Thanks again so much - I really appreciate it

I wouldn't put a HOB on a bucket. A simple airstone or sponge filter will suffice. You can control ammonia buildup with water changes.

Here's a page with instructions on making medicated fish food: https://www.hikariusa.com/articles/medicatedfeed.html
A gelatin based food is at the bottom of the page. I would use the Bifuran they list since you have the lower Ph. It's unlikely this is parasite induced so the Metronidazole is not necessary.

 

[Colin_T]

Can you post a video of the fish so we can see if it actually has a swim bladder problem?

If it does have a swim bladder problem, there is no cure and you will be wasting money adding medication.

What do you feed the fish?
A lot of fancy goldfish have trouble swimming when fed a lot of dry food. They ingest air with the food and the air gets trapped in their intestine causing them to float about. When the fish fart the air out, they can swim normally again.

Fancy goldfish should be fed some frozen food each day to compensate for the dry food they eat. They should also get plenty of plant matter in their diet.

 

[Andy Sager]

Can you post a video of the fish so we can see if it actually has a swim bladder problem?

If it does have a swim bladder problem, there is no cure and you will be wasting money adding medication.

What do you feed the fish?
A lot of fancy goldfish have trouble swimming when fed a lot of dry food. They ingest air with the food and the air gets trapped in their intestine causing them to float about. When the fish fart the air out, they can swim normally again.

Fancy goldfish should be fed some frozen food each day to compensate for the dry food they eat. They should also get plenty of plant matter in their diet.

Not to argue but conditions that appear like swim bladder are curable so taking a medical course of action after the usual non medical attempts fail is not out of order to try. The OP has said they tried fasting the fish and salt but the condition has not abated and the fish is still eating so worth a try (imo) to address any possible internal infection that may be the cause with a medicated food.

 

[Colin_T]

What are you feeding the fish?
If you are giving it dry flake or pellet food, it could still have air in its intestine.

Fasting doesn't help if the fish has air in its intestine because they need food to push the air out. Dropping dry food and using frozen or live food for a week can usually fix the problem if it's air.

If the fish is eating well, it doesn't have an internal bacterial infection.

 

[swammy]

I wouldn't put a HOB on a bucket. A simple airstone or sponge filter will suffice. You can control ammonia buildup with water changes.

Here's a page with instructions on making medicated fish food: https://www.hikariusa.com/articles/medicatedfeed.html
A gelatin based food is at the bottom of the page. I would use the Bifuran they list since you have the lower Ph. It's unlikely this is parasite induced so the Metronidazole is not necessary.

Perfect - I have everything for an isolation bucket, then. The only thing is I guess Bifuran+ and all Furan products have been discontinued because of some FDA ruling. After some reading, I guess it's because they wanted to regulate it to strictly doctor prescribed only which is a bummer because it seemed really good. What would you recommend alternatively?

 

[swammy]

Thanks for your help, too - I would think it would be from the dry flakes she gets as well, but that said she's been at the bottom of the tank and can seldom come to the top (at all), so even if I hadn't fasted her air seems an improbable reason. She only ever eats at the bottom of the tank.

 

[Andy Sager]

Perfect - I have everything for an isolation bucket, then. The only thing is I guess Bifuran+ and all Furan products have been discontinued because of some FDA ruling. After some reading, I guess it's because they wanted to regulate it to strictly doctor prescribed only which is a bummer because it seemed really good. What would you recommend alternatively?

Well that sucks. All the good meds are being taken off the market.
Since it's going to be in the food, I'd go with the Kanaplex. The issue with the marycin2 is the calcium in the GH so you don't want it to happen inside the fish. Kanamycin won't have any issues with the hardness but may not be at full effect in the lower Ph so it may take longer for the remedy to be effective.
( Time to get friendly with your neighborhood Veterinarian. )