I have a 20 gallon hexagon with a few Angelfish in it. I have had the tank set up since last June and the fish are doing fine. I have been having a few problems with the water tho. For some reason it won't hold the PH or alkalinity. I have been told something in the tank it causing it to loose its buffering ability. Right now my alkalinity is as low as it can go and my PH is at 6.0 I let the water from my tap sit out all night and while the PH is still very low the alkalinity in the water is right where it should be. So the PH is easy enough to fix but once I fix it and put it in the tank with in 2 days it is back down to 6.0 maybe even a tad lower. Here is a list of things that I have in my tank. Heater(marineland), airstone, fake plants (fairly new) and gravel. OHH I just thought of another issue. When I change the water(not even half) a few hours later the tank becomes VERY cloudy and will stay that way for several days. So a few days ago when I changed the water I made a point of not cleaning the rocks. I was thinking that maybe last time I took out way to much good bacteria. Well low and behold it got all cloudy again on me. I am really at my wits end. The guy from the local aquarium pet shop said to bring in my water from tap and tank and he will test them for me. Does anyone have ANY advice for me. Thanks.
PH / Alkalinity
- Thread starter EmmsL
- Start date
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bs6749
Aquarium Advice Addict
Welcome to AA!
First, why are you worried about your pH in your tank? Angels in their native environment are in soft, acidic water and having a pH of 6.0 is actually beneficial as it causes ammonia (among other things) to be less toxic. Also an acidc pH has antibacterial properties and this makes probability that your fish have a bacterial infection much less. I'd leave the pH right where it is, it's actually right where it needs to be in my opinion.
As for the buffering, what is the pH of the water out of your tap? The only reason you would want buffering in the water is to prevent pH swings in your aquarium which could indirectly cause the death of your fish. An example would be if your tank had a high concentration of non-toxic (or far less toxic) ammonium ion in an acidic environment and then you added a large amount of water with an alkaline pH. If there is no buffer present your water is going to shift from acidic to alkaline conditions and a good amount of non-toxic ammonium ion will be converted into toxic ammonia. That's why I say a pH swing can indirectly cause the death of your fish. This is a common occurence in old, extablished tanks that have not had a large water change done in months.
First, why are you worried about your pH in your tank? Angels in their native environment are in soft, acidic water and having a pH of 6.0 is actually beneficial as it causes ammonia (among other things) to be less toxic. Also an acidc pH has antibacterial properties and this makes probability that your fish have a bacterial infection much less. I'd leave the pH right where it is, it's actually right where it needs to be in my opinion.
As for the buffering, what is the pH of the water out of your tap? The only reason you would want buffering in the water is to prevent pH swings in your aquarium which could indirectly cause the death of your fish. An example would be if your tank had a high concentration of non-toxic (or far less toxic) ammonium ion in an acidic environment and then you added a large amount of water with an alkaline pH. If there is no buffer present your water is going to shift from acidic to alkaline conditions and a good amount of non-toxic ammonium ion will be converted into toxic ammonia. That's why I say a pH swing can indirectly cause the death of your fish. This is a common occurence in old, extablished tanks that have not had a large water change done in months.
Well the buffering is my main concern. I worry about the ph not staying stable and fluctuating when I do water changes.
I wanted to add some info.
Thanks for the help. I THINK I may have found the problem. I was looking in the tank trying to figure out what might be the problem and I saw an old small metal bracket that must have fallen off of a fry "nursery" I was using a while back. Oh the only chemicals that I use in the tank are Stress Zyme or Eco Start and Stress Coat.
THe reading in my tank is this.
NO2=20
NO3= 0
PH=6.0
KH=0
GH=0
In my tap water left out over night is this.
NO2=0
NO3=0
PH=6.0
KH=40-80
GH=30-60
Thanks for the help.
I wanted to add some info.
Thanks for the help. I THINK I may have found the problem. I was looking in the tank trying to figure out what might be the problem and I saw an old small metal bracket that must have fallen off of a fry "nursery" I was using a while back. Oh the only chemicals that I use in the tank are Stress Zyme or Eco Start and Stress Coat.
THe reading in my tank is this.
NO2=20
NO3= 0
PH=6.0
KH=0
GH=0
In my tap water left out over night is this.
NO2=0
NO3=0
PH=6.0
KH=40-80
GH=30-60
Thanks for the help.
bs6749
Aquarium Advice Addict
For the most part, Stress Coat, Stress Zyme don't need to be added to the tank. I never use them in my tanks. What you will want to use will be a dechlorinator to remove chlorines/chloramines, and neutralize heavy metals as well as ammonia, nitrites, and nitrates. This locks up the nitrogen compounds so that they aren't harmful to fish and allows the nitrifying bacteria time to consume them.
You say you have 20ppm of nitrites in your tank, do you have any ammonia? Is this tank still cycling? You shouldn't have ANY nitites in your tank and I strongly suggest you do a 90% water change after reading this.
Also, you GH isn't going to decrease from your tap to your tank unless you are adding purified water or water with a lower concentration of GH ions than your tap has. If anything your tank should have a HIGHER GH than your tap because of water evaporating out of the tank and you replacing it with more water. The ions won't evaporate out and remaine in the tank, thus increasing the GH level. I suspect a faulty test kit or an improper use of the kit is to blame.
Something also isn't right with your tank numbers. You should have some KH just from atmospheric CO2 dissoving into the water. Unless you boiled the tap water when aging it I suspect the actual level of the tank KH to be much closer to the value of that out of the tap.
My tank has been set up since last June. So it has already cycled. I also don't have any ammonia in it. I am using the API test strips right now and I just bought them. Is it better to use the the strips for testing or the Chemicals? I sure hope they are bad and it isn't my tank. The fish look fine and healthy. The only confusing part is the fact that I have a smaller tank with a catfish in it and the strips read his tank just fine. the Ph is a little low but ok and the alkalinity is reading normal. So who knows!!! Thanks for the help.
bs6749
Aquarium Advice Addict
The test strips are for "general reference" and the liquid kits are more precise.
jim692
Aquarium Advice Freak
I use the API freshwater master test kit (liquid reagent). Does pH, NH3, NO2, and NO3. There is a separate kit for KH and GH. I feel it reads better and is more accurate than the strips.
Dano01
Aquarium Advice Regular
bs6749 is correct in stating that something is wrong in your ph and KH readings and that test strips are inaccurate junk......Stop using Stresszime, ECOstart, and Stresscoat.......These "snake oil" products may be causing the test readings to be faulty.......If the tank is in fact cycled and the fish are healthy, you should not mess with the ph unless it gets extreme in either direction. The fish will show stress if they are unhappy with the water......Good tank maintenance will keep them healthy and happy.
Well I took a sample of my tank water and my tap water in to the local aquarium store to be tested. The water was that messed up. It wasn't my strips afterall. He gave me some crushed coral to put in the back of my filter and wow what a difference it made. My Ph is a tad higher. 6.4 and the KH is now reading around 40. Wow what a difference. I am going to keep an eye on the PH because I don't want the PH to get high. The fish seem to be doing great and the readings are close to where they use to be for months.
Floyd R Turbo
Aquarium Advice Addict
I use API Stress Coat +, which says it does the detox, is there something else I should use to detox my tap water?
Here's my latest tank: 55g fresh w/1tsp salt/gal, 30 community, lots of plants (need more light), UGF w/power heads, well maintained/cleaned, started 1/1/9 jump cycled and stable for a month.
Incidentally, our tap water is nasty right now, supposedly due to ice melt runoff. I use the API master test kit. Here's our tap water right now:
pH : off scale - > 8.8
Ammonia: 0.5 ppm (toxic @ ph)
Nitrite 0 ppm
Nitrate 5 ppm
KH 4 (71.6 ppm)
GH 0
This is softened water...
My tank water currently is
pH 7
Ammonia/Nitrite 0 ppm
Nitrate 10-15 ppm
KH 3
GH 7
It started around 7.5 and was down to 7 by the third week. Hovers around 7 since then. Whatever water I add during water changes seems to have little impact on the tank pH. Should I even worry about the chemistry at this point? I've never really paid attention to it in the past, but now that I see how bad our city water is I'm worried, mainly about making water changes with such nasty water. It's seriously nasty I tell ya and high in chlorine too. LFS says it usually is around 9 year round.
bs6749
Aquarium Advice Addict
I'd use some RO/distilled water from the store. You should be able to pick up 10 gallons of distilled water at Walmart or something like that where you can refill your own water by the gallon. It may only be $.30 per gallon. Adding 10 to the 55g would help reduce the pH some. I wouldn't worry about the pH too much though.
Use Prime instead of the Stress Coat to neutralize ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, heavey metals, and chlorines/chloramines. A 500mL bottle will last you years and it's about $10. Well worth the price and it does a great job. Many hobbyists use it and recommend it over other similar products.
Use Prime instead of the Stress Coat to neutralize ammonia, nitrites, nitrates, heavey metals, and chlorines/chloramines. A 500mL bottle will last you years and it's about $10. Well worth the price and it does a great job. Many hobbyists use it and recommend it over other similar products.
Floyd R Turbo
Aquarium Advice Addict
Thanks - I thought Prime was the same thing.
The tank pH doesn't seem to be the problem, it seems to be staying pretty stable. It's the tap pH that bugs me, because I have to keep my water changes small so as to not throw it off.
Another thing, does GH mean anything really? I found it curious that the GH of the tap water was 0 or 1 (1 drop did it) but the tank GH is 7. It looks like my KH is relatively low, so I would probably need more frequent water changes to keep the buffer stable. Yet I can't do much more than 10% a day due to the pH difference. I suppose I could increase the water change % over time, but then I run the risk of using too much bad tap water, at least until the runoff works it's way through the water table. Although, if the Prime does a good enough job, I may not have to worry. Am I just too darn worried, is that it?
The tank pH doesn't seem to be the problem, it seems to be staying pretty stable. It's the tap pH that bugs me, because I have to keep my water changes small so as to not throw it off.
Another thing, does GH mean anything really? I found it curious that the GH of the tap water was 0 or 1 (1 drop did it) but the tank GH is 7. It looks like my KH is relatively low, so I would probably need more frequent water changes to keep the buffer stable. Yet I can't do much more than 10% a day due to the pH difference. I suppose I could increase the water change % over time, but then I run the risk of using too much bad tap water, at least until the runoff works it's way through the water table. Although, if the Prime does a good enough job, I may not have to worry. Am I just too darn worried, is that it?
If I were you I would just relax. If the fish look fine I'd leave it alone.
It does make me nervous having a low KH though. You can make a permanent sort of buffer with various substrate materials. Crushed coral gravel works (sharp though if you have burrowing fish). So does limestone or crushed oyster shells added to the filter.
GH, General Hardness, is a measure of the dissolved calcium and magnesium ions in your water. The difference between your tap and tank means that something in your substrate is (very slightly) soluble. Very few fish care one way or the other. Some plants require those nutrients in larger amounts. Snails, crayfish and shrimp need some for their shells, so if you keep any of those it's a plus. If not it's pretty much irrelevant. High numbers affect osmoregulation and could be harmful, but 7 is nowhere close to that.
It does make me nervous having a low KH though. You can make a permanent sort of buffer with various substrate materials. Crushed coral gravel works (sharp though if you have burrowing fish). So does limestone or crushed oyster shells added to the filter.
GH, General Hardness, is a measure of the dissolved calcium and magnesium ions in your water. The difference between your tap and tank means that something in your substrate is (very slightly) soluble. Very few fish care one way or the other. Some plants require those nutrients in larger amounts. Snails, crayfish and shrimp need some for their shells, so if you keep any of those it's a plus. If not it's pretty much irrelevant. High numbers affect osmoregulation and could be harmful, but 7 is nowhere close to that.
