The Neverending Sick Guppy Saga

[Kilgore]

I swear, if I had known how much trouble these guppies would be... I consider myself to be a relatively advanced aquarist, but I have never been so stumped by a disease issue.

I have males, females, and fry less than one month old in three separate tanks (20, 20, and 10 gallons respectively). The males were clamping and flashing; lost two, treated with praziquantel, and they are cured. They still show signs of caudal fin damage, presumably from fighting - I can deal with finrot if it develops, so that is the least of my problems.

Fry show no symptoms.

Females showed same symptoms as males (clamping, flashing) but with considerably less damage to caudal fins. Treated with Praziquantel, no results by the end of the week. In meantime, about 40 fry were born, probably the least healthy batch I have had yet. About 30 survived. I guess I was overfeeding the fry because the ammonia spiked to 0.5 ppm. I did a major water change, added Prime, and it has been at 0 now for several days. Nitrite is zero.

There were three full-size adult females, the one I thought was healthiest was dead this morning. The sickest one has been hanging on for dear life. Go figure. The adult females have been hanging at surface, with dilated eyes, gaping red gills, heavy breathing, and loss of color. The smaller females seem not as bad, except for flashing and clamping. I am beginning to suspect gill flukes, but shouldn't the praziquantel have taken care of that?

I plan to remove the remaining 2 adult females and treat with Clout in the QT tank. Do I need to treat the main tank as well? Not sure if gill flukes are like ich in that the whole tank will be infested. If so, what should I use? It needs to be safe for invertebrates and fry. Dear God, please help me, before I chuck these tanks out the window!

 

[Devilishturtles]

Wow, I'm sorry to hear that you are still having problems with the guppies. Can I ask where you are getting them from? I assume it's a reputable store, and that none are dead in the tanks where you get them?

Praziquantel will kill ich, so that is out of the question. Praziquantel will not kill Flukes, they are resistant to the treatment. The only thing (through research on the topic a few months ago) that I've found is formalin/malachite green combination (which is sold as quick cure in stores) works best. It will also prevent any nasty secondary fungal infections from moving in. Read the precautions on the quick cure. I am not sure whether fry will be affected or not.

You can also try a salt bath. I believe 5 ounces of salt per 10 gallons is the treatment for flukes. Your fry should also fair well with this treatment.

If it were me, I'd go the malachite green/formalin route, simply because your fish seems far infected.

HTH, and sorry to hear about your recurring problems. I'm searching for the link where I found this info, but of course I don't name any of them when I bookmark them. I'll post it as soon as I can find it.

 

[Kilgore]

Hi Devilishturtles,

Thanks for the reply. I had ruled out ich because I never saw any white spots. Plus I tried salt and heat to no avail. I have actually tried a Quick Cure dip for the worst affected females, but I had not used it in the main tank since it is contra-indicated for my sweet little amano shrimpies. The dip (4x normal dose for 30 seconds) seemed to help. Anyway, I believe the adult females are more susceptable than the males due to the strain of childbirth - that would also explain why the younger females are not as bad off. Of course, I have always heard males were the weaker sex. Oops, male guppies, I mean.

I have not added any new guppies in a while but I have been having problems since day 10. I think whatever it is has infested the tanks and keeps reinfecting the fishes. The Clout worked on my adult females, but now that I have returned them to the "diseased" tank, they will probably get sick again.

Short of a complete tank break-down, I don't know what to do. I have considered removing all the females, cramming them into the 10-gallon, and treating them there with a strong medication like Clout. Shrimpies and snails would have to be moved to QT. Meanwhile, the 20 they were in could be left unoccupied for 4 days or whatever, and I could raise the heat very high, add salt, and maybe even run my Vortex diatom filter on it to try and kill free-swimming stages. I can then move the fishes back. I will probably have to re-cycle my 10-gallon thanks to the medication, but seeing as how it is the fry tank, and I may not be able to save my adult females, I probably won't need it for a while. I just don't want to kill off the filter bacteria on my 20 - it took a long time to cycle.

So what is a good temp and salt amount to shoot for to kill most protozoans/parasites, not kill the nitrifying bacteria, and how long should I leave it empty? Should I remove my plants? I will have to add food for the bacteria, I think. I know this is extreme, but I am tired of waking up and thinking, "Which guppy will be dead this morning?" Boo-hoo!

 

[Devilishturtles]

http://www.fishpalace.org/danscomments.html#Flukes

http://www.fishdoc.co.uk/disease/flukes.htm

Here are 2 links, the first one to the site I mentioned. It explains salt of 4 ounces of salt per 10 gallons.

I would remove the plants as well. Some are salt tolerant and some are not. Better safe than sorry.

Of course, I have always heard males were the weaker sex. Oops, male guppies, I mean. Smile

Amen.