It's another Fishless Cycle question!!

[Rare]

This was going to be a few questions, but as I started thinking I need to put as much info in here to give you an idea. I believe as everybody is waiting nitrite, my cames fast and so did my nitrAte. Tank will be use to house 5/6 cichlids. Filter & other crazy ideas are coming for them as well to give them the best. And PWC as well every week. I'm not even done with this and looking at 125g tanks already. lol!


My PH off the tap water is in the 8.8. Ammonia .25- , 0 Nitrite & 0 NitrAte. On day 7th I tested for KH (71.6) & GH (125.3) puts me in the 196.9 zone.

I have a 50g tank, started with Aqueon for the first few days, first PWC (read below) I went with Amquel & last PWC I found the TopFin Dechlorinator. Just wanted the right one for the cycle to read me the right test result..lol



Temps in the tank have been 84-85 for the frist few days with the use of a heater. Emperor 400 power filter. I took out the reused filter media and loaded it with bio balls. Just wanted to test things out it holds I believe 25 on it side they. They are stack together horizon 5 in each roll. (This was just to test it out)

A very some amount of pool sand and an egg crate for the rocks I want to put in later & why I haven’t filled with sand. 2 bubbles air stones as well.


On day 2, Ph went from 8.8 to 8.0. It has been stable at 8.0.

On day 3, of the fishless cycle, I over doses on ammonia and did a PWC and brought it back down to the 4/5+ppm.

On day 5, added a pinch of flake food pulverized.

Day 9: I dropped the temps to 82

On day 12th the ammonia started dropping to 2.0ppm and wanted to test for NitRite and must have flown right by me because I was at 5.0ppm I tested for NitrAte and was surprised to see I had nitrite as well. & it was at 5.0ppm as well.

Day 15th did a PWC of about 20g.


Fast forward today, 16th/ I was off the the first post intro by me by 3days, Im 16days into the cycle. This morning ammonia at 0.25 & brought it back to 3+ppm. Got home and tested it and it was all gone in 11hrs. The other tests are as

Ammonia @ 0ppm
Nitrite @ 5.0ppm
Nitrate @ 40/80ppm.

So questions are.

Do I do another water change?

If yes, why & how much?
The reason I did PWC was to bring down the Nitrite cause they were a glowing purple sort of..lol. And to bring down the NitRite down as well.

Or do I let it go through its cycle & wait for Nitrite to go down by them self?

Do I want to add the same amount of ammonia or keep it at 2ppm or lower since Nitrite are in big number. Can the Nitrite screw with the NitRate numbers?

All input are welcome!

Day 1 Building a stand for the tank, but love that its right next to the sink. lol


The ammonia im using



You can see some amount of pool sand I have all the way to the right.


Day 12 and first time Nitrite and NirAte show...I missed the show. I can only think is that I still had hig amont of ammonia even after I did the PWC.



Today test about 11hrs later after after adding 3ppm of ammonia.

 

[jlk]

For a little over 2wks into your cycle, things are doing very well!! For now as long as your ph stays stable, a wc is not necessary yet. If your nitrites persist in being very high for another week or your nitrates stop increasing or start decreasing, then its time for a big wc to drop your nitrites. High nitrites will stall a cycle but as your nitrates are steadily increasing, you havent hit a critical level yet. I would decrease your ammonia dose down to 1-2ppm until your nitrites are steadily dropping (obvious when you test). Once they are, then you can work on increasing your amm dose gradually back up to 4ppm over a few days. Once your tank is steadily zeroing amm/nitrite in 24hrs (not 12) from 4ppm, your done! Your off to a great start!

 

[Rare]

Good to know that that high Nitrite can stalled the cycle and if NitRate fall to do a big water change. Tks, jlk! The 11hrs test was just a friend wanted to see how fast the guys were eating. I check & dose every 24hrs. Will drop to 1ppm-2ppm.


Got some info for anyone that wants to take a look at it as ive been doing some homework & might help others. The temperature for optimum growth of nitrifying bacteria is between 77-86 We all know much.

The optimum pH range for "Nitrosomonas" is between 7.8-8.0. This is the reason I must have a high count and it was fast. As I'm at 8.0​

The optimum pH range for "Nitrobacter" (NitRate) is between 7.3-7.5. And why I am slow in this dept. lol! I could use ph down or I forget which plant to bring down the ph, but all is well here for now.​

Nitrobacter will grow more slowly at the high pH levels typical of marine aquaria and preferred by African Rift Lake Cichlids. Initial high nitrite concentrations may exist. At pH levels below 7.0, Nitrosomonas will grow more slowly and increases in ammonia may become evident. Nitrosomonas growth is inhibited at a pH of 6.5. All nitrification is inhibited if the pH drops to 6.0 or less. Care must be taken to monitor ammonia if the pH begins to drop close to 6.5.​

 

[jlk]

Dont worry about your ph unless it starts to fall. No need for chemicals other than water conditioner. Keep us posted!

 

[Rare]

The ph down was to bring a bit down ph for the Nitrobacter & a little phosphate added as well in. Hasn’t been added or anything. Numbers looks about the same and maybe a hair lite in the nitrite.

With all this time I have finally picked the 3 types of Mubuna fish going in.
I will keep an eye on for the saulois & see how he will do with his tank mates, but from reading they should be fine.

1.Cynotalapia, Jalo Reef
2.Labidochromis, Yellow Lab
3.Pseudotropeus, saulois


I finally bought driftwood that I liked online. I went yesterday looking for one here local but nothing in what I was looking for. I found one but it was way over priced. Should be here in about 5+daysI looked in my area for Texas Holey Rock but nothing & the ones that they were selling local in the Miami area of c.list were gone. pfffff So, will now buy on-line.

Further more I will be upgrading filters & a fluval fx5 or the Ehemin is on the list if it comes at the right price. (HINT HINT send PM if you have one for sale ) The ehemin pro3 was on at a local store with Discuss in the tank and it was silent. Very nice, not sure if FX is the same. The reason I'm going more for the FX is for mechanical filtration & would like to have a fresh water refugium do most of the bio work. Would like a nice setup with plants that dont need alot of light and everything else that goes with plant care. This will be to max the size of the water & keep nitRate down.

 

[Rare]

Did 65% water change in the tank. I was testing the pH & they were gone. Just Sat. 19th I tested the pH & they were at 8.0pph. They sure went through it fast. lol!

Believe it or not this is fun, I'm not stressing at all. Within them two days it did a number. Check also KH and well you know I don’t need to tell ya.

Texas Holey Rock is on its way & not soon enough. I will keep a close eye on the pH but will most likely just get crush coral to keep it buffer for now. I will test the water parameters in 30mins to see where I'm at after the water change

 

[jlk]

Sounds good! Yeah, that crashed pretty quickly- see if the water change helps buffer it back up.

 

[Rare]

First up is the low pH...I'm good.





Now wanted to check where in the pH scale i'm at right now. So, tested with the high pH.To the left its straight from the tap water 8.8ppm. To the right is what's in the tank now about 8.2ppm




Last is the Nitrite (5ppm) & NitRate. NitrAte went down to about 10ppm and could read it at last. This could be a mix of things here. When testing the first time for NitRate it was red so it could mean the high numbers of Nitrite were messing with the NitrAte numbers. Or this could me that the Nitrite might be falling down and now I have real numbers to the NitRate now. This also could mean I am now going backwards in the cycle...lol Welcome to the Rare's Express

 

[Rare]

KH test for the tank is weak with no buffer 1 drop=17.9

KH for Tap water when started was 4 drops=71.6 but now 3 drops= 53.7

Added 6 teaspoon of sodium bicarbonate and now I'm at 8 drops=143.2

Will now leave water out for 24hrs to test for real pH/

 

[Rare]

What's up guys....The the cycle is still not cycled but it's a labor of love

Some texas holey rocks came today. Our mailman was happy to know these werent 2 boxes of 65lb of lead (I go fishing in the keys) he was leaving this time...lol. One of the rock is raw and I will clean it up well & plus I will be making a bleach bath for these boys to make them white. The white after time will go away in the tank but for now it will be nice. Plus one of them is raw and still has small pockets of dirt, root...etc

Once done I can start adding the substrate. The dirftwood will be here sometime next week.

 

[Rare]

As the tank is doing its thing I get plenty of time for other work to be done.


Freshwater refugium. Fast growing plants will be going in with low night lvl. Also could be use for the fry tank.

Rocks getting a bleach bath



After a few hrs I pulled out the rocks. Plenty of soil in the little holes and roots... New water added but first..



After rocks were dry I did a little work to make some of the holes a tab bit bigger.Rocks will go back in the bleach bath & sun bleach in the morning. It will follow a super rinse & will saok again with a dechlorinator.



It's all done! lol~! I think I got some room for this

 

[Rare]

This morning nitrite looks to be 2ppm. Hard to tell from 2-5ppm but the color is not as dark as it was before.

I tested for nitrAte & I was in the 10-20ppmzone before & this morning I'm in the 80+ 160zone. I doesd to 1ppm before I left. I had no time this morning to do a PWC, but will do one when I get home. I will do a 30-40% PWC. Wait for an hr & test it to see where I am at. If needed I will do another 30% water change. Enough to bring the nitRate down. I believe in a few more days I will be done & cycled in.

Holey rocks are in the tank & will need a few more for the cichilds. I also bought "CaribSea Aragamax Select Aragonite." One section is pool filter sand and the other will be aragonite.

Still need to setup the refugium & will also add a big section of ceramic rings in there. Also, if it time is on my hand this weekend, I will start to build a basic stand for the 50.

Also, looking for a big big canister filter for the mechanical filtration & let the refugium handled the bio work.

I'm getting there & so far all is good!

 

[jlk]

Wow!!! Things are going quite well! Look forward to seeing how everything progresses! Thanks for the pics!

 

[Rare]

Got home & tested. NitRate were at 10-20ppm zone yesterday afternoon & now what it was in the morning pic below. I'm wondering if I mixed the Nitrite drops with the NiRate, but dont think I did. Glad I took the pics or I would have thought I I was seeing red since I didnt have the morning cup of java. Went ahead either ways & did the PWC, but all looks the same. Got the driftwood and love it! Just need a bigger tank, but think it still going in. Got it soaking in water with sodium bicarbonate & espom salts. Nice color is had this morning before I did the water change.

jlk/ others,
Caribsea aragamax select aragonite on the bag says, it's proven to reduces NitRate. As well as Nitrite and Ammonia. Is this correct? don't want to add this in if it somehow does do what it says & messing with the cycle or is it a sale pitch.


Before I left in the morning

 

[jlk]

The aragamax 'supposively' is full of live bacteria for a marine (sw) tank. This is why it claims to reduce ammonia, nitrite & nitrate. Sw is whole different ballpark than fw. If you add it and it actually has live sw bacteria, it will be killed off instantly because this is a fw tank. Not sure what millions of dead bacteria will do for your tank assuming this product actually has them.. Also keep in mind this substrate will make your ph very high (intended for sw tanks). If you want to use it, I would suggest rinsing it well.

Lots of nitrates is a good thing!!!!

 

[Rare]

That's what I thought about the nitrAte as well when I tested it in the morning. That afternoon when I tested the water again it gave me a different reading of 10-20ppm zone.

The reason I picked up this aragonite was the it has ideal substrate for marine, reef or african cichlids. Said pH should maintain a proper ph of 8.2. This will get the same cleaning the pool sand got...and cant be any worst than that..lol

 

[jlk]

Yes, it should keep your ph in the 8 range. I think I recall some members using this stuff in a fw tank straight from the bag but I honestly dont remember if it did anything (ie, make the water cloudy or cause a spike in toxins). I personally would rinse it well but hopefully someone who has used this stuff before will chime in!

 

[Rare]

Trust me I will rinse the heck out of it like I did the pool sand. After cleaning the pool sand I had no cloudy water when it went in the tank. I will just go ahead and cleaned it up now & just finshed this part of the tank. Dirftwood is still soaking and will be sometime before it goes in.

.

 

[Rare]

Just checking in-

Nitrite are still high. But when I add 1 drop they don't change to the deep dark purple color as fast when it hit the bottom. When I'm on the 3 drop of the 5 drops you see that deep purple color. After I shake it and wait 5 mins you can see it go through the scale of colors staring at 0.25ppmtill hits 5ppm. When before it just went straight to deep dark purple. Just something I noticed. Anyways still at 5+ppm on nitrite.

I tested the NiRate this morning & it was 0ppm. I knew that wasnt right. I did a 50% PWC and I see color now for Nitrate- a Red/Orange. These Nitrite are sure messing with my head.

I have been dosing to 1-2ppm.

 

[librarygirl]

So is the nitrite test above after you did the 50% water change? If so, nitrites are pretty high then. Is ammonia converting to 0 after 24 hours? You've had high nitrites for a couple of weeks now, right? The nitrite phase is the longest, lasts about 3 weeks on average so you might be close. It might not hurt to do another large water change (full if you can do one) to see if you can get nitrites to a readable level on the chart (<2) and then redose. No rush if you can't do it today, just something you might want to do as they seem pretty high. How is the PH holding up?