Sick Goldfish... please help!

[alexsproul09]

Hello,
My goldfish is in a 16 gallon tank. He is about 2 inches long. He developed small brown spots around his mouth, eyes, and his back (towards his head). I did a water test and everything came back okay. He would just sit very still in the water ... not moving very much at all. I went to PetSmart and was given "Tetra Lifeguard all-in-one-treatment". I put the tablets in the water and my fish a few hours later is now swimming very strange. He now will sometimes swim vertically.... then he floats upside down, falls to the bottom of the aquarium... and then swims up to the top of the water. He does this a few times and then stops ... again just sitting at the top of the tank. I noticed when he was upside down he has small red spots around his under-gills and around his mouth/chin area. Please help... I don't want to lose my goldfish!!!! ANY help would be appreciated!!!

 

[jlk]

Welcome to AA!! Ok, lets start with a few basics. What are you using to test your water (liquid or strips)? What are your exact numbers for ammonia, nitrite, nitrate & ph? How long has your tank been setup? Do you have a good water conditioner? Some more info will help us to help you better!

 

[alexsproul09]

Thank you for your reply! I actually took a picture of my fish into my local PetSmart and the specialist identified the problem as ammonia burn I am a little confused b/c I have been keeping my ammonia under control for a good month and a half now. Before that, I was unaware I needed to check Ammonia levels in my tank. I hope I didn't permanently hurt my fish!! I re-checked Nitrite/nitrate this morning -- both were 0 (I used the liquid test). My pH is always lower than I want it to be... lower than 6.5. I don't understand b/c I add API pH Proper but it doesn't maintain the ph... any ideas? Also, this fish has been in the tank over 6 months.

I also added aquarium salt per its suggested amounts to my tank (first time ever using it in my tank). The fishie is still pretty slow moving -- spending a lot of time in the lower part of the tank sitting in rocks but he has swam around a little bit today. I fed him goldfish crisps and a pea and he ate all the food.

I use dechloronizer for my tap water and use a chemical that removes the nitrite/nitrate from my tap water as well. I add "biological" stimulus chemical to my tank weekly. I do 20% water changes weekly. New carbon filter monthly.

What does the prognosis look like for my little buddy? Do most fish survive this "ammonia burn"?? The lady at petsmart said he may just be showing signs of the high ammonia later than other fish.

Again, THANK YOU for your help!!!!

 

[alexsproul09]

I've attached a few pictures of the fish. I showed more to the lady at PetSmart but wasn't able to upload them all. Hope this helps a little. THANK YOU!

 

[jlk]

Thanks! Ok, some more questions! Do you know what your ammonia level is? What are the names of the chemicals you are using specifically (dechlor, nitrite remover, bacteria product)? We can address the ph issue once we are sure your tank is stable. Zero nitrates makes me suspicious that your tank is not properly cycled and you have ammonia present.

For now, I want you to do a 50% water change with temperature matched, properly conditioned water. No more salt- this is not helping matters and simply is not necessary. Wait an hour after the water change and retest your amm/nitrite/nitrate and please post your results. Also test your tap water and post these as well.

In the future, changing your filter media is not necessary. Simply swish it once a week in some used tank water from a water change. When it literally starts to fall apart, stick some new media in behind the old media for a couple of weeks to help seed the new filter media. I suspect you may be throwing your tank back into a cycle on a regular basis by constantly tossing your media and this may be a factor in seeing ammonia burns right now even though the tank has been running for 6 months.

 

[alexsproul09]

Thank you I will do this right away in the morning and post the information!!

What does the prognosis look like?? Should I have high hopes?

Also, I use the preassembled carbon filters so there is no room in my filter to places new one and keep the old one...

 

[jlk]

He appears to be unwell from his water. Addressing water quality issues will be the first step for his recovery. Ammonia burns heal with nothing special other than time and healthy water. No worries!

 

[alexsproul09]

Ammonia Remover: I used to use "Top Fin Ammonia Remover" but a PetSmart associate informed me it does not remove nitrate, so I switched to "Kordon AmQuel Plus Ammonia Detoxifier" that removes nitrate, nitrite, ammonia, chlorine, and chloramines.

Tap Water Conditioner: API Tap Water Conditioner (removes chlorine, chloramines, and detoxifies heavy metals.

Biological Supplement: Nutrafin Cycle Biological Aquarium Supplement

I test my water with API 5-in-1 test strips (pH, NO2, NO3, KH, GH). Ammonia is tested with API NH3/NH4 water kit (not a strip). I test weekly.

-----
I did a 50% water change as your recommended.
-TAP WATER test results:
GH: 180
KH: 80
pH: <6
NO2: 0
NO3: 0 - 20 (very hard to pick what color it was).
Ammonia: 1.0 ppm (mg/L)

**I used Tap Water Conditioner, Ammonia Remover (Kordon), Nutrafin, and added aquarium salt per the recommended dosage. Before adding the tap water to the aquarium I re-tested the ammonia and the level was: 0ppm.

-ONE HOUR AFTER H2O CHANGE test results:
GH: 180
KH: 80
pH: 6.0 (or slightly less, hard to tell)
NO2: 0
NO3: 20, possibly slightly more
Ammonia: 0

This morning he is laying in the rocks not moving around too much -- moving his mouth though. I am hopeful we can figure this out together! (I also have a bubbler in my tank buried in the rocks, if that makes a difference). To me, it looks like maybe his face is turning a little darker, too....

 

[alexsproul09]

I have an Aqueon Quiet Flow filter on my tank. I use the pre-packaged carbon filters. So, you're telling me when I switch a new one in I should rinse the NEW filter with the old fish tank water I am taking out? I typically do not change the filter and do a water change on the same day -- I usually like a 2-3 day difference. Is this an adequate filter for my 16 gallon tank?

P.S. My tank has been set up for 5+ years... this fish has just been in for about 6 months.

 

[jlk]

Thank you! Your numbers look good except for the ph. Normally ph isnt a concern but yours is quite low, especially for goldfish and this may be further complicating things. And skip the salt (if I didnt already mention this).

Do you have a decent lfs near you? Check to see if they have a small bag of crushed coral or aragonite. You can use this to help stabilize your ph.

In respect to the filter media, you do not need to change it. Not unless its literally falling apart. One filter cartridge should last about 6+mths but the Aqueon cartrdiges are pretty flimsy. I would add some filter foam or filter floss in front of the filter cartrdige itself to increase its biological capacity. To clean them, just swish them around once a week in some old tank water from a water change. Thats it! Please ask if you have questions!

 

[alexsproul09]

What is ifs? I don't think we have one close. Petsmart has Aragonite but it says it is for African Chiclids...will that raise the ph too much?

After about a month my filter looks dirty (brown and I can see spots)... You're saying I should keep using it?? Will it keep cleaning the water when it gets saturated like this?

My goldfish has been sitting very still all day and BARELY moving. Barely even moving his mouth. I'm vey worried.

Again, you have been FANTASTIC!!

 

[jlk]

'Lfs' is local fish store or live fish store, depending on who you ask!

Yes, the aragonite thats used for cichlids is perfectly fine! Your not going to dump a whole bag in but simply start with a small amount (1tbsp) in your filter housing in a mesh bag/piece of clean pantyhose. If this doesnt prove sufficient, then you can mix some into your substrate.

Your filter media is supposed to look all brown and gross- this is your good bacteria growing. Swishing it once a week is just removing particle debris. Basically, your good bacteria are responsible for keeping your ammonia and nitrite out of your tank (they convert them to nitrate)- no need for bottled supplements or detoxifiers. Water changes keep nitrates under control. Amquel plus is a great water conditioner (also dechlorinates) but its affects are only temporary as in around 24hrs. It doesnt help though with slime coat or heavy metals and should be used in conjunction with Nova Aqua. Or switch to Prime.

I hope he pulls through- I will keep my fingers crossed for you!

 

[alexsproul09]

THANK YOU for all your advice and help... I truly do appreciate it. Unfortunately, my little buddy did not pull through

I did replace him a few days later though. Instead of going the goldfish route I got 5 tropical fish (tetras).

My ammonia in the tank went from 0 (when my goldfish died) to 4.0ppm a week after the new fish were in the tank. WHATS UP with that? I did add some chemical b.c it was so high. My Nitrite was 0. Nitrate was 40-80 (too hard to tell). The chemical will remove nitrite,nitrate and ammonia. I will do a 25% water change tomorrow, as well.

Any advice would greatly be appreciated. Again, thank you!

P.S. the fish look completely healthy!!

 

[jlk]

I am sorry to hear about your guy

In respect to the ammonia levels, most products that detox ammonia only work up to 1 or 2ppm. This is a very temporary effect. You honestly need to start doing larger, more frequent water changes to bring your ammonia level down to .25ppm or less. The wcs will also bring your nitrate level as well.

 

[alexsproul09]

How soon should I see the ammonia and nitrate levels lower?

 

[jlk]

Have some patience and stay on top of your testing and water changes as needed. It will settle down in time!

 

[jbimflyer]

I'm not sure of that brand of water conditioner you have been using, but I use stress coat and my fish do just fine in the water. I have 2 Goldfish and 5 panda cories. Sorry to hear about your goldie.