Okay...I Have HAD It With Water Changes...

[Osage_Winter]

Alright, folks...as I have been promising, I performed a good water change tonight -- actually, it was my wife who figured out how to use the stupid Top Fin gravel vac to make it suction the water...I'll get to that, but right now, because MORE of our home and carpets are soaked with water, and for a plethora of additional reasons, I'm really steamed right now, and it looks as though I am going back to my original sentiment of giving up on this hobby...

Okay. So, I watched a YouTube video that featured some hoochie-looking chick demonstrating how to use a gravel vac -- I tried to get some fast pointers on using these things once again, because I couldn't find the threads and posts from members here regarding detailed instructions (they were some old posts and threads, and I simply couldn't locate them)...

At any rate, after struggling to get any water up and through the Top Fin vac, no matter HOW MANY TIMES I pushed the stupid tube into the water, shook it, did the jerk motion, it did not suck the water up. My wife got up and helped me, and I don't know what she did, but suddenly the water started to pump into our bucket, and continued to flow freely, allowing us to do a good 30% change; in the midst, we sucked up some gunk from the gravel, too, but that just lead to bigger problems...

I added the Prime BEFORE putting fresh water back in, as suggested to me -- but I forgot to shut off the filters before doing the change, and as the water level dropped, the Aqueon filter made weird noises and eventually shut off. I realized it was because the water was so low in the tank, so I quickly pulled the plugs from both filters. Now, if that wasn't bad enough, I had to re-prime the AquaClear with tank water (what a PAIN) and all the while, water is being splashed all over the place as the filters started up again. Meanwhile, during the trips from the room our tank is in to the bathroom where the tub is carrying the bucket, a massive splash (my fault) of tank water cascaded out of the bucket and all over me, my feet and the expensive carpeting that was outside the bathtub. It's just disgusting, and now everything is SOAKED.

But you know what bugs me more than any of this? The fact that all the pushing and turbulence caused by the gravel vac, and the removal and subsequent addition of water, the plants, gravel and ornaments that were previously in PERFECT place in the tank are now messed up, de-rooted and the gravel has "dips" in it due to the cleaning, where previously, it was smooth and even. I can't STAND this; it's like every time you do maintenance, the whole aquascaping gets messed up -- even my bubble wands have sprung leaks somewhere, since turning them off and the new water hitting them, and now there are like sections of the wands not producing bubbles. This is just utterly ridiculous; on top of that, the evaporated water from the tank has caused disgusting crusty crud to form on the glass center brace and glass versa-tops, some of which was nearly IMPOSSIBLE to remove, even with glass cleaner (when the tops were off the tank, of course)...

Oh -- and I DID try to wipe the diatoms off with my fingers while doing this water change, and they WILL NOT come off. At all.

At this point, folks, I think I give up. People are telling me this is something that MUST get done on a WEEKLY or even DAILY basis with goldfish? There's NO WAY I can go through what we just went through on a weekly basis, ABSOLUTELY FORGET ABOUT on a daily basis. I understand this hobby takes some dedication, but this I'm just not cut out for, nor can I apply the dedication necessary due to my work schedule and other things. I simply cannot do CONSTANT water changes like this; our house is becoming a mess because of it, and I am not disrupting the tank like I just did every time we have to do one. NOTHING is in the position it was in the tank before the change...

Here's one more thing, which is really like a question -- how often would I have to replace the stupid carbon cartridges in the Aqueon filter? How do I know when they're loaded and need replacing? And, can I rinse these things off instead of replacing them every time they're dirty? The BB doesn't grow on these, do they? Just on the cheap plastic "bio grid" these filters come with, right?

 

[Gus]

I suck on the hose instead of doing the up and down motion. Maybe fish keeping isn't for you? I have all my tanks really close to the kitchen sink to avoid the wet carpet problem.

I turn off the filters and the heater before doing any water change. Also, to get the filters going, I fill them up with a cup with water from the tank and then switch them back on.

Good luck!

 

[Osage_Winter]

Maybe fish keeping isn't for you?

Well, if it is going to destroy my new house and upset the entire layout of the tank each and every time, then it's CERTAINLY not for me...

I have all my tanks really close to the kitchen sink to avoid the wet carpet problem.

That's simply not possible in our setup, and where we decided to put a tank.

I turn off the filters and the heater before doing any water change. Also, to get the filters going, I fill them up with a cup with water from the tank and then switch them back on.

I did that with the AquaClear -- that is, I added a vasefull of water from the tank to prime it and start working again, but it's just a ridiculous process to me (my Aqueon is an auto-start filter because the pump is submerged in the water).

 

[taylorodw]

It does get easier, and if you really think the gravel vac is not for you (since it sounds like that's where your problems started) you could try a python.

 

[Mark Hewitt]

I still don't know why water changes are such a problem for you?!

I just put one end of the gravel vac in the water then other end in the bucket, give the end a sharp suck (no more than half a second), the water starts flowing. Leave a couple of minutes the bucket is full, take the syphon out.

Then get the water to the right temperature at the tap, fill the bucket back up again, put the dechor in, then carry it over to the tank and use a jug to pour back in again, it's all very straightforward and takes me no more than 10 minutes to do 3 buckets worth. Including testing the ammonia and nitrite in the 2 minutes while the buckets are filling!

Are you sucking on the end of the gravel vac? Mine is supposed to start working by jiggling up and down but it never does!

 

[Mark Hewitt]

I turn off the filters and the heater before doing any water change. Also, to get the filters going, I fill them up with a cup with water from the tank and then switch them back on.

Good luck!

I don't usually turn the heaters off before a water change, although I know I should in case there is a failure which could well ruin my day! I'm looking to change to an external heater anyway.

I have an external filter with an intake well below normal water change level so that can stay on, although the outflow from the spray bar can be annoying!

 

[Vircomore]

Just thought I'd add to this since I've had experience with these "self-starting" siphons.

If you're not interested in sucking on the tube every time you do a water change - here's how you can start a gravel vac without it:

1. Put the vac into the tank until the entire "fat part" is filled with water.

2. Put your finger over the drainage end of the tubing.

3. Bring the "fat part" out of the water like it was a waterglass, trying to keep as much water in as possible.

4. Using your finger as a "stop/start" - cover/uncover the drainage end until you let the tubing fill almost all the way with water.

5. Sink the "fat part" back into the tank (again like a cup so that it fills up with water)

6. Put your drainage end into the bucket, and let your finger off.

 

[iDream]

for the gravel vac you have i'm pretty sure i have too, try shoving it into the water and pulling up quick, theres a flap that lets air out but when you pull up it closes and thats what cause the suction, idk sometimes it just takes a bit.

also maybe consider getting buckets with lids? it saves a alot of spilled water for me personally, and for the diatoms get an algae scraper (glorified razor blade on a stick) and scrape them off that way.

as for the aquascape, just move it back in place with a hand or a net. trust me once you get it all down its like clockwork

 

[BigJim]

+1 for Vircomore's method. I have one of those self-starting siphons and I hate starting it with the jerk method. It scares the fish, moves things around, and often splashes.

+1 for getting a python. I used to think pythons were way too expensive. I got one as a door prize at an LFS and I'm hooked now. It used to take me 30 minutes to do a water change on my 29g, 20L, and 5g. Siphon water into a bucket, drag the bucket to the bathtub, slop water on the floor, leave a mess in the tub, etc. Now I can do a PWC on my 29g, 20L, 20H, 40B, and 5g in 30 minutes and that's letting gravity drain the tank, not using water-powered suction. No water slopped on the floor, no endless hauling of buckets. If I broke my python, I'd be fixing it immediately. It makes weekly PWCs much easier than the siphon and a bucket.

In the meantime, pour your water into a pan or bowl and let it overflow gently into the tank. I use the fish guard on my python and aim the water onto a rock or the side of the tank to prevent the water from disturbing the sand.

Unfortunately, priming HOB filters is just part of the maintenance. I have four ACs running and I have to prime all four every PWC. I use one of those betta cups. One cupful for the AC30, two or three for the AC50, three to four for the AC70, and five to six for the AC110. It's just part of my regular maintenance routine now.

You have to remember that an aquarium is an attempt to emulate nature. Things are constantly moving and changing in nature. Be flexible and relaxed and you'll start enjoying the hobby a lot more.

Try vinegar on the glass tops. It sounds like you've got mineral build-up on your glass. The vinegar will dissolve these minerals.

As for your carbon, don't replace it unless you're trying to remove medication or tannins from the water. You can leave it in the filter as biomedia or remove it. Beneficial bacteria will grow on just about any submerged surface, including carbon. If you want to clean the filter media, just rapidly and repeatedly dunk it in a bucket of old tank water. I've been using the same sponge and biomedia in two of my ACs for more than a year and this is how I clean them.

 

[reefdiver]

Maybe there is someone in this forum that lives near you and would like to help. I know I would like to help if I could.

 

[BigJim]

Good call reefdiver. Osage_Winter, where are you located?

 

[Floyd R Turbo]

The Python is the answer to all of your problems. I know that I and many others have told you this before. I know that you said you don't want a hose running all over your house. So which is worse, having a hose running from your tank to your toilet, then from your sink to your tank - once a week - or lugging 5g buckets around and risking a dump like you had, then having to either soak it up with paper towels/rags or digging out a carpet cleaner to suck it out?

For you, I extremely very much mega highly suggest that you go invest in a Python. You will thank me and everyone else who has suggested it. Just get one. Please. Trust us.

As for floating fake plants and mixed up gravel, that's just the way it is. Fake plastic plants float and there's nothing you can do about it, they're going to get stirred up if you do a deep gravel vac. If you just vac around the plants, and just hit the top 1", you may not disturb them too badly. You should still do a deep vac once a month.

As for bumpy gravel - smooth it out with the big end of the vac after you're done. It will take you less than 30 seconds.

 

[360º]

lol

you fill the gravel vac, lift it so the water starts to flow through the tube.

once it starts flowing down the tube put the vac part back in the water, and it'll magically suck

 

[mellowyellow]

I use the plain suction gravel cleaner. After clamping the tube from the gravel cleaner onto my 5 gal. bucket I kink the line with one hand and hold it tight, dip the suctioning end in the tank getting some water in it then I hold it up in the air and watch while the air bubbles travel up and out. Then I dip it in the tank, let go of the kink, and about 95% of the time the water starts flowing into the bucket. Using this manual method IMO gives a person control of the suction. Just be sure to watch the bucket because it fills up fast.

I also have my aquarium in the living room on my carpet. I just lay a towel in front of the aquarium stand and it catches the water. I'm shortly, probably after the holidays, going to upgrade to a 50 gal. And, I'm really looking forward to it.

I'd hate to see you lose all interest in keeping fish. Because, once you get the hang of it, it's a really satisfying hobby and I think a fish tank is a wonderful and beautiful addition to anyone's home. I hope I see you on AA again.

 

[Osage_Winter]

Thank you, everyone, for all your replies -- they're truly appreciated.

I will reply to all of you individually, to address each response, in a little bit...

Thank you again, sincerely.

 

[adeebm]

+1 for the python. I can't imagine PWCs on my 46g without it. Just shut off filters, drain, add prime and fill. Put the hose against the glass when you fill so you don't mess up the gravel and plants. I do have to add water back into my aquaclear to get it started, so I keep a cup handy.

--Adeeb

 

[Osage_Winter]

It does get easier, and if you really think the gravel vac is not for you (since it sounds like that's where your problems started) you could try a python.

I simply cannot run a python based on tank location.

 

[Osage_Winter]

I still don't know why water changes are such a problem for you?!

Well, that makes two of us.

I just put one end of the gravel vac in the water then other end in the bucket, give the end a sharp suck (no more than half a second), the water starts flowing. Leave a couple of minutes the bucket is full, take the syphon out.

I didn't do the suck method this last time -- we tried pumping the vac up and down and up and down countless times, but could not get the water flowing. I don't know what my wife did, but it suddenly started pumping after awhile...

Then get the water to the right temperature at the tap, fill the bucket back up again, put the dechor in, then carry it over to the tank and use a jug to pour back in again, it's all very straightforward and takes me no more than 10 minutes to do 3 buckets worth. Including testing the ammonia and nitrite in the 2 minutes while the buckets are filling!

Don't pour the water back in using the bucket with spout? That seemed to be where I wrecked the aquascaping -- the power from the bucket's spout as new water came in. You're suggesting use a jug?

Are you sucking on the end of the gravel vac? Mine is supposed to start working by jiggling up and down but it never does!

Right -- the instructions for my Top Fin brand vac claims you have to pump it up and down and crash it against the gravel for it to start working, but it NEVER has doing it that way. We didn't do the sucking method this last time.

 

[Osage_Winter]

Just thought I'd add to this since I've had experience with these "self-starting" siphons.

If you're not interested in sucking on the tube every time you do a water change - here's how you can start a gravel vac without it:

1. Put the vac into the tank until the entire "fat part" is filled with water.

Do you mean the end with the "vac head" attachment on? And fill that whole tube up?

2. Put your finger over the drainage end of the tubing.

3. Bring the "fat part" out of the water like it was a waterglass, trying to keep as much water in as possible.

4. Using your finger as a "stop/start" - cover/uncover the drainage end until you let the tubing fill almost all the way with water.

5. Sink the "fat part" back into the tank (again like a cup so that it fills up with water)

6. Put your drainage end into the bucket, and let your finger off.

It sounds awfully suspicious like what we attempted last night, but maybe I will try that.

 

[Osage_Winter]

for the gravel vac you have i'm pretty sure i have too, try shoving it into the water and pulling up quick, theres a flap that lets air out but when you pull up it closes and thats what cause the suction, idk sometimes it just takes a bit.

Honestly, I'm exhausted with this Top Fin POS...

also maybe consider getting buckets with lids? it saves a alot of spilled water for me personally, and for the diatoms get an algae scraper (glorified razor blade on a stick) and scrape them off that way.

If the diatoms weren't coming off with my fingers rubbing vigorously, would the algae scraper get em off?

as for the aquascape, just move it back in place with a hand or a net. trust me once you get it all down its like clockwork

This has been the biggest hardship for me -- after all the planning we did for creating a certain look for this tank, regardless that it's not planted, now everything has been moved out of place, the bubble wands aren't working right and plants are not leaning the way they were. I can't stand knowing that this is going to happen every time we do a change.