Okay - A Plethora of Issues With My 60 Gallon Goldfish Tank Since Last Post...

[jlk]

Yes, try to do as big of water change as possible. Your fine to add a low dose of predissolved salt (1 tbsp per 10g) gradually. As you probably havent purchased any meds yet, I would suggest to purchase a small container of activated carbon (cheaper than new filters) & place a cup full in a mesh bag or piece of pantyhose & run this for 2-3hrs (then throw it away) before starting the salt & new meds. Good luck!

 

[ArtesiaWells]

UPDATE:

We did a 50% water change just now, but the Chocolate Fantail in question has developed white spots on the tips of just about every fin, in addition to the now massive white and red sore on his anus, and his behavior is quickly deteriorating.

PLEASE ADVISE WHAT TO DO. What medicine should I be looking for at this point? I was going to get those Tetra "fizzing" release tablets that are supposed to take care of all parasites and bacteria, or the API drop tablets, but now I am not sure. Is this infection spreading -- is that why his fins are white now?

I don't honestly think the water changes are going to save him...

Anyone with any medicine recommendation please reply...thank you.

 

[jlk]

What do the white spots on the fins look like? Is it the same white stuff that is on the wound? Or does it look like sand is sprinkled on the fins?

 

[ArtesiaWells]

What do the white spots on the fins look like? Is it the same white stuff that is on the wound? Or does it look like sand is sprinkled on the fins?

I can't really tell, jlk -- my wife is attempting to snap some pictures now so I can upload them to show you. They don't look like Ich crystals nor are they really looking like the white area in the wound to me; they're just like soft-looking white "tips" on his tail edges...

I am thinking of looking into these remedies; please advise if you concur or not:

Kanamycin
Marycin/Marycin II (found in Petsmart; confirmed today when I went)
Jungle Fungus Clear Tablets (per your recommendation I believe)
Prazi Pro

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Attached are some general pictures of the fish in question; I am going to try and get some close ups of the problem areas...

The Chocolate/Gold colored goldie is the one with the horrible sore in the back -- it's difficult to get a shot of his behind directly because he's always on the move; in the second row, first pic, you can see the white infected area from the side a bit. We're trying to get more focused images...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Some more...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

As you can make out, as well, the Chocolate/Gold fantail is exhibiting a bit of popeye too...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Some more of the Oranda and Chocolate Fantail...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Here is a bit of a closeup of the "sore" on the side of the fantail -- hard to make out but you can see the red "ring" around the white...

The second pic is clearer...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Here is another attempted shot at the sore...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Here is a shot of "Oscar," the sick fantail, from head on...as you can see, we don't want to lose this personality of a fish!

I think you can make out some "popeye" here too...

 

[ArtesiaWells]

I am thinking of going out tomorrow and getting Maraycin or Maraycin II, or maybe API's "EM Erythromycin" but I don't know which one to use to treat this tank at this point...is the Maraycin good? Which one do we use, I or II?

 

[jlk]

Thank you for the pics! Your girls are very pretty!! Ok, I can't see any signs of ich or parasites. I can see bit of white edges on the chocolates fins. Mind you, I am looking at pics on my cell & pics are not quite the same as seeing something person.

The white edges may be fin rot starting to develop which is a bacterial infection. The wound does look quite nasty from what I can see. I can't tell if there's specifically fungus growing or not or if it's just infected. As I said earlier, fungus typically will look like tufts of white hair/strings growing.

So, this leaves us with deciding to treat for just a bacterial infection or combo of bacterial & fungus. There's a few ways to address this depending on what you have access to.

Kanamycin is an excellent antibiotic but it will likely have to be ordered online (go to National fish Pharmaceuticals site). It's a good med to have on hand. You can treat the tank & swab the sore with methylene blue. This would be my first choice.

The maracyn/maracyn 2 combo OR maracyn plus will address most general infections. You will still need to swab the wound with meth blue (which will address fungus).

Lastly, you can try the Jungle fungus meds which contains two milder antibiotics with anti fungal. If you can not pick your fish up, go this route but have one of the other options on hand in the event this doesn't work. I believe this treatment may only be a 4 day treatment (I may be wrong) so expect to treat for 7-8 days. Ok, figure out how you would like to approach this & get started
as soon as possible with course of treatment. I really hope for a full recovery & I wish you the best!!

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Thank you for the pics! Your girls are very pretty!!

Thank you so much!

Although, all this time we thought "Sunshine" (the Red Cap with the spots) was the "girl" and "Oscar" (the Chocolate Fantail) was the "guy"...

Ok, I can't see any signs of ich or parasites. I can see bit of white edges on the chocolates fins. Mind you, I am looking at pics on my cell & pics are not quite the same as seeing something person.

The white edges may be fin rot starting to develop which is a bacterial infection.

Yes; there doesn't seem to be any Ich particles on him/her or spots anywhere else...it's on the tips, which I feared was fin rot or a spread of bacterial infection...

The wound does look quite nasty from what I can see. I can't tell if there's specifically fungus growing or not or if it's just infected. As I said earlier, fungus typically will look like tufts of white hair/strings growing.

I know it's difficult to make out -- we had the HARDEST time trying to snap a pic while Oscar was in motion; these were the best we got...the area is inflamed back there and is now almost all white.

So, this leaves us with deciding to treat for just a bacterial infection or combo of bacterial & fungus. There's a few ways to address this depending on what you have access to.

Kanamycin is an excellent antibiotic but it will likely have to be ordered online (go to National fish Pharmaceuticals site). It's a good med to have on hand. You can treat the tank & swab the sore with methylene blue. This would be my first choice.

I don't think he has that much time left, honest jlk; I need to buy something we can pick up at the store, now...plus, I am still not comfortable "swabbing" this fish out of the water with the methylene blue...

The maracyn/maracyn 2 combo OR maracyn plus will address most general infections. You will still need to swab the wound with meth blue (which will address fungus).

They had both of these at my local Petsmart; which ones do I buy -- both? Both Maracyn AND Maracyn II if there is no Maracyn Plus? Are BOTH added to the tank? And these are TABLETS that are dropped in, yes?

What about the API EM ERYTHROMYCIN?

Lastly, you can try the Jungle fungus meds which contains two milder antibiotics with anti fungal. If you can not pick your fish up, go this route but have one of the other options on hand in the event this doesn't work. I believe this treatment may only be a 4 day treatment (I may be wrong) so expect to treat for 7-8 days. Ok, figure out how you would like to approach this & get started as soon as possible with course of treatment. I really hope for a full recovery & I wish you the best!!

Thanks for all your assistance and the kind words -- as for the Jungle meds, my local Petsmart didn't have any of it, so if I go with the other stuff, is there any possible way I can treat this WITHOUT having to pick the fish up to swab the sore?

 

[jlk]

Ok, then you can try treating under the assumption theres just a bacterial infection. See what you have available. Maracyn Plus (a liquid) would be my first choice. Dont confuse it with other Maracyn/Mardel products. Second, would be a combo of Maracyn/Maracyn2 (both meds). They can be safely used together & will address both gram positive & gram negative infections (packets of powder). Expect to have to do 2 courses of treatment with either option. The API erthromycin is the exact same active ingredient as Maracyn- this only addresses gram positive infections while generally the majority of fish infections are gram negative. Good luck!

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Ok, then you can try treating under the assumption theres just a bacterial infection. See what you have available. Maracyn Plus (a liquid) would be my first choice. Dont confuse it with other Maracyn/Mardel products. Second, would be a combo of Maracyn/Maracyn2 (both meds). They can be safely used together & will address both gram positive & gram negative infections (packets of powder). Expect to have to do 2 courses of treatment with either option. The API erthromycin is the exact same active ingredient as Maracyn- this only addresses gram positive infections while generally the majority of fish infections are gram negative. Good luck!

Okay, I will go for both the Maracyn & Maracyn II -- both of which I know our LFS has -- and begin that treatment as soon as I pick it up. I don't think the store had the PLUS but I will double check today.

Are these treatments as good as going with the melathane blue, or the Jungle stuff you originally recommended?

I just checked on the tanks, and he's not going good today -- refuses to eat anything that floats past him now and he has begun labored breathing...

With regard to the Maracyn being added via a powder, is this just dropped in?

 

[ArtesiaWells]

Also -- is it remotely possible (doubtful) that this is not some kind of infection but rather signs of spawning or "pregnancy" (I realize female fish drop eggs and males spray them, but I'm just asking...)?

 

[jlk]

Okay, I will go for both the Maracyn & Maracyn II -- both of which I know our LFS has -- and begin that treatment as soon as I pick it up. I don't think the store had the PLUS but I will double check today.

Are these treatments as good as going with the melathane blue, or the Jungle stuff you originally recommended?

I just checked on the tanks, and he's not going good today -- refuses to eat anything that floats past him now and he has begun labored breathing...

With regard to the Maracyn being added via a powder, is this just dropped in?

They are different types of treatments. As I said earlier, this is treatment for the 'assumption' theres just a bacterial infection. The meth blue treats fungus as does the Jungle meds. Theres an obvious injury that looks like its infected with either bacteria, fungus or both. His behavior indicates something else may be amiss as well. Healthy fish in a healthy tank typically do not start develop fin rot out of the blue because a strong immune system will fight off any bad bacteria. So, something is out of whack here.

You can mix the packets of maracyn & maracyn2 in a cup of tank water & add it directly to the tank in the filter outflow to make sure its evenly dispersed in the water column. This is important- make sure you test the water daily around the same time each day. Antibitoics do not discriminate between 'good' bacteria and 'bad' bacteria and your good bacteria may take a hit. The water has to be healthy for the meds to work. So, if you see any spikes, do a big wc then redose the meds. This way the meds will be active in the tank for a 24hr period of time between wcs.

 

[ArtesiaWells]

They are different types of treatments. As I said earlier, this is treatment for the 'assumption' theres just a bacterial infection. The meth blue treats fungus as does the Jungle meds. Theres an obvious injury that looks like its infected with either bacteria, fungus or both. His behavior indicates something else may be amiss as well. Healthy fish in a healthy tank typically do not start develop fin rot out of the blue because a strong immune system will fight off any bad bacteria. So, something is out of whack here.

The Maracyn and Maracyn II won't treat or attack fungus as well? They seem like pretty powerful antibiotics...

You can mix the packets of maracyn & maracyn2 in a cup of tank water & add it directly to the tank in the filter outflow to make sure its evenly dispersed in the water column.

I can't just add it to the tank by dropping it directly in? Also, do you know the dosing amount for these medications based on tank size? How much would a 60 gallon need?

This is important- make sure you test the water daily around the same time each day. Antibitoics do not discriminate between 'good' bacteria and 'bad' bacteria and your good bacteria may take a hit. The water has to be healthy for the meds to work. So, if you see any spikes, do a big wc then redose the meds. This way the meds will be active in the tank for a 24hr period of time between wcs.

Oh no...more big water changes WHILE medicating...

 

[jlk]

Antibiotics do not treat fungus. Antibiotics treat bacterial infections. Fungus is a different creature altogether. The meds have fairly clear instructions (with the exception of wcs)- I have not personally used either in quite awhile but I believe the dose is 1 packet per 20g (of each med). I believe you may need to double dose the initial dose & then follow the 1 packet per 20g for the duration of treatment. Read the instructions. You can add it directly to the tank if you want.