Help My Water Quality Improve

[DawgFish]

6 week old tank. 2 Blue Gouramis and 4 Danios seem to be doing fine, but 2 swordtails and a Cory cat died and 1 swordtail jumped out and died.

pH = 6, pH Up has not helped increase the level
Ammonia = 1 ppm
Nitrite = 0 ppm
Nirate = 0 ppm


I saw a spike in Ammonia and Nitrites 2 weeks ago and now it's what I listed above.


Partial, 15%, Water change didn't change any of the levels. One danio went missing and when I cleaned my canister filter I expected to find him in there thinking that was contributing to the ammonia level.


WHAT IS GOING ON?????

 

[BlaseMrNiceguy]

When your ph drops that low your beneficial bacteria can no longer process ammonia. You need to bring your ph up I suggest using crushed coral in for filter. It will help bring your ph up and buffer it naturally rather than haring the chemicals. Right now I suggest doing two back to back 50% water changes (a couple hours apart) to bring your ammonia down. This should also help bring up your ph unless your tap ph is that low. This will help you out until you get the crushed coral to help buffer.

 

[DawgFish]

I am interested in the natural alternative, however you are not the first to steer me away from chemical solutions. The pet store seems to always offer up the chemicals such as AmmoLock and pH Up? Do you mind sharing why you prefer the natural way?

Also, the pH of the water out of my tap was 7.6, what causes it to drop as it has done?

I really appreciate your guidance!

 

[tamtam]

I am interested in the natural alternative, however you are not the first to steer me away from chemical solutions. The pet store seems to always offer up the chemicals such as AmmoLock and pH Up? Do you mind sharing why you prefer the natural way?

Also, the pH of the water out of my tap was 7.6, what causes it to drop as it has done?

I really appreciate your guidance!

It's really about money, they offer these things because it makes them money. I prefer the natural way because usually it's more consistent. You can add PH up or down but it's only a temp solution and can cause fast changes in levels. This just causes more stress on your fish. The idea that PH should be at 7 is not really true. Fish will adjust to most PH it only becomes a problem when it is super low, like yours or super high. Or if you are keeping certain fish like Discus. Using crushed coral is more consistent. It sits in your filter and doesn't go away. All of your water passes through it so it's a constant thing. IT's also another surface for bacteria to grow. It's the same idea for the other ones that remove toxins. It doesn't remove them all, usually it just converts them temporarily. They make it seem like it's a substitute for water changes but it really isn't.

I'm not certain on the PH changes but i know it will change as it gases off. If you take a container of water and let it sit out for 24 and give it a stir a few times it will have a different PH than it will from your tap. I THINK it may also have something to do with the puffers/minerals in your water but I'm not certain on that.

IT does sound like your cycle crashed. Had your tank been cycled before hand? Showing any nitrates yet?

Any levels above .50 will need a larger water change. Like Blase said you want to do larger ones. I'd do a 50%, test your water after an hour and see where it stands. If it still as high levels do another and keep an eye on your PH until you can get some crushed coral.

 

[Jess1ca]

Also, the pH of the water out of my tap was 7.6, what causes it to drop as it has done?

I really appreciate your guidance!

Is there driftwood in this tank? It's known to alter ph.

 

[DawgFish]

Is there driftwood in this tank? It's known to alter ph.

That's good to know but I do not have any drift wood. I was about to look for a piece to add, but now that I know it can alter water quality, I will opt for a fake piece that will not make my job more challenging.

THANKS

 

[Jess1ca]

That's good to know but I do not have any drift wood. I was about to look for a piece to add, but now that I know it can alter water quality, I will opt for a fake piece that will not make my job more challenging.

THANKS

I would look into cc, I use it to keep a steady ph of 8.2 in my Mixed African tank, it does a fine job I just put about 2 cups in a media bag and stuffed it in my filters

 

[DawgFish]

It's really about money, they offer these things because it makes them money. I prefer the natural way because usually it's more consistent. You can add PH up or down but it's only a temp solution and can cause fast changes in levels. This just causes more stress on your fish. The idea that PH should be at 7 is not really true. Fish will adjust to most PH it only becomes a problem when it is super low, like yours or super high. Or if you are keeping certain fish like Discus. Using crushed coral is more consistent. It sits in your filter and doesn't go away. All of your water passes through it so it's a constant thing. IT's also another surface for bacteria to grow. It's the same idea for the other ones that remove toxins. It doesn't remove them all, usually it just converts them temporarily. They make it seem like it's a substitute for water changes but it really isn't.

I'm not certain on the PH changes but i know it will change as it gases off. If you take a container of water and let it sit out for 24 and give it a stir a few times it will have a different PH than it will from your tap. I THINK it may also have something to do with the puffers/minerals in your water but I'm not certain on that.

IT does sound like your cycle crashed. Had your tank been cycled before hand? Showing any nitrates yet?

Any levels above .50 will need a larger water change. Like Blase said you want to do larger ones. I'd do a 50%, test your water after an hour and see where it stands. If it still as high levels do another and keep an eye on your PH until you can get some crushed coral.

THANKS! I greatly appreciate the insight. will these large water changes affect the growth of the nitrifying bacteria? The pet store told me not to do a water change in the first 5 - 6 weeks.

 

[Jess1ca]

THANKS! I greatly appreciate the insight. will these large water changes affect the growth of the nitrifying bacteria? The pet store told me not to do a water change in the first 5 - 6 weeks.

Dang them pet stores :/ keep up on wc's. they don't have any effect on the cycle. Bb is in ur filter media. It doesn't really reside in the water column.

 

[BBradbury]

Your Tank Water

6 week old tank. 2 Blue Gouramis and 4 Danios seem to be doing fine, but 2 swordtails and a Cory cat died and 1 swordtail jumped out and died.

pH = 6, pH Up has not helped increase the level
Ammonia = 1 ppm
Nitrite = 0 ppm
Nirate = 0 ppm


I saw a spike in Ammonia and Nitrites 2 weeks ago and now it's what I listed above.


Partial, 15%, Water change didn't change any of the levels. One danio went missing and when I cleaned my canister filter I expected to find him in there thinking that was contributing to the ammonia level.


WHAT IS GOING ON?????

Hello D...

Small water changes will do little to keep a stable water chemistry. If you're not removing and replacing half the tank water every week, you're leaving toxins in the water. Even a trace of ammonia or nitrite is enough to damage a fish's gill tissues.

If you want to guarantee safe water conditions for your fish and plants too, large, weekly water changes are needed. I change half the water in my tanks every week and never test the chemistry. The reason is because if I change out so much water, so often, there's no time for toxins to build up before the next large water change. The water will always be pure.

Just a thought.

B

 

[DawgFish]

Hello D...

Small water changes will do little to keep a stable water chemistry. If you're not removing and replacing half the tank water every week, you're leaving toxins in the water. Even a trace of ammonia or nitrite is enough to damage a fish's gill tissues.

If you want to guarantee safe water conditions for your fish and plants too, large, weekly water changes are needed. I change half the water in my tanks every week and never test the chemistry. The reason is because if I change out so much water, so often, there's no time for toxins to build up before the next large water change. The water will always be pure.

Just a thought.

B

Thanks B. Do use tap water with conditioner?

 

[DawgFish]

Thanks B. Do use tap water with conditioner?

I order crushed coral which will arrive on Thursday. I will perform the 50% PWC's tomorrow. I will post my progress as I make progress!

 

[BBradbury]

Large, Frequent Water Changes

Thanks B. Do use tap water with conditioner?

Hello again D...

Yes. Just use a water treatment, like Seachem's Prime. It will remove the ammonia, chlorine and chloramines from the tap water and it will be safe for your fish. There's no need to age the water by letting it stand uncovered overnight. I still use the old "5 gallon bucket" method and treat the water as the bucket fills. Then, the new water can go directly into the tank.

B

 

[tamtam]

THANKS! I greatly appreciate the insight. will these large water changes affect the growth of the nitrifying bacteria? The pet store told me not to do a water change in the first 5 - 6 weeks.

No problem!

As mentioned it will do very little or nothing to effect your cycle. It's just a myth. The best bacteria sort of stick to surfaces, like your fitler media because it's so porous, and to a lesser extent your substrate and decor. There is just tiny amounts of good bacteria in your water column. Honestly the bigger risk with larger changes is shocking your fish with a temp change if you don't properly match the temp. There really is no such thing as too many water changes. It's a shame pet store workers don't understand this because it causes so many fish deaths.

 

[DawgFish]

2 50% water changes and Ammonia @ 2.0 ppm... WHAT? How can that be? pH remained at 6.0!!!!

Next Steps?

Crushed Coral should arrive tomorrow.

 

[Jess1ca]

2 50% water changes and Ammonia @ 2.0 ppm... WHAT? How can that be? pH remained at 6.0!!!!

Next Steps?

Crushed Coral should arrive tomorrow.

More wc's till ammo is at or (preferably) below .25

 

[tamtam]

2 50% water changes and Ammonia @ 2.0 ppm... WHAT? How can that be? pH remained at 6.0!!!!

Next Steps?

Crushed Coral should arrive tomorrow.

What was your ammo before that? Have you tested your tap for ammo as well? Some water sources have ammo already in them. That's very strange about the PH. After your test your water to be sure you are not adding more ammo in with the water changes all you can really do is keep doing them. 2ppm is pretty high and will take a fair amount of work to get it down. You can do a bigger change to like 75%

 

[DawgFish]

tamtam,

My ammo had risen to 2.0 and the dropped to 0. My Nitrite had risen to .5+ and then it dropped to 0. Nitrate rose to 5. I thought I had completed the cycle and added 2 Blue Gouramis and a Cory cat. The cat died but levels remained good.

I went on a fishing trip for 5 days and had back surgery the day after I got home. During this my wife and daughters fed the fish and no water tests were down. 2 weeks past and I tested the water everything looked good except for ammo which was at .25.

I went to the pet store with me girls, not planning on getting any fish but they talked me into it. 4 danios and 3 swordtails. I lost all 3 swordtails. Danios are fine. And this is when the numbers started Getting screwed up.

My tap water has 0 ammo and pH of 7.6.

To avoid losing anymore fish I added AmmoLock. The fish are lively and eating well. The water changes today didn't phase them. I will do a 75% tomorrow and see what happens. I checked on the crushed coral shipment and they quoted next week. The pet stores near me do not have any.

This is not making any sense.

 

[DawgFish]

Update: (if anyone is interested)

I crushed some shells that we called at the beach last year (which had already been cleaned) and out them in panty hose last night. Today my pH is up to 7.8 and holding steady. Hopefully the bacteria will like this and return to growth mode to assist with the lingering Ammo issue.

I did two more 50% PWCs and the Ammo level went from 2.0+ to 1.0. I am going to continue these changes until I obtain safe levels.


Thanks to everyone who provided guidance! It is very much appreciated and exactly why I joined AA. I look foward to helping others as I learn!


DawgFish

 

[tamtam]

Update: (if anyone is interested)

I crushed some shells that we called at the beach last year (which had already been cleaned) and out them in panty hose last night. Today my pH is up to 7.8 and holding steady. Hopefully the bacteria will like this and return to growth mode to assist with the lingering Ammo issue.

I did two more 50% PWCs and the Ammo level went from 2.0+ to 1.0. I am going to continue these changes until I obtain safe levels.


Thanks to everyone who provided guidance! It is very much appreciated and exactly why I joined AA. I look foward to helping others as I learn!


DawgFish

Sounds like things are improving. What water conditioner do you use? If you can get your hands on it try Seachem Prime. It will detox the ammonia for 24-48 hours which may help you out while you battle with water changes. It not only detoxis ammo and nitrite and condition your water but it also helps with your fishes slime coating. So it's a very useful product and does more than most other conditioners.

Did you fish in cycle your tank or fishless cycle it? If you did a fish in cycle any time you add more fish to your tank there will be an adjustment period to your cycle. You would experience rises in your levels like a mini cycle and need to do water changes as needed. This is because unlike a fish less cycle where you build up a solid bacteria growth to a high amount of ammo, like 3-4ppm usually, a fish in cycle only builds to handle your current bioload which is much less.

I also have issues when hubby gets his hands on the fish food. I mostly have banned him from fish care for this reason.