URGENT help with Ich

[Princess1982]

I have an outbreak of white spot in both of my tanks at the moment and I am worried it isn't getting better. I suspect it was added by a new fish I bought for my smaller tank that started bullying another fish so I moved it to my other tank. Within a week both tanks had developed white spot but the suspected culprit doesn't have a single spot!

I have been treating for 5 days with King British WS3 but I am concerned that it isn't working. While the fish in the larger tank seem to have very few spots the fish in the smaller tank are infested and are clamping their fins and generally not looking happy. The instructions with WS3 is to add 1ml per 90 litres of water at 48hr intervals. After 5 treatments do a 10% water change. But after researching white spot it says to do frequent water changes and gravel vacs. I am sure the instructions on the pack are correct but I just want to be sure I am doing everything right as I will be devestated if I lose a fish! Does anyone have any experience with King British WS3?

I have also increased the water temp to 26 degrees and added extra aeration.

Tank 1 - 450 litres

Sailfin pleco, common goldfish, 2 x ranchu, red cap oranda, black moor

Tank 2 (Just a temp tankfor the girls as teh biys had been getting a bit fruity before the white spot outbreak) - 54 litres

White moor, ryukin, pom pom


Any help and advice much appreciated!

Thanks

[Mrs.h2012]

Since you've increased temp and added more aeration I dont think there's much more you can do... I have one fish with it trying to get it to go away.

[leggey]

you dont need meds for ich, just very slowly raise the temp to around 30 degrees and do daily water changes and it should go with in a week but i would keep the temp up for about 2 weeks

[jlk]

Hi Princess! I am sorry this hapened but its easily treatable. Do NOT increase the temps any further than 26c/78f- you will cook your goldies. Do you have aq salt? Start by doing big water changes on both tanks & Ill go through how to treat them with just salt.

[Princess1982]

I have just checked the water parameters and am horrified! The small tank was only set up 2 weeks ago as a new home for my ryukin as he has a deformed swimbladder. It was never meant to have the other 2 fish in it. I have added water and media from the cycled tank and the ammonia level was never more than 1ppm, nitrite at 0.25ppm and nitrate at 10ppm (how it comes out the tap). I have just checked the water now and ammonia is 2ppm, nitrite is 0.25ppm and nitrate at 40ppm! No wonder these fish aren't getting better!

I have just moved them all back into the fully cycled larger tank as it has adequate filtration and is their long term home. The stress of being moved in to a new smaller tank I am sure hasn't helped. It was only meant to be for a couple of days to seperate the girls from the boys and now this has happened :-( They are happier already and swimming around rather than bottom sitting. I feel terrible :-(

JLK - the problem is I can't get aquarium salt before the weekend. Is the WS3 no good at treating ich??

[jlk]

Ill be honest, I am not familiar with this product because its a UK product. What are the active ingredients? Ill go see if I can find any info on it.

Do you have a grocery store near you? Canning/pickling/Kosher/even some sea salts (usually organic) will work just fine. Just double check the ingredients to make sure the only one listed is 'NaCl'/ sodium chloride with nothing else.

[Mumma.of.two]

Do you have any salt in the house at all? Aquarium salt is just plain old rock salt (with no additives).

(Jlk beat me )

[jlk]

Lol, Mumma!

Princess, I found the product you have but could not find anywhere that lists what its ingredients are. Are they listed on the bottle by chance?

[Princess1982]

I have rock salt!! How much do I need?

The main ingredient in WS3 is malachite green (4% solution). It also contains acriflavine and quinine sulphate. I have added a link below

King British

[jlk]

I am honestly surprised this product didnt help. Quinine sulfate is the go to med when absolutely nothing else has worked. Malachite green however, is easily degraded especially if the tank is not kept dark.

For salt, you need a .3% salinity. If you have scale (most accurate way to measure), its 11.4grams per gallon. Without a scale, its 'approximately' 2.5 to 3tsps (or 1 tablespoon) per gallon. Predissolve it completely in a container of treated/conditioned water. Add the salt solution gradually over 48hrs. Do wcs every other to every day, depending on parameters. When you do a wc, only add back the salt you remove. Example, a 50% wc, add back 1/2 of the original dose predissolved in treated water along with the new water. Just be aware that your bb may not be too happy about the salt and you may see some spikes in toxins until they adjust. Maintain the salinity for one week after the last spot is gone then just dont add back salt with future wcs. Please ask if you have any questions!!

[Stevensmith21]

i just got done treating ich in my 55 tank i had to use meds and turn up the heat i also did daily water changes as well and it went away in about a week just keep up doing what your doing it should work

[Princess1982]

Well it's strange because the fish that stayed in the larger tank seem to have a lot less spots and don't seem to be really that phased at all. It is only the fish in the smaller tank that are really suffering and I am wondering if it is because of the non cycled tank. I kept the lights off in both tanks too as I read that this helps.

My other conern is my pleco, a lot of posts have said that they dont respond well to treatments and I don't want to do something that could upset him. He has been a bit fidgety recently too. Is that a reaction to the treatment or can they get white spot too? He is always hiding so I cant really check him for spots. Would he be better if I treated with salt?

JLK - would you advise adding the salt now even though I have done 3 treatments of WS3? Would the combination of salt/treatment be stressful or is it more likely to work?

I admit it - I am panicing! :-(

[jlk]

I forgot about the pleco! Ok, I would do a big wc on the small tank & put him in there. Dose the WS3 at half doses- malachite green can be toxic to scaleless fish & this is likely why he is acting strange. Or just simply treat him with heat (even better).

Do a big wc on the goldie tank, run new carbon for a few hours & treat them with salt. All 3 ingredients in this med can be used with salt so if there are still traces of them, it should be ok. You should see improvement in about 4-5days & it should be gone within 2wks.

[Princess1982]

Toxic to Plecos???? Argh this is just getting worse! I just did a 25% water change and only added water conditioner. Hopefully that diluted the treatment. I will do a 50% water change tomorrow.
Can I not do the salt treatment with the pleco in the tank? I have used salt in the tank with him in there before the last time I though I had Ich. Thankfully I was wrong last time. I just shut down the small tank (before I read your post) as there are no fish in it now. Is it really better to start it up again to put the pleco in there?

[Mumma.of.two]

Here's what I would do:

Set up the small tank and move the pleco. Treat him with heat only.

Treat all the Goldie's with the salt.

That way each kind of fish is getting the proper treatment.

[jlk]

I have to agree with Mumma. I dont keep plecs but the amount of salt needed to treat goldies I dont think he can handle and it will give him chemical burns because they are scaleless fish. I really would move him into the small tank.

[Princess1982]

OK just done a 50% water change on the small tank (handn't got round to removing the water fortunately) and only added water conditioner. Have turned the heater up to 28, is that sufficient?

Have moved the pleco - he is furious and will probably never speak to me again. :-( May sound like a strange thing to say about a fish but I'm telling you if he was human he would be Al Capone....

Will do exactly as you say JLK - I know you are the expert and have always guided me in the past.

Thank you all for your help and advice. You think you start to know about fishkeeping and then something new crops up and sends you in to a panic.... just the nature of the hobby I guess.

[Mumma.of.two]

You'll have to get the plecos tank up to at least 30C.

Here is an article detailing the method you need to use on the pleco.
http://www.aquahobby.com/articles/e_ich2.php

[Princess1982]

OK thanks Mumma. I will increase to 28 tonight then up to 30 when I get up in the morning. (it is now 11.30pm at night in the UK)
I will start the salt treatment with the goldies tomorrow.

Thanks again all.

[Princess1982]

Update: Well I have just woken up this morning to find a marked improvement in all of my fish except the ranchu which is the newest addition to the tank and the suspected culprit. But he has no white spots on his body at all and these should ne really easy to see as he is plain black. He is jus floating at the top of the tank, almost sideways but breathing, I can scoop him out into my hand without resistance - this does not look good.

I have no clove oil so I would nto be able to euthanize him now but should I not just leave him in case he gets better? Could he get better? I am wondering if he was just the carrier of the disease even though he has no symptoms and maybe it is now too far along to be treated.