Fishless Cycling - Fish Food Method

[Caduceus]

G'day

Ive got a litte 22 litre tank that Im experimenting with, trying to do a fishless cycle.

Ive followed all the articles I can find and Im pretty confident its all set up and ready to go.

Unfortunately its really hard to get pure ammonia here in Australia, so I've been trying the fish food method.

I started by putting in just a pinch of fish food and waited (2days)......nothing....another pinch (another 2 days)....nothing.....

A bigger pinch - another two days....nothing.....

A pretty big pinch, all finely ground up - 3 days.....nothing.

Its been about 14 days now, with lots of fish food, but the ammonia is still set firmly at zero.

Im using "Tropical Fish Flakes"

I've made sure all the water has been treated with API Tap Water Conditioner.

The tank has just plain black gravel, a sponge filter, heater - set at about 29 degrees celcius (84 degrees F)

Why is there no ammonia forming? Maybe Im using the wrong fish food....but shouldn't it all decompose and produce ammonia.

I've been testing for Nitrite and Nitrate as well.....all zero.

Any suggestions??

 

[George9]

What test kit are you using?

 

[Caduceus]

Im using the API Freshwater Master Test Kit.

8 drops of solution 1, then 8 drops of solution 2, shake - wait 5 minutes.

No ammonia.

Im new at this game, as you can tell, but I believe the API Test Kits are pretty reliable (not sure we can rely on the operator though!)

 

[Aquavic]

What I did is use goldfish food, they tend to dirty a lot more faster than the tropical fish food. my method it putting a net hanging low enough so that the water level reaches high enough to submerge 50-75% of the net but not letting it fully submerge. Then add a lot of goldfish food and wait till it dissolves into the water. Make sure you stir the net lightly so that the ammonia gets through. In about 4-5 days your ammonia should be at about 1-3 ppm. To make your cycling speed up add bacteria in a bottle. Using as much as indicated on the bottle won't cut it. You have to put twice as much as they say you need so if you have a 10 gallon you're gonna have to put 20 gallons worth of bacteria.

 

[shellieca]

Do you have to use fish food? From what I've heard you can use a raw frozen shrimp, put it in a mesh bag as it gets really messy. When the ammo gets where you want it, take it out, put it in a baggy & freeze it until you need ammo again. Just a thought.

 

[Aquavic]

There's a lot of ways to do it, fish food is just one of them. It's totally up to you.

 

[tamtam]

I'd try the shrimp or consider a fish in cycle. I know many people think they are dangerous or cruel to the fish but when you know what you are doing and are prepared it is completely safe.

 

[shellieca]

I'd try the shrimp or consider a fish in cycle. I know many people think they are dangerous or cruel to the fish but when you know what you are doing and are prepared it is completely safe.

I agree. I've done all my tanks fish in with no loss of life just test daily & do the water changes.

 

[librarygirl]

I've never done it with fish food but you'll probably need a lot to get an ammo reading (which is going to cause a mess in the tank too; maybe add it into a mesh media bag or clean nylon stocking so it doesn't foul up the whole tank). Fish food is tough b/c you can't dose it precisely and there's no clear measurement on how much food converts into ammonia. If you can't get pure ammonia try a frozen shrimp or prawn from the grocery store (put it in a bag or stocking as mentioned above so you can easily pull it out once ammonia reaches the right level)-- it's going to be smelly though.

 

[Borderlesscott]

First time I tried a fishless cycle I tried the fish food method and could not get ammonia at all, switched to prawns - worked far better. Took me at least 10 stores to get ammonia, so much easier - I read an article a while back about a guy who used urine as an ammonia start, though I personally wouldn't.

 

[tamtam]

wow to the urine thing! Can't say I'd take that route either. lol

I think if I were in that situation I'd probably stick with fish in cycles. Can't stand fresh shrimp let alone old rotting shrimp. lol

 

[Aquavic]

Urine? Oh god that doesnt sound too safe lol. Wouldn't that be toxic to the fish as urine does contain other chemicals I'm sure, I'm no expert in urine but that seems a little too much.

Doesn't fish in cycle take longer than just pure ammonia?

 

[tamtam]

Urine? Oh god that doesnt sound too safe lol. Wouldn't that be toxic to the fish as urine does contain other chemicals I'm sure, I'm no expert in urine but that seems a little too much.

Doesn't fish in cycle take longer than just pure ammonia?

generally it does but it really depends on the process of your cycle. Every cycle is different and I've seen fish in cycles that finish in 6 weeks and then a fishless take 8 or more. Just depends on how things go in your tank but generally they do take a bit longer but there are pros and cons for both.

 

[Borderlesscott]

Urine? Oh god that doesnt sound too safe lol. Wouldn't that be toxic to the fish as urine does contain other chemicals I'm sure, I'm no expert in urine but that seems a little too much.

Doesn't fish in cycle take longer than just pure ammonia?

Fish in cycle takes longer in nearly every case, I done a fishless cycle with ammonia in a 15 gallons in 13 days, there have been reports of quicker. I also only filled the tank 3 quarters full and let my filter really agitate the water surface and lights on for really long .

 

[Aquavic]

Fish in cycle takes longer in nearly every case, I done a fishless cycle with ammonia in a 15 gallons in 13 days, there have been reports of quicker. I also only filled the tank 3 quarters full and let my filter really agitate the water surface and lights on for really long .

That's what I'm doing currently. But my tank is full and use airstones to agitate the water. It's working so far. How long did you keep the lights on?

 

[Borderlesscott]

Kept the lights on for nearly 16 hours a day, longer when possible. I might have been done a few days earlier, but just wanted to make sure my levels stayed right for a few days. Had to do a massive water change to get my nitrates down, but in a 15g it's not much of a problem. Had fish in the tank by the 15th day, would never do fish in again - unless it's in a big tank, which I'd probably just seed with media from a set up tank - those water changes are a killer on a big tank when you can't use a python and have to make do with a 5g bucket.

 

[Caduceus]

Thanks for all the ideas guys

I must have read a similar article about peeing in the tank!! I don't think I'll be doing that!

The good news is I *may* be onto a source of ammonia - they say they can get it for me and I should be able to pick it up This Wednesday. Trouble is its not the usual pure 10% ammonia, its pure 47% ammonia. I guess I'll just be extra careful about inhaling the stuff and use about 1/5 the amounts recommended for the 10% stuff.

If this fails to come through, I'll give the gold fish food a go, and if that fails, try the shrimp.....if it all fails, hmmmmmm peeing in the tank.



Thanks again. I'll let you know how I go.

 

[librarygirl]

47% percent? For a 6 gal tank? lol Here's a fishless cycling ammonia calculator for how much to add: Calculator Good luck measuring that small of an amount.

For a tank that small you could just dose to 2 ppms instead of 4 but it's up to you. Your tank load will be limited in a tank that size anyway and 2 ppms of ammonia should be sufficient for the fish you can add, but either way would work.

 

[Caduceus]

I know this is going to sound strange, but this tank will never have any fish, or even plants in it.

I am away from home for work and I'm moving house every 5 - 10 weeks, so I can't be doing that with a tank full of fish.

Im really just doing this fishless cycle for practice. Because Im new to this Im just trying to get into the routine of testing the water and doing other bits and pieces involved with maintaining a tank.

I figure a fishless cycle on this little fella will be good practice for when I finally get home and get a reasonable sized tank. I'll know what to expect and hopefuly, how to deal with it.

Besides - I've got the aquarium bug - so doing anything is better than doing nothing

And if nothing else.....I'll have some good seed material for when I do my fishless cycle on my big tank - if only I can keep the bacteria alive for that long.

 

[Caduceus]

Just ran my numbers throguh the calculator.

For a 22litre tank, using 3ppm and 47% ammonia, I need to use 0.14mls

At least my ammonia costs won't send me broke!